Originally Posted By Mr X There has been a lot of misinformation and assumptions going on about the state of things in and around Tokyo regarding the big earthquake. I wanted to start a topic to hopefully shed some light on the situation here. First and foremost, the fact that news reports tell you that Tokyo is "okay" is both true, but misleading if you are assuming that the city of Urayasu (home of the TDR resort) is "around Tokyo" and thus in okay shape. The City of Urayasu is NOT in good shape, there has been major damage and has been declared a disaster area. I can't say for certain the situation there right now because we moved last week, but as far as we know there are still major water issues, and structural concerns, and other major problems in the city. Many residents are still in a state of significant hardship. I can say from my own experience that I saw matters from the weirdest "reverse" angle when I left Urayasu for Tokyo 2 days after the quake only to find Tokyo "in good shape" (just as the news reported). Please do NOT make the mistake of assuming that just because Urayasu is on the border of Tokyo that things there are in the same condition, they are NOT. The situation is very bizarre, to say the least, because naturally attention has been focused on the hardest hit tsunami regions up North, and of course the nuclear thing grabs headlines, but the FACT is that the city of Urayasu was very hard hit and many residents are still suffering. So please keep this in mind when commenting on the state of the Disney parks or whatever. Maihama was hit hard too, but the parks were luckily (relatively) unscathed, but it's important to understand that the entire city is under disaster conditions when speculating about why the amusement parks aren't opened up yet (like Universal Studios in Osaka was). Think of it this way, if a disaster had DIRECTLY hit Anaheim, or Hong Kong, would you assume the parks should re-open quickly? That's the situation in Urayasu, Chiba, Japan right now so it's something you need to understand. News reports about Tokyo do NOT reflect what's going on in Urayasu, even though it's very close to Tokyo. Even now, news reports are starting to reflect that fact (Urayasu did get pretty much ignored by the mainstream media, and understandably so, but the situation is far from okay for Urayasu and her residents right now, even now as far as I know). I will be back in Urayasu day after tomorrow, and if I see or hear anything more I'll chime back in. But in the meantime, I want everyone to understand the situation more clearly as there seems to be tons of misinformation and assumptions going around right now.
Originally Posted By mawnck >>Think of it this way, if a disaster had DIRECTLY hit Anaheim, or Hong Kong, would you assume the parks should re-open quickly?<< That IS kind of what we're talking about here, isn't it. "Why shouldn't Disneyland reopen? CNN says things in Los Angeles are just peachy!" (Substitute Walt Disney World/Orlando if you're on the other side of the USA.)
Originally Posted By Mr X ***That IS kind of what we're talking about here, isn't it. "Why shouldn't Disneyland reopen? CNN says things in Los Angeles are just peachy!" (Substitute Walt Disney World/Orlando if you're on the other side of the USA.)*** EXACTLY! I can understand the confusion though. It IS right on the border of Tokyo and seems like it's "in Tokyo" for all intents and purposes, but in this particular case it's very much night and day (much to the surprise of many of my Tokyo friends, in fact!). Like I said, when I left Urayasu for the first time two days after the quake (looking at empty stores, and watching people drag water to their homes, and well aware of the significant damage in the city), I was so shocked to find Tokyo in quite a bit better shape. And the folks I met with were equally surprised when I asked them "do you have water? do you have gas? how are your food supplies?". They were taken aback, and asked me why I was asking lol. Then, when I explained how different things were in Urayasu, they grew concerned and understood the situation better. It really is amazing the huge difference in what amounts to a 10 minute subway ride away..the last I saw of Urayasu that Sunday was an empty vending machine on a dark train platform, and when I got off the train in Tokyo I was literally SHOCKED to see stores in full operation and a team of coca-cola vending machine workers happily restocking a machine.....it was truly bizarre and I wonder if many Urayasu residents felt the same as they stripped the stores to the bone, all they needed to do was pay $1.50 and board a train to get their supplies! This is just an informational topic, I'm fine and we were VERY lucky (we only lost water for a couple of days, our neighbors are still struggling even now!), but I wanted to clear up some misconceptions about what's going on here in any case. Too many topics have devolved into strange misperceptions and assumptions based on mainstream news about "the greater Tokyo area", and how that's a misperception in this case. That, coupled with the fact that Japan is a VERY compact sort of country. Chiba is actually a very different place than Tokyo, and to the Japanese it is as "far away" from Tokyo as NYC is from, say, Ohio as far as emergencies are concerned.
