Originally Posted By Donny <a href="http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011/11/16/michigan-parents-of-disabled-children-forced-to-pay-unions-fees/" target="_blank">http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011...ns-fees/</a> Let me know what you think.
Originally Posted By Longhorn12 >Let me know what you think.< [citations needed] No seriously. I see less than 150 words, with no backing information.
Originally Posted By skinnerbox <a href="http://mediamatters.org/blog/201102100007" target="_blank">http://mediamatters.org/blog/2...02100007</a> <> FOX NEWS INSIDER: “Stuff Is Just Made Up” February 10, 2011 7:20 am ET by Eric Boehlert Asked what most viewers and observers of Fox News would be surprised to learn about the controversial cable channel, a former insider from the world of Rupert Murdoch was quick with a response: “I don’t think people would believe it’s as concocted as it is; that stuff is just made up.” Indeed, a former Fox News employee who recently agreed to talk with Media Matters confirmed what critics have been saying for years about Murdoch’s cable channel. Namely, that Fox News is run as a purely partisan operation, virtually every news story is actively spun by the staff, its primary goal is to prop up Republicans and knock down Democrats, and that staffers at Fox News routinely operate without the slightest regard for fairness or fact checking. “It is their M.O. to undermine the administration and to undermine Democrats,” says the source. “They’re a propaganda outfit but they call themselves news.” And that’s the word from inside Fox News. <> More at the link.
Originally Posted By skinnerbox BTW... Faux News, along with dozens of other conservative spin sites who are parroting their reporting, has completely missed an important point on this issue: the parents and caregivers actually VOTED to JOIN the union! <a href="http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2005-04-20/business/0504200220_1_seiu-representation-michigan-workers" target="_blank">http://articles.chicagotribune...-workers</a> <> Thousands of Michigan workers who care for elderly and disabled people in their clients' homes have voted to join the Service Employees International Union, handing the union its second victory in two weeks. In Illinois, the SEIU recently won representation of more than 49,000 workers who provide government-subsidized child care from their homes. The Michigan vote, certified Tuesday, extends collective bargaining rights to 41,000 caregivers who are paid as little as $5.50 per hour through the state's Medicaid budget. <>
Originally Posted By SuperDry It's an odd position for Fox News to take - they must have decided that promoting an anti-union message was more important than pointing out that all of these people affected are accepting welfare payments from the state gov't.
Originally Posted By Donny Wow you guys are pro-choice when it fits your agenda but I guess parents of a disable child should not get a choice.
Originally Posted By skinnerbox Donny, the government is paying them to care for their children, instead of sending a professional caretaker to their house to do it for them. And since the majority of parents doing this work on the government's dime voted in favor of joining the union, then everyone will be joining the union who does this work. Michigan is not a right-to-work state like your precious Florida. If you hate this situation so much, then the solution is simple. Spend your money by donating to political campaigns in Michigan to turn it into a right-to-work state. (And good luck with that, given the decades long history of unions in the auto industry.)
Originally Posted By SuperDry Donny: Since when did "you guys" stand up for the rights of welfare recipients?
Originally Posted By skinnerbox Exactly, SD. And since you've already demonstrated your hatred of unions with a passion, Donny, quit wasting our time by baiting us into yet another anti-union tirade on your part. You've partaken of the 1% "corporations are people" kool-aid and subsequently want all unions dismantled, so that conservative Republicans can win elections bankrolled by corporate billionaires without any opposition funded by unions, so they can finally kill off the 99% by steamrolling over workers' rights and the ability to earn a decent wage with reasonable benefits and affordable healthcare, once they take back control of Washington. Please just go away and take your anti-middle class values with you. We're tired of arguing with folks who continue to vote against their own best interest.
Originally Posted By Donny Nooooooooooooo SPP I am going nowhere.I will say how funny it is when you can't defend your point you goto attack mode.
Originally Posted By skinnerbox First off, I'm not SPP. But message of hatred received. Second, I'll make this one statement again about why labor unions are important, which you will probably ignore once again, before moving on to other topics. Unions are necessary for collective bargaining of better wages, benefits, and working conditions. The middle class in this country for decades was able to enjoy good wages, weekends off, 8-hour work days, paid overtime, paid holidays, paid vacation, because of the collective bargaining efforts of labor unions in the past. But as labor unions continue to be marginalized by foolish middle citizens such as yourself who support and vote for right-to-work laws, otherwise known as "right-to-be-a-slave" laws, these benefits are slowly eroding away. And if the trend continues, workers won't have any protections left, the workplaces will return to the death traps of the 19th century, and minimum wage will become but a memory. If you had bothered to read the story at my link, you would have learned that most of these caregivers of disabled children are earning $5.50 per hour. That's far less than the Federal minimum wage! It's institutionalized slavery. That's why the majority of these caregivers -- even the parents -- voted to join SEIU, so they could work together and collectively bargain with the state of Michigan for better wages. If you think parents working together with other service employees to demand more than $5.50/hr from the state for taking care of their children is a bad idea, then go ahead and support those efforts to make Michigan a right-to-work state. But if you think that they should earn more than $5.50/hr for taking care of their disabled children, then you need to support their decision to join the service union, because that's the best chance they've got in this political climate to get a higher wage they're clearly deserving of receiving.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 I never realized I had to be part of a union and be a pro union supporter in all cases to be 'middle class'-- learn something every day.
Originally Posted By Dabob2 That's not what SB said. In fact, she said that many middle class people marginalize unions (foolishly, in her opinion).
Originally Posted By mawnck >>I never realized I had to be part of a union and be a pro union supporter in all cases to be 'middle class'-- learn something every day.<< Not yet, but coming soon.
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder "Nooooooooooooo SPP I am going nowhere.I will say how funny it is when you can't defend your point you goto attack mode." How's that egg on your face?
Originally Posted By vbdad55 "That's not what SB said. In fact, she said that many middle class people marginalize unions (foolishly, in her opinion)." sorry - below is the part that tells me I was not somehow middle class because I worked for a large non union corporation - as did plenty of people. Being a union member is NOT the only way to be middle class- sorry my Dad was union and they did crap for him- including a 9 month strike by IBEW that cost us the first house we ever had after years of saving to get a small one. Labor leaders got rich and the rank and file got screwed- they all agreed to the Ma Bell breakup. My unlce could not work once he got older and due to diabetes could no longer perform on a printing press he ran-- the union threaened his benefits if he worked a non union gig-- so he lived the last 4 years of his life making shit. I am sick of reading crap here about unions that makes them out to be Glinda the Good Witch of the North. There are places they worked extremely well and places where they have issues not dis-similar to the corporations themselves "The middle class in this country for decades was able to enjoy good wages, weekends off, 8-hour work days, paid overtime, paid holidays, paid vacation, because of the collective bargaining efforts of labor unions in the past.
Originally Posted By Dabob2 The troubles with certain unions notwithstanding, that statement is largely correct. Without the efforts of unions, neither unions NOR non-union workers would have enjoyed most of those things mentioned, at least not at the point in time they started to. Nor does that statement say if you work for a non-union outfit that you're not middle class. I understand your frustrations, but I think you're mischaracterizing the statement.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 And the world where unions were really somewhat of a necessity has indeed changed. We cannot operate today the way we did 50 years ago with the manufacturing power globally ( as well as now white collar power)globally) -and be successful.The unions in many cases have become hierarchal structures just as corrupt as the companies they fight against-- contrary to the occupy groups- the 1% is not the only problem that caused us to drive the economy into the ditch..is it one of them- yes.
