Originally Posted By Rebekah This topic is for discussion of the 8/13/2001 news item <b><a href="http://orlandosentinel.com/business/tourism/orl-asec-parks081201.story" target="_blank">OrSen: For theme parks, bigger isn't better these days</a></b> The August 12th <I>Orlando Sentinel</I> examines the softening economy's impact on tourism in Orlando and Los Angeles.
Originally Posted By TDLFAN >>bigger isn't better<< Sounds familiar?? i have been saying that about WDW for months and always being clobbered for it. And no, i am not jaded just because i live 12 minutes away from WDW (right dennis-in-ct??)
Originally Posted By OrlandoBoi If you like driving around a lot and looking at the gates of about twenty five "guest only" resorts while seeing "closed for rehab" signs on two out of three water parks and rubbing shoulders with hundreds of sex starved barely post pubescent young men and women at PI then you MAY think WDW is better. The MK is a plastic version of DL, Epcot is a fading glory, MGM has WAY TOO MANY live shows and only DAK is beautiful in its theming on an almost TDS level.
Originally Posted By dennis-in-ct Jaded = dulled by surfeit (an overabundant supply) or excess ... so YES, you are so used to WDW you fail to see it's wondrous beauty! WDW is as special to you as my local Supermarket down the street is to me. After working there and living so close, how could you NOT be dulled. So many people *gasp* at the beauty of WDW. Travels come from all all the WORLD to see this place. How can you go to Typhoon Lagoon and not feel like you are in some other world. Sit in Harambee Village in Animal Kingdom and not shake your head over how WELL DONE this place is... dine in EPCOT... ToT in MGM... all GREAT STUFF! I will always remember the feeling I had waiting for the boat to MK on the Wilderness Lodge dock. Just staying in the Animal Kingdom lodge is enough to make you ga-ga. WDW is FANTASTIC! and like any majorly developed area, the bigger it get the harder it is to control the quality - but the physical existence of WDW cannot be matched - EVER. And you appear to have forgotten that due to your unrelenting JADED attitude. All you jaded locals need a good spanking you spoiled little brats! I will be down shortly to spank you ALL! (I see some bizarre Monty Python routine) LOL! Of course I will be on my knees begging forgiveness once I finally see TDR for myself - but until then, I plan on giving you are hard time : ) All in good fun of course.
Originally Posted By dennis-in-ct <MGM has WAY TOO MANY live shows> WHAT?! *gasp* - you are complaining about the over abundance of entertainment?!! *sigh* now I have to schedule spankings in Australia <and only DAK is beautiful in its theming on an almost TDS level.> Ok, now you have redeemed yourself ... for NOW!
Originally Posted By OrlandoBoi I.... That is..... I mean..... nevermind. *goes to bed with naughty thoughts* signed, The Tokyo temptress ; )
Originally Posted By Disneybrad I'm a local, And usually fine I am one of the very few, that hasn't gotten jaded. And try my very best to keep it that way.
Originally Posted By dennis-in-ct GREAT for you Disneybrad! I am glad ... now, give WDWJADED .. I mean TDLFAN a good talking to ; )
Originally Posted By Disneybrad No mater how much some people either try and deny it or justify it. It just can't be done. Just look at what they say, they have an attitude and I don't think anything can be done to change that attitude at this point. Most of them are looking for WDW to return to some sort of Golden age that only existed within their own minds, because they were either to naive or Un-jaded enough to notice.
Originally Posted By bwanabob Disneybrad...you really are a half-empty kind of guy aren't you? Don't you think anything in WDW was better 10 years ago? I think some things have improved, while others have declined. Just curious...
Originally Posted By Disneybrad No a half-empty kind of guy would be the pessimist that truly believe that everything was better 10 years ago, and nothing today comes close. I am a realist who believes that some things were better 10 years ago; I also believe some things are better today. Just like anyone who listens to their grandparents talk about how great the good old days were, don’t remember the bad and only remember the good. People tend to look at the past with fond memories and rose colored glasses, very few people look at the past and remember how things were, they remember them as how they wished them to be.
