Originally Posted By ni_teach Al over at MiceAge.com says that Disney is looking at having tickets, like fastpass, for the new World of Color show to control the crowds. What do you all think? <a href="http://miceage.micechat.com/allutz/al101309a.htm" target="_blank">http://miceage.micechat.com/al...309a.htm</a>
Originally Posted By Hans Reinhardt It makes sense to me. They have to do something to prepare for the potential crowds.
Originally Posted By FerretAfros "The current plan is to make World of Color the first ticketed nighttime spectacular in Disney theme park history." Well, Al doesn't quite seem to have his facts straight on this one, but it does sound somewhat feasible. They use a similar system on a daily basis (lottery-based, instead of first to race to the FP machines) in Tokyo Disneyland for their big shows, since they are so popular. I'm not sure if they are currently using the system for any of their shows, but I know that it was used extensively during the Cinderellabration nighttime castle show/parade that they did from around 2000-2005 (not sure on the years). The system worked well for them because they had already established it as a way for seeing the more popular shows, like One Man's Dream, and there were pleny of other places to watch the show from around the hub. The seating in the center section was reserved for the lottery winners, but the losers still got a decent view. I'm not sure if that will be the same here, since it sounds like the people who don't get there will not have a good view at all. Being relegated to the back or the side doesn't really sound the same as watching it from the front, but standing further back. If they do this, I'm sure that will cause a ton of complaints. Also, there is no precedent for this with the DL audience, so most people won't be expecting it. DLR visitors are trained to camp out for their seats, which is the exact opposite of how this works. They need to make sure they publicize the heck out of this to avoid as many problems as possible (though they wills till undoubtedly happen). And wasn't the point of this show that it would bring more people to the park for longer periods of time? It sounds like using the FP system, people will be there at park opening, run to get their 'reserved' seats, and then head back to DL for the majority of the day. Then a few hours before the show, they will start to linger back into the park to claim their seats. While they will spend time in the park, they will have an opportunity to spend a lot more time in DL because of the system. Less time waiting on the ground means fewer meals eaten in DCA, which means less money coming in. It just seems a little counter productive. And why does Al think that because it gets dark later in the summer that they can only run one show? Keep the park open later! They have 2 (or even 3) shows of Fantasmic! nightly, all summer, without any problems. Between that, this being the 'first ever' reserved ticket for a nighttime show, saying that the show will open at the end of April, and his obsession with the new president, his fact checking/credibility just doesn't quite seem to be up to par these days.
Originally Posted By SleepingBeauty82 How would a ticket system work for something that is to be viewed from numerous places in the park? Also, a lot of the viewing spots are on busy walkways and I don't see how they could close them down to ticket holders only.
Originally Posted By Hans Reinhardt "If they do this, I'm sure that will cause a ton of complaints." I have to wonder how that complaint noise would compare to the roar of complaints that would surely follow they don't implement some kind of civilized reserved seating program. Sure, the special seating arrangement needs to be advertised properly, but people will complain no matter what they do.
Originally Posted By Hans Reinhardt “How would a ticket system work for something that is to be viewed from numerous places in the park?” The way I understand it the reservation system would only be for the seating/viewing area directly in front of the show on the north side of the lagoon.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan I much prefer some sort of ticketed thing than regulars camping out with large tarps and strategically-placed strollers holding space for 30 friends who show up 5 minutes before showtime.
Originally Posted By dl1956 There could be an analogy to the first few years of Fantasmic in the early '90s, difference being the enormous increase in the number of AP holders since then. It was interesting to read in the recent threads re: capacity crowds at DL, the number of posters who said they simply turned around and left, to come back "later in the week", or just "dropped in" for a couple of hours then went home. Can't do that if you're a plain ol' daily-ticket-buying tourist.
Originally Posted By jmuboy I think this idea sounds good. I am willing to give it a try. I hope DL attempts something like this in some form. Otherwise they will have chaos on their hands with 30k people trying to see a show designed for 9k.
Originally Posted By gadzuux I agree. The idea that full price ticket-holders are at the mercy of 850,000 APers seems innately unfair. And bad business for DLR. In any business, your premium priced customer should get a greater value than the bargain hunters. Instead it seems to be backwards, with the local APers having all the insider knowledge and ability to game the system. Add to that the infamous sense of entitlement that many APers exhibit, and the fact that they seemingly have all the time in the world to devote to seeing the "latest greatest thing" at DLR, and we end up with a spectacle that's all but inaccessible to everyone but the hordes of unemployed disnoids. These are the same people who would spread out tarps and blankets hours before showtime - if they could. Sounds like they can't, so instead they'll line up at the gates at opening, sprint to the FP machines first thing, and then fritter their day away until they're allowed to form a queue for the evening show. 9,000 isn't a lot. Let's do some simple arithmetic. Suppose there's eight FP machines. Suppose each machine can dispense six FPs per minute. That's 48 WOC FPs that can be distributed per minute - let's make it 50 to keep the math simple. With 9000 available, and being dispensed at about 50 per minute, FPs will be distributed in about three hours. Anyone not inside the park before noon will effectively be eliminated. Yet the show won't begin until after dark - 9:30 or 10pm during the summer months. Evenings with double shows should help considerably. But it sounds like a major crowd control headache. As much as I'm looking forward to the show, I may end up having to wait until fall before attempting to see it, and hoping for the best.
