Originally Posted By ssWEDguy I know there a lot of LPers out there who have expressed concern over Epcot's Mission Space, about how it is overly "thrill" oriented, and how it doesn't allow the true "all family" experience that Walt had in mind for his parks. This may be true. However, I've been working outside the Magic Kingdom's classic Haunted Mansion for several weeks now. The Haunted Mansion is an original Disney attraction, was designed while Walt was around, and started out in the original Disneyland. About every 10 family with kids that comes out have some of the kids crying up a storm. They're scared about some of what they saw inside. They were too young for it or weren't prepared enough for it. So they're not having a good time. Maybe the parents should have known better -- maybe not. But my question is this -- why is this HM effect on some family member different from the fact that "not all family members" should ride Mission Space? The main difference I see is that one is more physical than the other. But both work on the cerebral. This same argument applies to Pirates, by the way. What am I missing?
Originally Posted By vbdad55 It is just that -- there are no physical force concerns on HM. For people with heart problems - blood pressure problems - even blood sugar problems -- the physical forces exerted by MS can be a concern. There is no such thing on HM ! Do you see any adults coming off HM crying ? Yet check out how many adults you see sitting on benches - etc outsid Mission Space to get their equilibrium ( at best) back. So the comparison you have here is really apples to oranges. The cerebral that is being 'worked on' is not there for adults on HM - or at least shouldn't be. I haven't seen too many 5 foot orange spiders in my lifetime. To me the cerebral part on MS is minimal....and for little kids- no different than Rocket to Mars was originally ( we're going into space ! ) - the special effects are updated but so are the special effects the kids are exposed to every day.
Originally Posted By ssWEDguy Your points are correct, but I have to disagree with your conclusions on several points. Are you suggesting that "people with heart problems - blood pressure problems - even blood sugar problems" CAN'T be affected negatively by a Haunted Mansion experience, just because there are no physical forces involved? Isn't it possible for persons with health problems to be affected just be being scared badly? Also -- Mission Space is both physical AND extremely cerebral. The preshow and the screen straight in front of you showing what is happening in coordination with the G-forces is extremely important. Your eyes and mind are (supposed to be) saying "I'm accelerating forward in a straight line!" and not thinking "I'm spinning!" For some they sense the spin anyway. In Haunted Mansion there are no physical forces, but the mind is still causing fear (for some). For some it can be EXTREMELY fearful. Usually the very young, the unprepared, etc. So -- Mission Space can cause physical distress in some adults, and some kids. Possibly some mental distress too, if they really believe they are going into space. The Haunted mansion can cause mental (but not physical) distress, usually in kids, not adults. But BOTH represent an attraction that makes it difficult for ALL members of the family to enjoy EVERY time. I'm not saying either the Haunted Mansion or Mission Space are bad. I enjoy them both, and believe they both are extraordinary experiences. I AM suggesting that people who complain about MS's distinctions because "It's not what Walt would have wanted" as a family experience are overlooking a similar distinction in an attraction that Walt helped design. Not all members of all families will ride HM. Some sit it out, out front while others ride. Pirates is similar in effect to HM, except that the characters involved are so far outside our day-to-day life experiences that they are less threatening overall. Yes, the skeletons are scarey, but the pirates are clearly "not real" (anymore) to just about everyone. PS. This is the same reason why I think the violence in a movie like Starwars is less distressing to watch than the violence that is present in Indiana Jones. Starwars is in a foreign environment -- space -- and in a place "Long, long ago and far, far away." Whereas Indiana Jones is about a time just 50 years ago, with trucks, guns, planes, and forms of violence that we all recognize on a daily basis. It's much closer to home. The image of the truck in Indiana Jones 1 bouncing over the body of the Nazi in the roadway is much more gut wrenching and close to home than say, the image of Darth Vader slicing off Luke's hand with a light sabre. Jeez -- too much thinking today. Enough of this for now. I think I'll go get a Twinkie.