Originally Posted By bwanabob Disneybrad--I agree with most of what you're saying...I really do. I just wanted you to explain what you were saying a little more...so you weren't painting everyone with the same brush with the generalizations that you made in previous posts. Just because someone believes that some things were great (and better than today) in the "good ol' days" doesn't mean that person believes nothing is good today. For example, when I say I loved Horizons and wish Disney hadn't removed it, that doesn't mean I'm not looking forward to Mission: Space. When I say maintenance levels have gone down in the parks and that distresses me, that doesn't mean that I don't still enjoy park rides and attractions. I hope this makes sense...I just wanted you to explain a bit more what you had said previously. Thanks.
Originally Posted By Disneybrad I will miss Horizons as well, I am looking forward to Mission Space as well. But on those occasions when I would ride Horizons right before it closed, and I would get comments from the CM's, noting how I was the 1st person they had seen in a while, it was disheartening. When other guest were ignoring such a good ride. Same as now in the summer Test Track will have a 2 hour standby time, while at the same time shows of UOE go out 3/4 empty, and Cranium Command runs playing to no-one. But when it comes to things like maintenance and such, it is a problem that comes from multiple sources. It isn't just budget cuts as some would like to believe, though that is part of the problem. It is also that there is so much more to have to fix. It was much easier keeping things freshly painted and light bulbs replaced when there was just the Magic Kingdom and 2 hotels. Growth is part of the problem, yet how many people would want to get rid of everything built in the last 15 years. Also with age come problems. People need to remember that the Magic Kingdom now 30 years old, and Epcot is going on 20. It takes more to keep up something older, than it does something new. If you’ve ever owned an old car, they take much more maintainence and cost more to keep running than a new one. Couple that with the fact that there is just so much more to work on, things get stretched thin. So everyone will say just increase the budget and hire more people to do the work. And then at the same time complain when they do not offer enough discounts and threaten not to go if they don’t get a AP discount on a room. So just like a people do with airlines, they all want first class service, but only want to pay a couch fare.
Originally Posted By TDLFAN Dennis, sweetheart, after all this time i thought you knew what i was talking about. In reference to your post #5, read this carefully: I AGREE WITH YOU 100%. I LOVE THE BEAUTY OF WDW's NATURAL GREENERY. Likewise i love AK's lush landscapping, i love many areas such as Typhoon Lagoon and Blizzard Beach, i love looking north from the end of Main Street and seeing beautiful Cinderella Castle, i love walking on World Showcase, i love the 7 Seas lagoon and most of the resorts' beautiful victorian, polynesian, or lodge style architecture, i love hanging out at the village pin trading or listening to the new cd's at Virgin. THERE ARE MANY ASPECTS AT WDW THAT I CONSIDER SECOND TO NONE. Otherwise i wouldn't dump $400 on my premium AP yearly. However, my negative views are directed towards a certain lack of cleanliness, classic attractions that need refurbishing and upgrading, several CM's who display a disdain for their duties or lack a certain finesse when dealing with guests, and also the behavior of some fellow guests (even YOU mentioned this to me when we met, remember your "i have noticed a whole lot more @#$%^&*! guests in the park this time around" comment?) Again i have no problem with WDW many attributes that i can still find quite enjoyable, but certain internal matters do bring up a lot of frustration to me. Likewise, TDR excells in these areas (cleanliness, CM's, order, etc..) but i am affraid that the location it sits in Urayasu is the most unsightly of all of the Disney parks. I would even take Katella Ave anytime over Urayasu's dumpy looking port warehouse by Tokyo Bay, next to TDR; and as ugly as the JR train track and station is in relation to TDR, it is a necessary and convenient evil i have learned to ignore when i am there. I guess the most basic way for me to put is: i value an excelent "within park" experience, which i get consistently at TDR but not at WDW; versus getting an outstanding property-wide atmospheric resort experience at WDW, which lacks sorely around TDR perimeter. So can you see why i fail to see why you consider me "jaded"? Now Dennis, i just know you won't enjoy TDR when you finally visit there because it won't offer you the expansiveness WDW has that you justly rave about. However, my impression of you was of one who would enjoy a good show or parade and appreciate park atmosphere, and if i am correct, then you will just love TDR for those 2 reasons, with the added bonus of extreme park cleanliness and efficient CM teamwork. >>MGM has WAY TOO MANY live shows<< So does TDR: 7 at TDS, and 8 currently playing at TDL versus 3 at MK. >>and only DAK is beautiful in its theming on an almost TDS level.<< Well.. i dunno about that. IMO, DAK is only comparable to the Lost River Delta port of TDS. I can not bring myself to compare a beautiful lush jungle setting (DAK) with the beautiful Mediterranean harbor, or the fantasyland look of Mermaid Lagoon. But i guess both of these parks achieved the look the imagineers set out to achieve, and that's good enough for me as i love both DAK and TDS. About those spankings...BRING IT ON!