Originally Posted By Hans Reinhardt I wouldn't be surprised if Disney gives away WoC showpasses with their resort hotel packages. This would automatically guarantee preferred seating for families spending multiple nights on property. I seem to recall receiving a free Fastpass the last time I booked a DLR hotel package.
Originally Posted By SleepingBeauty82 <<<Add to that the infamous sense of entitlement that many APers exhibit These are the same people who would spread out tarps and blankets hours before showtime - if they could. Sounds like they can't, so instead they'll line up at the gates at opening, sprint to the FP machines first thing>>> You know what I'M tired of? Being accused of things just because I have an AP. I have never spread out a tarp or blanket to see a show and I'm sorry but if Disney offers Annual Passes and the chance to see new shows am I NOT supposed to go so tourists can get what they pay for? I can't win! I don't have a sense of entitlement, I think every paying guest at Disneyland deserves a great time. Whether you're there for a day a week or an hour. I'm tired of the SAME PEOPLE always looking down on AP holders and acting like we're spoiled children who are rude and don't care about anyone else. And before you say "Well maybe you're the exception. Not all AP-ers are like you." just remember there are a lot of awesome AP holders on this board that are just like me and sick of being looked down upon because we're local and love Disney. I'm sorry for the rant but COME ON! Every time there is a new show or attraction the discussion always turns to why AP holders are going to ruin it and it's getting old.
Originally Posted By Hans Reinhardt SB, I don't think the poster meant to offend you. Nor do I believe that this person thinks that all AP holders deserve a bad rap. However, none of that means that today’s AP program has not had an adverse impact on traffic flow at the parks. Just read Al Lutz’ latest update about how AP traffic is affecting parking at DLR and you'll see what I mean. I think the problem isn't the APs so much as it is greedy Disney selling too many of them and then failing to address the negative consequences of so many people just popping in whenever they feel like it.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan But Disneyland, long before they sold APs, also sold admission-only tickets. I think it was a dollar or something to get into the park, with no ride coupons. Even back then, that was hardly an extravagant price to pay. The park can only hold so many people safely, so it mazes out at a certain point regardless of whether it is vacationers or locals or AP holders. "Comfortably" is a different question, and that number is surely much lower than whatever the fire marshal allows. I don't blame AP holders any more than Joe from Denver (welcome back, Joe, it's been too, too long) for the over-crowding issue. To me, the biggest factor is Fastpass. Get rid of it and the overcrowding problem disappears as more people are absorbed into the lines rather than meandering about.
Originally Posted By gadzuux >> Being accused of things just because I have an AP. << SB - this isn't about you, or any particular individual. My comments are about an entire 'class' of park guest that has a very different way of visiting the parks. There's no need to be defensive. And you should not be held responsible for the excesses of other passholders. But (and it's an important 'but) many of the problems that the park faces are from passholders who do indeed bring an odd sense of entitlement on their frequent visits to the park. As with any business serving the public, some people are more demanding and finicky than others, and quick to complain over perceived sleights that aren't really there. And as I pointed out in my earlier post, this new proposed system is tilted towards people who have foreknowledge of how to 'work' the system, and the inclination to spend morning noon and night just hanging out in the parks. Not everyone can do that - even APers. Some of them have jobs and responsibilities that prevent them from being able to visit during the opening hours AND closing the place at night. For these people, gaining access to the reserved viewing area will range from difficult to impossible. The only people who will be able to take advantage of this program are people who are in the park before noon. And Hans may be correct - that guests of the on property hotels may also receive admission coupons for the viewing area. Although this is tricky too because that could easily add up to more than a thousand people per show - or roughly ten percent of the available space, limiting the FPs to less than 8k.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan It's funny that we're having this discussion about crowd control at... DCA. Who'd a thunk it?
Originally Posted By Hans Reinhardt "But Disneyland, long before they sold APs, also sold admission-only tickets." But those people (mostly) came in the morning, spent the day, and then left in the evening. What many of the APs are doing is dropping by as one might do at a shopping mall - at any and all times of the operating day. Just think of the APs who will descend on DCA and DL just a few WoC begins to snag a spot and then take off once the show is over. Have you read the threads about the hordes of people showing up just for the Halloween fireworks creating havoc in the hub? I don't blame the AP holders, nevertheless Disney needs to address it as a problem. "It's funny that we're having this discussion about crowd control at... DCA. Who'd a thunk it?" I know, right?
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan >>But those people (mostly) came in the morning, spent the day, and then left in the evening.<< Sure, it was different times. It's just strange how now so many people seem to practically live at the parks, when the option was pretty much always available. And back then, they had all sorts of entertainment, dancing, grown up stuff to do at night.
Originally Posted By alexbook >>mazes = maxes<< I dunno. I like the picture of "mazing out" the park.
