Originally Posted By Hista98 So i don't want to sound negative, i really hope this show does well and I'm sure a lot of you will come up with great reasons as to why my thoughts are unsound but i wanted to point out some things that i think are wrong with all the measures being taken to see WoC this summer. First of all showpass. Will this really be needed? let's look at Fantasmic. First of all F! is a far more popular show in a much more popular and heavily attended park. They have never once used fastpass or any kind of advanced seating for this show and its worked out fine. The first come first serve basis is in my opinion the best way to do seating for both F! and WoC mainly because it's fair and gives everyone the same chance to get the seats they want. Leave the viewing open all day and let people slowly file in to find their seats. anyway to make this easier to read I will continue in part 2.
Originally Posted By yamabuki Yes, Fastpass is needed. This show isn't for APs who want to camp out all day. Showpass levels the playing field and allows everyone a chance to have a good spot for the show. Making it first-come first-serve would create chaos. I can already see thousands of APs lining up around paradise bay with blankets.. what makes you think Fantasmic is more popular than WoC? the show hasn't even opened yet.. I predict the show will be very popular.
Originally Posted By Hista98 Part 2: do they really think that there are going to be so many people coming to DCA to fill up two shows worth of WoC that they will need FP as a crowd managment tool, where is this coming from? Secondly Glowfest. same reason as before are there really going to be 12000 people (basicley what has been DCA's dailey Attendance the past 8 years) waiting for evening shows that they will need a show to drag people in at 6 every day? once agian F! doesn't do this so Why do they feel it is needed for WoC. Now you may be saying that it's needed due to the smaller viewing area for woC not true. Honestly the same number of people see F! every night as WoC yes WoC is much more confined but the rivers viewing area while longer is much more narrow. The actuall capacity for both shows is almost the same. So they are hoping that WoC will be more popular then F!? Sorry but as cool as it looks I don't see DCA getting that much help from this show. Finally I think its a bad idea to dedicate a majority of the parks day to WoC staring off the preshow at 6. not opening the paradise park til then And closing PP one of the biggest and most beautifully lit areas at night before dusk and basiclly forcing everyone in the park to watch WoC seems too exclusive of a thing and a turn off. I want to say how impressed I am by disney for all the steps they are taking but they seem a little to optomisitic and alot of this seems unnessacery, and I would not be surprised if by July a lot of this stuff was on yesterland. anyway those are my thoughts. Let the bullying of me begin
Originally Posted By Hista98 then why dont they do a FP for F!? also fp for WoC does not level the playing field at all most aps will just camp out by the FP machines and get them first thing in the morning. as most non locals wont even know about the fastpass for it more likely. while it may have seemed like a good idea the showpass is just another way for the APs to dominate.
Originally Posted By Hista98 where is this idea of without fps it would be chaos? look at F! it does first come first serve and there is never chaos.
Originally Posted By lesmisfan well this show is spreading like wild fire and so many people are coming to see it. I can't tell you how many times after the parade the viewing area was filling up quickly with guests for rumored soft openings, we even had a manager out there to help us get rid of the crowd who didn't believe that there was no soft preview. and fantasmic didn't open this day and age when we have over a million APs plus regular guests. Fantasmic didn't have huge crowds until later when they even redid the viewing area to get more people in. and i believe fantasmic does have more seating. Apprently the park and area around it including the bridge can hold up to six thousand. i think F! i could be wrong, holds more.
Originally Posted By Hista98 i'm not saying WoC won't be popular, I'm saying DCA wont have the attendance figures that would make all these steps nessacery.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt "where is this idea of without fps it would be chaos? look at F! it does first come first serve and there is never chaos." You obviously don't read the boards thoroughly. Lot's of people complain about the masses of humanity at both Fantasmic in front of the Castle for the fireworks. Some here have said that it's been so mobbed that they've been concerned for their safety. Hista, consider for a moment if management didn't prepare and just let people come in and see the show like they do for Fantasmic and MORE people showed up than they anticipated. Consider the negative impacts that would have for the Resort, DCA, and Disney Parks & Resorts. DCA has had a rocky decade this is not the time to play guessing games and just cross your fingers and hope all goes well. It would be irresponsible for them to not be prepared for the worst. They can always scale back if things aren't as bad as they are planning for.
Originally Posted By Hista98 that would not be chaos thats just overcrowding it is not however chaos, btw WoC will have the same overcrowded problem.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt It could be chaos if they didn't put controls in place. It may turn out that these preparations aren't needed, but it's better to have them just in case. I think you are over-thinking this.