Originally Posted By TDLFAN Disneybrad, you said "some thing are better now (at WDW) than they were 10 years ago". I'd love to know what you consider better right now. For me, DAK is one, Fantasmic! is another (among a few other aspects), but things like the unsightly tacky-wacky Pop resort, are major blunders that are directed towards the "first class service for the price of couch" type of guest. I do agree with you in certain areas, as you pointed out that WDW's growth has been a problem in keeping things clean and in perfect order. I have been saying that all along. I disagree though that the age of the park is something to consider when commenting on quality. TDL is only 6 months younger to EPCOT, yet TDL remains very fresh, brand new looking because OLC do cares to continually refurbish and revise it with new things. One of my biggest fears at TDR is that now with the addition of TDS, IKSPIARI, and the 2 Disney hotels, quality may start taking a nose dive. Let's hope not, because that quality look is IMO the biggest virtue of this resort. Whereas at WDW, is all about value, savings, small budgets and yes, not enough CM's to get the job done, why?, because of growth as you put it. TDR is not a value resort, everything cost lots of money there, food, hotels, merchandise and such, but people pay it because they love the quality of the product they put out. I could show you my credit card statement so you can see how much money i dump into TDR, almost 400% more $$ than i care to shell out at WDW. But like you say, "value' is the only way in America. Thank you customer unfriendly Wal-Mart for value-training the minds of America's consumers.
Originally Posted By dennis-in-ct LOL! But I was having so much fun giving you a hard time ; ) ... all right, I will back off on the "jaded" comment. I understand where you are coming from ... I guess. I imagine TDR is like America in the 50's - and I would love to be amongst a culture that isn't so "buy me, give me, get me" and more appreciative and respectful of each other. I can't wait to see TDR and will have no problem doing a "park for park" comparison. I love Disneyland Paris' Magic Kingdom much better that Florida's but that is not to say Paris as a vacation resort is better - Paris has a better park. So, I get you ... And I will love the Tokyo parks for the design and "show" and for all the reasons I love the Disney theme parks in the first place. <About those spankings...BRING IT ON!> lol! boo-ya
Originally Posted By TDLFAN But wait a second there dennis... I am JADED, about TDR that is. No matter what anyones says, in my mind, i still believes it is the best OVERALL theme park experience. See?? so i need to be spanked. Please.
Originally Posted By BuzzLightyear84 Walt Disney World is a wonderful resort destination with some of the best theme parks in the world. Now, I've never been to Tokyo Disneyland, but if it's anything like the way it's been described, it sound like an amazing place as well. However, I wouldn't want to go all the way to Japan and spend the whole time comparing and contrasting the two resorts. I would rather just sit back, relax, and enjoy the place. I think that sometimes major Disney fans like us try to amylize everything instead of what we should be doing: enjoying each experience on its own merits. So, is bigger actually better? I don't know, but I'd rather just enjoy myself rather than trying to figure it out.
