Originally Posted By Expo_Seeker40 While I intend on going to the MK the week the tiki room reopens (partially to see it....isn't that pathetic?), I have to wonder if this was the right choice....and it has lead me to something I call "tiki room syndrome"...where an attraction or event is turned back to what it used to be because a.) it's easier as the material already exists and b.) it will please the D23 community and merchandise potential Of all the "new" things that have happened in the past couple years...how much of them were new? We have the retro tiki show, captain eo, the slightly modified electrical parade, a rethemed star tours....toy story mania, fantasyland expansion? that's all I can think of. It's been said disney parks will never be museums, but I feel the magic kingdom has become one. Because the majority of guests to WDW visit a couple or a few times in their lives, many of the attractions remain the same or change little. So much from my first trip in 1996 is still as it was. When I was a younger fanboy I wished everything could be stuck in time. I wanted to hop on with dreamfinder and visit old school WDW. Now....I'm not so sure. The monorails are heavily beat up and worn. The electrical wa-wa pageant, while cute, is the same as it was in 1996 using 1971 technology. Tomorrowland has yet to be finished since its 94 refurb. Half of it is stuck in 1975. The CoP is still stuck in 1994, disco mountain...I mean space mountain is w/e. wishes is from 2003, as is philarmagic...they have parade floods from as far back as the 80s, and at epcot u can still watch a fireworks show from 1999. don't even get me started on DHS. so, while I enjoy things like the wand coming down, and wish things like the hat would be removed...I can't stop but wondering if in the end, turning the florida tiki room back to what it was will be the right thing. I think it will within a year become a snooze fest with tumbleweed out front. I can't believe (well, yeah I can) that the same fireworks show has been at epcot for over 10 years and at the MK for nearly 10 years and we have a 70s evening parade and 70s lagoon parade playing nightly and can ride an indoor rollecoaster that still is mostly stuck in the 70s. while I respect the charm and freshness WDW had in the 70s and 80s, I feel the MK especially has become a time capsule that partially pleases this fanboy, but makes him embarrassed for his childhood theme park.
Originally Posted By FerretAfros I touched on this in the Tiki thread, but it's much worse at DL than WDW. While DL has had more 'new' additions in recent years than WDW, they have almost all been reworkings of removed attractions. Here's a quick rundown of what's (re)opened since Buzz Lightyear in early 2005: Space Mountain (track replacement, queue retheme) Finding Nemo Submarine Voyage (after closed subs for ~8 years) Pirates Lair on TSI (mild retheme of existing attraction) Innoventions (Dream Home reboot) Sleeping Beauty Castle Walkthrough (redone, closed shortly after 9/11) Great Moments with Mr Lincoln (redone, closed for the 50th film with Steve Martin) Captain EO (replaced HISTA, which replaced EO for the TL98 redo) Almost all of those focus on bringing back something that was lost through the years. And they were all really popular for about 2 weeks. And now they're all pretty easy to get on (Space being the obvious exception). What I think fans miss the most isn't the attractions themselves, but the type of experiences they brought us. They used to be things that were beyond our imagination, both in theme, technology, and overall experience. If asked in a survey if I wanted to see a boat ride past singing robot pirates, I would say no. But you know what? It's a great attraction. Using the surveys as a guideline only allows WDI to do so much with their projects. Fans say they want Horizons. But that's not what they mean. They want to see an attraction with the scale, scope, and vision similar to that. Modern attractions are much less ambitious, and pale in comparison. Fans want to be blown away by an experience they can't get anywhere else (which is why Potterville has been so successful). It seems that Disney isn't really interested in shooting for that any more. If you only aim to meet expectations, you'll never exceed them.
Originally Posted By FerretAfros Plus, when you bring back old attractions, you can push all the existing content you want, which fit's Iger's modus operandi perfectly. Why create something new, when you can just keep shilling the same old stuff for decades on end?
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Originally Posted By PotNoodle ^^^You forgot to list every trip and every resort you've ever stayed in since you started going to WDW in your "signature".
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer While I don't think that the Tiki Room coming back is a problem, the mind set is. There's nothing NEW and original in the line up. It's all just branding and rebranding- Iger doesn't want to take a risk.
Originally Posted By Kennesaw Tom EPCOT Explorer, I'm sure that is not it. I'm sure it's just cheaper to bring back the old show then it is to create a "new" one.
Originally Posted By Doobie In general I agree bringing Tiki back is a bad thing. The only mitigation in this case is I don't think it was part of a grand plan. It was triggered by the fire which meant they had to do something. Something completely new was out of the question so the choices were rebuild Under New Management or bring back the original. Given the fire damage, I wouldn't be surprised if the cost for each was similar so given the reviled Under New Management, why not make a few people happy by bringing back the original. I think Captain EO is a better example, and that's a move I despised for multiple reasons including this reason. The Electrical Parade is another example and I wish it hadn't happened either. I realize Disney can't add new attractions all the time, but in general I'd rather they keep what they've got than "bring back a classic". In most cases, there's a reason these classics were removed. Doobie.
Originally Posted By leemac ^^ Amen to that. I'm at a loss to explain why WDW Co. is on such a nostalgia bent when it just doesn't appeal to their guest base. Between EO, MSEP, Tiki and the 40th campaign it all leaves me cold.