Originally Posted By DlandDug Since this is for information, may I ask a few questions? Some of these may be very elementary, so please be kind! I have always understood that Tokyo Bay is ringed with reclaimed land that is used mostly for light industrial sites. Is that true? Do a lot of people live in these areas? Or are they pretty much filled daily with workers who commute? Is there anything comparable to Tokyo Disneyland on any other of these landfills (entertainment/sport/shopping centers)? In the diagram at the end of this link it shows areas of major damage due to liquefaction: <a href="http://www.asiaone.com/News/Latest+News/Asia/Story/A1Story20110325-270180.html" target="_blank">http://www.asiaone.com/News/La...180.html</a> Tokyo Disneyland is located in the area below the Maihama Station, right? Interesting that it is shown with only two small areas of damage (one of which corresponds precisely with their main surface parking lot). Is this due to better landfill, or higher building standards in the TDR? (I would assume that most warehousing and surface lots were badly damaged.) Thanks for any enlightenment you can offer.
Originally Posted By gurgitoy2 I was also going to ask you, Mr X., if you think the damage in Urayasu is because of it being built on landfill? I know that was most likely the cause of liquification. Is Urayasu unique in Japan, or are there other cities built on reclaimed land?
Originally Posted By Mr X Dug, you are pretty much spot on. I'm not exactly sure which areas are landfill and which are not, and why some were hit harder than others. The Shin-Urayasu area was particularly hard hit and that's a very upscale area with tons of high rise condos (Disney's foreign cast is also housed in that area). I'm not entirely sure about the state of the loading dock areas, there are lots of them too around the bay (including between Shin-Urayasu and Maihama). Regarding shopping centers etc., there's another big one known as Kahin Makkuhari with several hotels and many shopping centers and most importantly, Tony Roma's and Outback. For some reason, that area escaped any major damage as far as I've been told (I'm going there tonight so I'll eyeball the place). I have no idea why some places were much worse than others, but I can only assume varying degrees of building standards played a part (seems like Shin-Ura was built on the cheap for such an upscale place...but then again, quakes can be so random in the damage they cause right?). Gurgi, most definitely the landfill areas of Urayasu were hardest hit. There's a definite "line" traveling from the center of town towards the bay where everything goes from "fine" to "wrecked", and the damage there is all over the place. Clearly the effects of liquefaction. Hope that makes sense!
Originally Posted By Mr X As to the TDR question, I'm no expert but seeing as the parking areas along with the surrounding roads and the station proper got whammed while the parks are pristine (except for Thunder Mountain which had some rock damage), I can only imagine that when they built the place they demanded certain things within their most important assets, and the surroundings were built under, I would suppose, the same standards used in the Shin-Urayasu area nearby.
Originally Posted By Mr X Interesting the way you described the bay area Dug, as it's a place I'm intimately familiar with yet never really gave it much thought. You can actually tour the place by train, as the Keiyo line rides right around it out from Tokyo. And for the most part, it is rather unsightly industrial warehouses (the Amazon.com building is obvious), and ports. But then there are many little enclaves built in, shopping centers and "bed towns" as the Japanese say, along with a few very upscale zones like Shin-Urayasu and Makkuhari Bay Town with luxury apartments and condos (for the bay view, I suppose), and of course a Disney Resort as well. A pretty bizarre little stretch of real estate. In any case, someone somewhere along the line really screwed over the city of Urayasu when the contracts were drawn up, as the damage there isn't apparent on such a large scale elsewhere around the bay that I've seen or heard about.
Originally Posted By Mr X ***Tokyo Disneyland is located in the area below the Maihama Station, right? Interesting that it is shown with only two small areas of damage (one of which corresponds precisely with their main surface parking lot). Is this due to better landfill, or higher building standards in the TDR? (I would assume that most warehousing and surface lots were badly damaged.*** Good eye. And yeah, wow. That certainly is interesting given the amount of liquefaction that occurred pretty much everywhere else! It's got to be a building standards thing, right? The other sizable patch of "unaffected" area, by the way, MIGHT be (I'm not 100% sure) the Makuhari area which is the only other place on the same scale as TDR as far as interested parties are concerned (luxury hotels, convention center, a major league baseball stadium etc). So I'm imagining that the investors in both cases decided it wasn't worth cutting any corners given the value of these assets. Just a guess.
