Originally Posted By sjdimon OK - I don't want to start anything here. I am very excited about the WOC Show, and am looking forward to being able to see it later this summer. I just wonder - since there are NO live actors, no "props", no characters - will this lessen the popularity of this show, once the initial "thrill" has worn off? For me, one of the things about Fantasmic! (F!) that makes it so memorable, and so repeatable, is that live performance aspect - sure - the Water Projections are neat; but it's the great story about Mickey conquering evil and defeating all of those villains. It's about the Colombia with Peter Pan and Capt Hook; the Black and White "Steamboat Willie" with the cavalcade of characters on board. I think you know what I mean. The "effects" play a role in F!, but they are not "the story." I am just a little "worried" that WOC might be a really neat bunch of High-Tech-Toys, but will it have the "Heart" that has made F! so endearing to so many of us? And NO! I am NOT Dissing WOC before we have even had the chance to actually see it - I am just wondering....
Originally Posted By TempestsPrince "OK - I don't want to start anything here." - Says the person that started the topic. Heh. Your concern may not be that big of an issue in a place that has as many new visitors that come through as DCA/DLR does. That certainly does lower the staleness factor of a show or attraction. I mean, look at how long Star Tours ran with the original program. Admittedly it's not packing them in after more than 23 years, but I hear new riders almost every single time I ride now. (At least once per visit at the insistence of my 9 year old son.)
Originally Posted By sjdimon I hope not - I am just a little concerned because of the size and scope of the show - it will basically shut down all of Paradise Pier starting around 8/8:30 in the evening. An older attraction does not affect everything around it in the way that WOC will. And since there will be multiple showings every night - things won't come back up (like they do after the Fireworks or Fantasmic! has ended).
Originally Posted By dl1956 One thing that WOC has in its long term favor as compared to Fantasmic is, as I understand it, its ability to be changed or modified fairly easily, as for example the talk about the Alice segment being cut and shifted out to an "encore" position. Whereas Fantasmic, as I understand it, with its older control technology cannot have its basic storyline altered without affecting the entire show.
Originally Posted By sjdimon I do like that part of it too. Kind of like how they are able to add new "games" to Toy Story Mania without taking it down for a long rehab. I really want it to succeed, I am just a little nervous that it might be lacking something that will keep drawing in the crowds.
Originally Posted By trekkeruss IllumiNations. No live actors or characters and one prop (which IMO is too small and sometimes difficult to see.) Running for 10 years now. Still popular.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt How long is IllumiNations? I don't recall that show having any actors.
Originally Posted By FerretAfros Illuminations is about 10 minutes long. For what it's worth, they've also been doing fireworks for decades with only a cameo appearance by a single live performer. That said, I am also a little concerned about how well the show will last after repeated viewings. And how often they will actually update it...
Originally Posted By sjdimon I guess what it will come down to is, how good is the "story" behind WOC? I personally hope that it's really good, because I **AM** looking forward to it.
Originally Posted By Dabob2 I don't think it NECESSARILY needs a story with a 25-minute throughline. A series of shorter stories might work, punctuated with some sequences that are more abstract and just enjoyable on the pure color/water/light/total visual-combined-with-the-music level. Kind of like Fantasia (or certain sections, anyway). And kind of like Remember is a series of shorter "stories" (each of the lands, basically) that adds up to a satisfying whole. Even Fantasmic is more of a framework (Good Mickey vs. evil) than a story per se.
Originally Posted By DlandDug I don't know that this show needs to be compared to any other-- let alone Fantasmic.
Originally Posted By sjdimon << series of shorter stories might work>> Yes, yes! That is a really good point. There are a lot of ways that WOC will be able to work really well - and I guess we'll all know in a few weeks.
Originally Posted By Dabob2 <I don't know that this show needs to be compared to any other-- let alone Fantasmic.> I know what you're saying but it inevitably will be. And right here, too - count on it! I was just talking about the format, though, and the idea that one doesn't need a complete 25-minute-throughline "story" to be a successful show.