Originally Posted By Manfried Maybe imagination has ceased to exist at WDW and WDI. Or maybe some of the fanbois?
Originally Posted By Kennesaw Tom Doobie, I'm going to have to disagree. I don't think bringing back the original version of Tiki Room is a bad idea. I just think coming up with a new show would be a better idea. AND I should point out it's not to late. Sure go ahead and open Tiki Room with the original show. But create a new updated show and implement it. Unfortunately at WDW it seems that once Disney does something then that is it and it's not likely to change. I don't have a problem with Captain EO. It's a great show. But, you have to agree it's got a shelf like. I'm not going to fault WDW for bringing it back. It was the right thing to do. But at the same time, realize it has a short shelf life. So bring it back but realize your just buying a couple years at best and eventionally have to replace it with something new. Again, WDW just seems to make a change and then it's permanent or at least that the impression the quests have.
Originally Posted By Doobie Given the circumstance in this situation, I don't think it's a bad idea either. I should've been much clearer in the opening line of my post. Had they done this without the fire, I would've said it's a bad idea - more specifically a bad trend. But have to disagree on Captain EO. Even putting aside whatever issues I have with MJ, I just don't think a Disney theme park is a place to be bringing back attractions for tributes. If a former president dies should the version of HOP featuring them be brought back? Should Walter Croncite's narration have been brought back to Spaceship Earth when he died? A theme park isn't the place for that. Leave the tributes the real world. Maybe a plaque or something in the queue. The parks are for escape. Doobie.
Originally Posted By Expo_Seeker40 I think they're bent on nostalgia because it's cheap. The TTA narration had to be changed because of new attractions added since 1994, yet they call it the peoplemover, which is cool, but this modern day peoplemover uses a narration spiel as generic as ORAC-1 from the 1980s. Look at our tom sawyer island, it's almost unchanged since it opened in the 70s. I'm glad we still have a fort, too bad disneyland doesn't anymore, yet our fort last changed in 1995 for the Disney live action movie "tom and huck", our swiss family treehouse is virtually unchanged too, as is the original format of the country bears.
Originally Posted By Kennesaw Tom I have no problem with Disney saying that they are going to temporarily bring back a show as a tribute to a renowned individual. So obviously I'm going to answer you statements as yes, bring back Walter Croncite's narration, yes bring back Captain EO on a temporary basis. That would be a much better and fitting tribute to an individual than a plaque. But, to each his own. I realize some people just are not going to see it that way. There are something you just can't ignore. I can see that agruement with perhaps the MK, but EPCOT, DHS, DAK.... where is the harm? Again, I respect your rights and where are you coming from. I just don't see the harm.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>EPCOT Explorer, I'm sure that is not it. I'm sure it's just cheaper to bring back the old show then it is to create a "new" one.<< It's at the heart of the problem, but you are right, too.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>^^ Amen to that. I'm at a loss to explain why WDW Co. is on such a nostalgia bent when it just doesn't appeal to their guest base. Between EO, MSEP, Tiki and the 40th campaign it all leaves me cold.<< See, but I think you might be wrong, there. EO still has crowds, and MSEP is just as well received, if not more so, than Spectro. Personally, while I want new attractions, old quality is better than new offerings that lack in quality.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>Should Walter Croncite's narration have been brought back to Spaceship Earth when he died? A theme park isn't the place for that. Leave the tributes the real world. Maybe a plaque or something in the queue. The parks are for escape<< I think that would have been a great idea. And that has nothing to do with my opinion on Dench. As for your dislike of tributes... guess you don't like that statue of Walt or Roy on Main Street, huh? Or One Man's Dream, right? ;-) Granted, I don't think that Disney should focus on some of these issues, but I do think that them looking at their history is a important thing. Disney might be a theme park, but it's not total escape, you have to have SOME substance in there.
Originally Posted By DlandDug >>Unfortunately at WDW it seems that once Disney does something then that is it and it's not likely to change.<< You mean like the "temporary" party tents in Mickey's Birthdayland? As far as bringing things back, I don't mind if it doesn't involve removing something better. Should it be only temporary? I don't know. A good case in point was America the Beautiful at Disneyland. When Circlevision was slated to be turned into the extended queue for Rocket Rods, they could have just shut the thing down. But instead, they brought back the 1965 America the Beautiful, and unabashedly billed it as a "farewell" showing. And it pulled in decent numbers. And then it went away.
Originally Posted By Kennesaw Tom DlandDug there is going to be very little that you and I disagree on. <<You mean like the "temporary" party tents in Mickey's Birthdayland?>> I never had a problem with Mickey's Birthdayland, the tent's or Mickey's Toontown Faire. I realized that the entire area catered to a specific group, families with toddlers). And althought I was not a part of that group, I recognized that Disney realized that group was there and wanted to appeal to that group. My only issue came when 20K was bulldozed, filled in and left vacant. I was saying at that time, that it was the right time to demolish Mickey's Toontown Faire and rebuild the entire area ( including the former site of 20K ) with something more permanent and looked a bit more permanent than plastically looking buildings and tent. Of course it looks like I was 20 years ahead of my time since that is exactly what is being done right now in the MK.
Originally Posted By DlandDug >>DlandDug there is going to be very little that you and I disagree on.<< I just realized how very, very intelligent you are...!