Originally Posted By DlandDug >>It's got to be a building standards thing, right?<< That appears to be the case. The link provided in another thread explains just how the OLC made the difference: >>Countermeasures for Liquefaction at Tokyo Disneyland and Tokyo DisneySea No soil liquefaction occurred outside of the affected parking lot area. Measures against liquefaction were built in at the time of the construction of the parks. Soil stabilzation by sand compaction piling was done to a depth of 10-15 meters for the entire grounds of the Parks. Soil is densified by making the pillars of sand that are tightened and hardened in regular intervals underground. Higher underground density minimizes liquefaction.<< <a href="http://www.jtcent.com/extras/news/news_110328.html" target="_blank">http://www.jtcent.com/extras/n...328.html</a>
Originally Posted By Mr X Update on the Makuhari area, was just there tonight and there's some damage all around to be sure (dare I say "major damage"?). I don't know how much was liquification vs "regular" quake damage, but there were tons of ripped up walkways and sidewalks and several stores had barriers on some of their doors to prevent people from trying to enter over piled up bricks or whatever (many doorways WERE accessible though iffy, and people just made their way carefully...in America, I'd bet all those places would be off-limits due to fear of lawsuits! Nothing like what I saw in Shin-Urayasu, but significant nonetheless.
Originally Posted By Roger55 As stated, parts of Urayasu are heavily damaged. That is why in the begining they got an exemption from the rolling blackouts. As of this weekend, there are people I know that still do not have water and/or electricity. Food and water are scarce in the stores in Urayasu and even in parts of Tokyo. Someone I know living in Urayasu close to Maihama however, sustained no major damage. In fact they are providing assistance to acquaitences in damaged parts of Urayasu. Things like letting them come over to use the bathroom, do laundry, etc. Even the rolling blackouts have been lifted in their area for the weekends. So it can't be accurately stated that all of Urayasu/Maihama sustained significant damage. Seeing it was a 9.0 magnitude and the 5th largest quake in recorded history, it doesn't surprise me that there is a lot of damage. What I am surprised at is that there wasn't MORE damage. Seeing the videos of the shaking all the way in Kanto leaves me amazed that there weren't large amounts of buildings collapsed. I hope even more is learned about earthquake safe building standards. I can't imagine CA if a quake close to the size of the Tohoku Pacific quake were to hit here.
Originally Posted By Mr X ***So it can't be accurately stated that all of Urayasu/Maihama sustained significant damage*** I don't think anyone has claimed that. I think part of the confusion is over the fact that the city obtained a declaration of disaster (which is actually a technical term used to obtain emergency resources such as the armed forces who were in town helping fix up the place). Not every street in New Orleans flooded, either. But it's the overall situation that deems a place "disaster stricken" or not...in Urayasu, surely the water crisis had a lot to do with it. ***Even the rolling blackouts have been lifted in their area for the weekends*** Info is hard to come by, do you have a link to any info? It was my understanding that blackouts would be unnecessary on the weekends anyway (everywhere) because of the lesser demand. But that's just something I heard, it seems to change every day...luckily, between Urayasu and Chiba city we've only had 2 blackouts ourselves (we were told to expect them daily).
Originally Posted By Roger55 >>Info is hard to come by, do you have a link to any info? It was my understanding that blackouts would be unnecessary on the weekends anyway (everywhere) because of the lesser demand.<< No link. Just straight from my friend that lives there.
Originally Posted By Mr X Right. Well, the blackout situation has been confusing and it SEEMS as though they're more on top of the energy crisis than feared. For example, there was one scheduled for Urayasu yesterday that was cancelled and one earlier in the week where I live which was also cancelled (even though the loudspeaker was cautioning everyone to prepare for it all day long). A weird, weird situation to say the least (but hey, planned but cancelled is a lot better than unplanned and unpredictable!).
Originally Posted By rward2121 How can I get in touch with my friend in Urayasu City, Chiba? I have not heard from her since immediatly after the earthquake but before the tsunami.
Originally Posted By Mr X Urayasu City experienced no tsumani. And I'm pretty sure nobody died in Urayasu. So, your friend is probably okay if he or she was in the city of Urayasu during that day (perhaps she lost power though, Urayasu has had some troubles to say the least!). If you can offer a few more details, I might be able to help locate your friend. Best of luck rward, I'm sure you must be worried!
Originally Posted By Mr X If I can be of any help in locating your friend, I'm standing by. jammindave@hotmail.com is an easy way to reach my besides laughingplace. And I was just in Urayasu today, and I can stop by tomorrow and check in with the local authorities if you think your friend may still be missing. Feel free to write here, or to my email. I'll do whatever I can to help you find your friend. (again, don't worry about tsunami damage in Urayasu, that was way up north, but you might have lost contact due to power outages or something)
Originally Posted By Roger55 I agree that your friend is most likely okay. I know there are quite a few people that sustained damage or dealing with the power and water problems have chosen to temporarily re-locate out of the Kanto area if that option was available to them.