Originally Posted By Kimrue You know what it is? Some parents are so worried about being "super parents" that they shelter their kids TOO much. I've said to family members that I do expose my children to some "scary-ish" material as I see fit. My kids have been permitted to watch one christmas special a night during the season, but have you watched lately? Between the bumble, jack frost, heat/snow miser, and they portrayal of santa in Rudolf, it is a bit questionable. But classics just the same. Most parents I know have not allowed their children to watch these shows because they are "too scary." Give me a break! Than you expect to take them to WDW and have them love the haunted mansion and pirates. Parents today are over protective. When my daughter comes to me and says something on TV is "scary" I always tell her it's not real, stop it or I'll turn it off. And she stops! I think it's important to let children see age appropriate "scary" media in order to somewhat desensitize them. Sometimes life is scary and it's not all roses and sunshine. This is why kids spaz out about the slightest things. We once had to leave a restaurant during halloween because there was a smiley face paper cartoon ghost hanging from the ceiling and my 5 year old nephew was petrified, screaming and crying. Pathetic! I'm not saying to sit your 3 year old in front of the exorcist or anything, but if you're turning off frosty the snowman because jack frost is "scary" get ready for a spazfest when the kid gets older and you want to take them on rides. As for mission:space, that's a totally different story. I've never been on, nor would I allow my children to ride because it seems like it may be mentally too intense as well as physically. I've seen commercials and it seems like they are trying to simulate a "real" take off which could be mind boggling to a child. Ok, we're going to outer space..and your body is going to freak out too, have fun!
Originally Posted By Kimrue If you are and adult and are scared on WDW haunted mansion, you need an evaluation.
Originally Posted By Kylesmom My 7 year old thought M:S was great and I had no problem taking him on it a 2nd time (although after the ride I WAS the little green person from outerspace).
Originally Posted By Jim in Merced CA I think the scary/spooky/supernatural effect of 'The Haunted Mansion' is a far different experience than what 'Mission:Space' provides. You don't get G-forces in the Mansion. It's a bit like comparing 'Pirates of the Caribbean' to 'California Screamin' Yes, both can be scary. But in very different ways. On a roller coaster, the scare factor is physical -- to me, it comes from the out-of-control-thrill sensation and going very very fast. 'Pirates' may provide scary moments based on music, lighting, and overall creepy environment. But to say they are both scary in the same way.... I disagree.
Originally Posted By nate5881 I see your point ssWEDguy and I agree, neither are what you would call "family friendly" in the most politically correct sense of the word. I think the issue in question though is "who" is affected by each ride. MS will most likely adversely affect adults more than younger children. HM will most likely adversely affect the children. What it boils down to is who is making the final decision to go on the ride, usually it is the adult who makes that decision. Since adults are more likely to be adversely affected by MS than HM they will most likely choose not to experience it with their children. I think most adults would sooner expose their children to a few "ghosts and ghouls" than to feel sick themselves after MS.
Originally Posted By basas I understand your point as well. I think it applies to a certain extent. But we must remember that rides like HM will scare many children, but at least they get to ride...others like MS are completely off limits to these kids (height requirements, etc.). Still, many children are actually terrified of many of the offerings at WDW. I went for the first time with a 4 year old child (we just went to MK), and everything was ‘scary’. POTC queue was enough (didn’t get on the ride), “the mountains†were out of the question, she was done after the HM stretching room, Tiki Room terrified her (the thunderstorm), and even the Winnie the Pooh dream sequence was too much to handle (we didn’t even dare trying Snow White after she came off screaming from Winnie the Pooh). Anyways, the point is that different kids are scared of different things (and some have a higher ‘scare tolerance’ than others). Disney rides are all, for the most part, quite dark, loud, and use a lot of lights/effects that is just too much for many small children. I’ve seen screaming kids being carried out of Fantasmic too (which is supposed to be a family friendly nighttime show). I guess the point of it all is…every ride is going to scare certain kids, but there is, IMO, a difference between rides that might frighten kids, and rides that kids are not permitted to ride (thrill rides). If we started classifying rides that scared a few young kids as ‘not family friendly’, we really wouldn’t have anything left.
Originally Posted By Kylesmom Your average modern teen is not interested in dark rides and shows. They want the thrill rides. So if you eliminate rides like M:S and Rockin' Roller Coaster from the parks you're excluding an entire group of family members from the fun of a Disney vacation. The parks and resorts are suposed to be fun for the entire family, not each individual ride or attraction.