Originally Posted By DlandDug >>First of all showpass. Will this really be needed?<< Apparently the planners at Disneyland, many of whom have been doing this sort of thing for decades, think so. Time will tell if they are correct. >>let's look at Fantasmic.<< Yes, let's. >>First of all F! is a far more popular show in a much more popular and heavily attended park.<< Since WoC hasn't opened yet, this is true. >>They have never once used fastpass or any kind of advanced seating for this show and its worked out fine.<< No, not really. I suggest you find a lead or manager who has been around since the Summer of 1992 to tell you about the chaos that ensued when Fantasmic! opened. I was there. It was a nightmare for the cast and guests-- but it was worth it for a magnificent show! And the beautifully detailed NOS waterfront was created specifically to deal with exactly the kind of issues that WoC is trying to avoid. >>The first come first serve basis is in my opinion the best way to do seating... let people slowly file in to find their seats...<< Not. Gonna. Happen. I have seen guests knocked over by people rushing to buy a PIN. I believe the decision to use the existing FP system (which wasn't even conceived when F! opened) is a sound one. >>do they really think that there are going to be so many people coming to DCA to fill up two shows worth of WoC that they will need FP as a crowd managment tool, where is this coming from?<< Oh, places like this, where there are numerous discussion threads simultaneously going over every detail of this show in obsessive detail. You even started another one. See how that works? >>Secondly Glowfest. same reason as before are there really going to be 12000 people (basicley what has been DCA's dailey Attendance the past 8 years) waiting for evening shows that they will need a show to drag people in at 6 every day?<< I haven't heard a 12k figure attached to Glow Fest. I do think it's a good idea to come up with a shiny distraction to keep guests waiting for the second showing of WoC over on the other side of DCA. If it isn't needed, they can simply shutter the whole thing. >>...you may be saying that it's needed due to the smaller viewing area for woC not true. Honestly the same number of people see F! every night as WoC...<< No one has yet seen WoC in a publicly formed crowd, so this is pure speculation. >>yes WoC is much more confined but the rivers viewing area while longer is much more narrow. The actuall capacity for both shows is almost the same.<< Not at all. Far more expert people than you and me have been taking a hard look at this. >>So they are hoping that WoC will be more popular then F!?<< You bet! That's the whole point of this major, major investment. >>Sorry but as cool as it looks I don't see DCA getting that much help from this show.<< That's your opinion, and we'll all see how it pans out in a couple of weeks. >>Finally I think its a bad idea to dedicate a majority of the parks day to WoC staring off the preshow at 6. not opening the paradise park til then And closing PP one of the biggest and most beautifully lit areas at night before dusk and basiclly forcing everyone in the park to watch WoC seems too exclusive of a thing and a turn off.<< If this were true, I would agree. All that happens at 6pm is a street party in front of the Sun Icon, an area usually largely deserted at that time. By 8:30 the party will have moved onto Hollywood Boulevard, while guests are filling in Paradise Park and the bridge. (These areas will be open all day, and only cleared in time for the arrival of the WoC crowds.) The rest of DCA will be operating normally (albeit with bigger crowds) until WoC actually performs. >>I want to say how impressed I am by disney for all the steps they are taking but they seem a little to optomisitic and alot of this seems unnessacery, and I would not be surprised if by July a lot of this stuff was on yesterland.<< Again, your opinion, and in July we will all know how it panned out. >>anyway those are my thoughts. Let the bullying of me begin<< >>anyway to make this easier to read I will continue in part 2.<< It would be easier to read if you would use consistent capitals, better syntax, and the occasional paragraph. How's that for bullying...?
Originally Posted By DlandDug >>They have never once used fastpass or any kind of advanced seating for this show [Fantasmic!]...<< Just recalled that this is not correct. The first year they had such interest in F! that they would form the second crowd of the night in Frontierland, and hold them there while the first show was playing. Then cast members would have to clear the waterfront by moving everyone through Adventureland. Meanwhile, regular day guests were trapped on Big Thunder Trail and the entrance to Adventureland. Eventually, they opened the flood gates between Pirates and the Tree House, and let guests exit via the perimeter road and back onto Town Square. It was a mess, but everybody rolled with the punches. My heart always went out to the hard working cast members who had to deal with frustrated guests. And all this during the hot Summer months!
Originally Posted By Hista98 The rest of DCA will be operating normally (albeit with bigger crowds) until WoC actually performs Um no PP closes at 8 and with the main entrance and HPB closed for glowfest that means after 8 there will be nothing to do but WoC I don't like this idea as it is to exclusive for those who dont have FP and pushes them away espcally if the park is "open" til 10. "Tower to Soarin' be prepared for bombarding after 8 as you will be the only thing open.
Originally Posted By SuperDry <<< >>I want to say how impressed I am by disney for all the steps they are taking but they seem a little to optomisitic and alot of this seems unnessacery, and I would not be surprised if by July a lot of this stuff was on yesterland.<< Again, your opinion, and in July we will all know how it panned out. >>> I think they're handling it wisely: prepare for the worst, and hope for the best. As DlandDug already pointed out, all of these extra measures (Glow Party, FP, Premium Reserved area for table service diners, lunch box reserved area) can be scaled back more or less at any time should they end up being overkill. If they're not enough, they can add the third performance. If lots of people show up consistently for the first few weeks - even if they are dominated by AP holders - they'll be glad they put the effort in. The last thing they need is to put in all the work they did to make a wonderful show that's a hit with everyone, but then get bad press about impossible guest control that scares people away. If nobody shows up, then they can scale back almost immediately.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt I get the impression that Hista wants this whole thing to fail. Kind of like he insists that Al is always wrong.
Originally Posted By Hista98 I don't want it to fail. I suggest you go back and read my first sentence. clearly you didn't
Originally Posted By DlandDug >>Um no PP closes at 8 and with the main entrance and HPB closed for glowfest that means after 8 there will be nothing to do but WoC...<< When you say "PP" do you mean Paradise Park or Paradise Pier? If it's the Park, what's the loss? I have heard nothing about the entire Pier closing at 8pm. HPB does not "close" for Glow Fest. Glow Fest takes place in the Sun Plaza and on Hollywood Boulevard, which remain open to all guests. So that leaves all of Condor Flats, Grizzly, Flik's Fun Faire, and HPB open. So what is this about shutting down DCA to accommodate WoC?
Originally Posted By SuperDry <<< So what is this about shutting down DCA to accommodate WoC? >>> It's nonsense.
Originally Posted By Hista98 PP is paradise pier and yes all of it is closing for WoC to not interfer with sight lines. I honestly dont see the point of glowfest. WoC takes about 25 minutes plus probably like an extra 10 to empty which means the first show will empty at about 9:35 and they will most likley have guests for the 10 15 show start filling in right after that it doesnt seem like they would need a show to kill time between. and why not just let WoC guests ride rides and return to the viewing area to use the FP rather then having to follow some show to the viewing area.