Originally Posted By gadzuux Yes - I'm looking forward to WOC. And yes - I'm a full fledged fan of F! That said, I too have some nagging concerns. Chiefly that 25 minutes is long - maybe too long. What would help this would be a storyline that runs through it, but I don't think there is one. Instead it appears to be a series of musical vignettes representing popular disney characters and songs. So then what is a "successful" show? Certainly the demand is going to be enormous at the outset, but what happens after the first few months when most people will have seen the show? Will people make it through to the end of the show - as they tend to do with F!? Or will they get impatient and decide that they've got the general idea and that they can leave because whatever they miss is just more of the same. That's the impression I get from the Bellagio fountains. While not directly comparable to WOC, it's pretty darn close - big dancing fountains choreographed to well known music. It's visually impressive, but not varied enough to hold a crowd for more than five minutes or so. Twenty five minutes is a long show. The audience for this show is often dog tired from a full day of theme park touring, and often have children with them that don't know the music and might not be able to see the show very well from where they stand. And if these people have invested time to see the show, they may well have been standing and waiting for anywhere from 30 to 60 minutes or more - before the show even begins. Again - these concerns don't apply to "me" personally - but then I'm a lifelong disney fan who already knows the films and the characters and the music, I love spectacles, and I'm also big and strong and capable of standing in place for an hour or more if need be, and I'm unusually tall so I can see just fine over the heads of crowds gathered in front of me. To head off future comments, I'm not trying to "judge" a show that no one has seen yet, simply expressing some concern that the length of this show might be a bit much for people who aren't dedicated disney fans.
Originally Posted By Hista98 Fantasmic is 25 minutes long as is braveseamo! both have done well over the years, given how similar braveseamo is to WoC.
Originally Posted By sjdimon Perfectly stated! I just don't want this to be nothing more that some pretty colored fountains synchronized to some familiar Disney music (heck - I used to like the "Dancing Waters" show at the Disneyland Hotel). But like you, I will watch it no matter what the reviews have been - and I am pretty sure that I will like it. I just hope that this is the consensus.
Originally Posted By Dabob2 Two things that will keep people in place: 1) the viewing area is packed very tight and that by itself will do it for most people. How many people left the hub during RDCT (a pretty long show)? Even if they wanted to, most won't even try. They have to allow emergency egress, but if the lanes are no larger than the hub, most will just wait. 2) I'm sure it will feature a whizbang finale of the sort you'll WANT to stick around for, even if there's a more dull stretch at, say, the 19 minute point.
Originally Posted By FerretAfros "Fantasmic is 25 minutes long as is braveseamo! both have done well over the years..." Fantasmic! is a little under 25 minutes, and it sound like WOC will be a little over that time. I'm not sure how long BraviSEAmo! is, but when I saw it in person, it seemed like it was about 15 minutes. However, it was a very long and painful 15 minutes. I think a lot of the problems that it has (too abstract, a lot of looking at the same thing for a long time, no clear story) will also be problems with WOC. If you head over to the Tokyo section of the boards, you can find old threads that talk about how BS! has had trouble over the years with popularity, and had major revisions just before opening (sound familiar?). While it works conceptually for me, that show failed to deliver. I fear that WOC may have a lot of the same problems. (And how is it that we managed to get this close to the WOC opening without comparing it to BraviSEAmo!? That seems so obvious now that I think about it. I guess it's another instance of the Tokyo parks getting ignored by American audiences-and the corporate folks too.)
Originally Posted By believe I too, am worried for the same reasons. Weren't they suppose to have some sort of water "character" in the show? That might substitute a "live" actor. <<<< (heck - I used to like the "Dancing Waters" show at the Disneyland Hotel). >>>> This is a good point. This was a long show too (18 minutes), and people still watched it and liked it. And it was 1000 times smaller than woc. Illuminations is different. Shorter show with fireworks. Sometimes shorter is better. Leave the audience wanting more (or an encore).
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt "I know what you're saying but it inevitably will be. And right here, too - count on it!" The show designers were comparing it to Fantasmic in one of the presentations I saw on line. "I just don't want this to be nothing more that some pretty colored fountains synchronized to some familiar Disney music" Anyone with those concerns has nothing to worry about. It's been firmly established that with the projections, fog, fire and other effects, this is NOT going to be just some pretty fountain show with lights.