Originally Posted By Blackie Pueblo I have to agree with WED. I think parents should look into what the ride is, what's it about, before letting their children ride. Disney is a family park. Family does include teens and the like. So there has to be a few thrill rides for the park to cater to everyone. I also agree the bigget difference is the whole physical toll on your body. The Haunted Mansion does very little to, pay attention now, MOST people but not all. It's really not too scary except to the kids. Really it's just dark, maybe some of those pop out heads could trigger heart episodes. Mission Space does effect the body, both kids and adults. Please don't yell at me, it's just my opinion. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "I didnt' mean to scare you prematurly" <a href="http://www.newlineagefilms.com" target="_blank">http://www.newlineagefilms.com</a>
Originally Posted By vbdad55 <Are you suggesting that "people with heart problems - blood pressure problems - even blood sugar problems" CAN'T be affected negatively by a Haunted Mansion experience, just because there are no physical forces involved? Isn't it possible for persons with health problems to be affected just be being scared badly? < If you are an adult not a kid, -- and anything in HM or Pirates scares you -- then you probably don't have the nerve to goout of the house and travel to WDW anyway...c'mon-- scary ? I don't think so. We're talking about keepin' a ride from being a family ride by the restrictions -- not talking about kids being scared.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 <Your average modern teen is not interested in dark rides and shows. They want the thrill rides. So if you eliminate rides like M:S and Rockin' Roller Coaster from the parks you're excluding an entire group of family members from the fun of a Disney vacation< here's where I disagree -- there is a different expectation at Disney, regardless of age of attendees. I have used this example before but here goes again-- for 7 years running my daughter and her club volleyball team traveled to WWoS to play in the AAU National Championships in June -- this was 6th grade thru high school -- there were there for 6 days - 5 days of playing and 1 free day. Each year the kids got to choose 1 park in orlando for their free day. Only once did they choose other than MK - and that was IOA. And guess what happened -- they hated the waits, were disappointed in most rides and after 4 hours called the parents and begged us to pick them up and buy them tix for MK -- which we did. All of these kids ride the scariest of rides at Great America near us -- so that wasn;t it-- they love the dark rides - HM & Pirates etc -- at MK-- and the 3 mountains -- I don't believe anyone intentionall y goes to Disney for thrill rides -- as first off, the thrill rides there are not the rush of the huge super coasters anyway -- and secondly, even teenagers like to be treated well by park employees, which I think most CM's do a fine job of a Disney.
Originally Posted By Kimrue <<Kimrue -- I love this phrase --I am still laughing !>> THANKS! Feel free to use it at will!
Originally Posted By RoadTrip <<I don't believe anyone intentionall y goes to Disney for thrill rides >> That may be, but all you need to do is look at the lines to see what attractions consistently draw the most people at WDW. The MK Mountains Tower of Terror and Rock N Roller Coaster at the Studios Test Track at Epcot (although I love Mission Space it is extreme enough that the audience is limited). Dinosaur and soon to come… Expedition Everest at the Animal Kingdom. Would I like it if WDW had NOTHING but thrill rides? No, I would not. But I would be VERY disappointed if it had none.
Originally Posted By basas ^True, but those are "Disney Thrill Rides", not just 'thrill rides' (usually much more intense, giant steel coasters, etc.). There is a difference, and thus, a reason MK (whose 3 thrill rides would be considered 'kiddie rides' at a local Six Flags park) welcomed 16.1 million guests last year, and most local thrill parks could barely get above 2 million. Even IOA (which is much more of a thrill park, and just down the street from MK) could only pull in 5.7 million...about the same as DCA!
Originally Posted By Wbnemo1 as someone who use to work Mansion all the time, you all forgot one other small fact..alot of the parents love to scare their own Children while riding, sad fact, but wittnesed many times... me two cents ya know! William
Originally Posted By basas <<as someone who use to work Mansion all the time, you all forgot one other small fact..alot of the parents love to scare their own Children while riding, sad fact, but wittnesed many times... me two cents ya know!>> Not to mention the CM's like to scare guests too.
