Originally Posted By mrkthompsn OK geniuses, I need your opinion: I have a part that I have designed that is to be made of zinc using a die-casting process. I received a tooling quote from a Michigan company for $182,000. I received a similar tooling quote from China for $54,000. The difference amounts to my salary and benefits. The per-part price is $117.80 from Michigan, and the per-part price from China is $85.30. To whom should I award the business and why?
Originally Posted By Dabob2 Is this a serious question? You shouldn't be asking people on a Disney board. You should be asking people in that business, especially people who might know if what seems like a good deal from China turns out to be not so good in the long-run, especially quality-wise. We would have no idea of the many variables here, especially things that "don't turn up in the box score," as it were. There are other intangibles too - like how much it's worth to you to be able to put "Made in the USA" on something you're behind. Or is this just theoretical trolling?
Originally Posted By mawnck Is China able to supply it at the necessary level of quality? Are you sure? I notice you said "similar", not "identical". What effect will it have on your operation if there are delays? Are delays more likely from China or from Michigan? How much is shipping from China vs. Michigan? Does either the Chinese or Michigan company have an ongoing business relationship with your firm? Is it worth the extra money to have someone "on your side" in the event things don't go smoothly? Which one has the best customer service? is Michigan aware of how badly they got underbid? And you only got two bids, one in Michigan and one in China? What kind of manager are you?
Originally Posted By RoadTrip What is your business motivation... to help the American economy or to make the most money possible? If it's all about the money, go with China! P.S. In all honesty, if it were me, it would likely be all about the money.
Originally Posted By utahjosh <Or is this just theoretical trolling?> Why call it trolling? Why can't it be just a topic for discussion?
Originally Posted By mawnck >>Why call it trolling? Why can't it be just a topic for discussion?<< I don't know, but let's watch how the thread goes and find out.
Originally Posted By Dabob2 It's trolling if it's not a serious inquiry, and when there are all sorts of unanswered questions, as mawnck and I pointed out. If it's a serious question, why in the world is he asking us rather than people in the field?
Originally Posted By mawnck >>It's trolling if it's not a serious inquiry<< Note also the topic title he chose. So Josh ... since you want to have a discussion, what's your take on it?
Originally Posted By mrkthompsn This is a real scenario. Quality is affirmed the same whether the parts are made in China or Michigan. I have inspected both facilities. Obviously, a political decision is at hand. I will make my own decision, but I want to know what you would do. The effect of my decision has a direct effect on Michigan. The decision can be scaled to many more companies making similar decisions. Do I have a civil and corporate responsibility to lift Michigan? Should I consider the impoverished Chinese workers aliens of this world at not lift them?
Originally Posted By mrkthompsn I'm asking people in my field obviously, but I'd like to exercise the opinion of this board for the conversation it raises.
Originally Posted By mawnck Still don't get why the bidding is limited to two facilities, and you haven't even scratched the surface of answering my questions in post 3, and many more like them. I do strongly believe that, if you consider yourself a patriotic American, you should try and have the work done in America IF it does not put your company at a significant competitive disadvantage. But I'm not convinced, based on the facts presented, that you have made much of an effort in this regard, nor do I know for sure if the apparent disadvantage in your post is legitimate or not. You're requesting that we compare apples to ??? I ask you again, since it is a real scenario ... Does Michigan know about the bid from China? Why only two bids? What about shipping? What about reliability? Are YOUR customers willing to pay a premium for Made-in-the-USA? Politics do not exist in a vacuum, and neither does your question. Sincerely, One of the geniuses.
Originally Posted By utahjosh You've got to take care of your business, to take care of your family. Your family comes first. Go with China. It's unfortunate that it's this way, and the conversation on how to bring prices down here in the USA is one that greater minds than mine could answer.
Originally Posted By Dabob2 "I will make my own decision, but I want to know what you would do" Something's not passing the smell test here. If you want a serious response, you'd have to provide serious answers to all the questions in post 11, and more besides. Otherwise we couldn't come close to answering intelligently. My Spidey sense tells me there was another reason for asking the question in the first place.
Originally Posted By EdisYoda You asked about your civil and corporate responsibility. Not so easy answer. Your civil responsibility and that of an American citizen (assumption here) is that of having the part made in the US. Your corporate responsibility is to that of the owners/investors and thus to have the part made in China where it costs the least and thus potentially makes the company more money to put in the owners/investors pockets. Unfortunately I'm guessing that corporate responsibility will in out as these days it's about more profit. Good luck in your decision.
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder When someone with mrkthompson's history here starts out with "OK geniuses", the presumption has to be he's stirring up trouble, especially when he opts to title it a "political business decision". There's no politics involved at all here. None.
Originally Posted By mawnck >>Otherwise we couldn't come close to answering intelligently.<< I could say something about post 12 .... Naah, better not.
Originally Posted By DyGDisney >>Go with China.<< Surprised to see Josh's response here. Wouldn't it be safe to assume that one way to bring down prices of items made in the U.S. is to BUY items made in the U.S.? The higher the demand for U.S. made items the more said items will be made in the U.S. Supply and demand and all that....
Originally Posted By mawnck >>Surprised to see Josh's response here. << His family is more important to him than his country. Which is an oversimplistic way to look at his response, but it was an oversimplistic response.
Originally Posted By skinnerbox <<You've got to take care of your business, to take care of your family. Your family comes first.>> And this is why, ladies and gentlemen, America is falling further into the abyss with each passing year. Whether or not you choose to believe it, Josh, the country needs to come first. Period. Otherwise, all citizens, all families, including yours, will eventually end up living in a third world poverty nightmare. The only reason our nation has achieved the great advances we've become famous for, is because businesses used to put the country first. Jobs were created here, for Americans. Factories were built here, in America. Individuals like you were able to find good jobs with good pay and benefits so they could start families and provide for them. Because without those good paying jobs, without those opportunities, most people wouldn't even entertain the notion of raising a family. It's the strong solid economy and robust job market that makes it all possible for people like you, Josh, to provide a stable home environment for your family. Putting your family first and ditching on American workers ultimately will come back to bite you, when the fabric of society disintegrates as chronic high unemployment tears the nation apart. Businesses need to start putting the nation first, creating jobs here at home, so that the country and the majority of its citizens can continue to exist. And FWIW... the OP smacks of troll bait, given the posting history of the thread creator. Zero trust that this was done with a genuine interest on what the regular posters think about this issue.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip There are MANY areas where the U.S. still has far greater knowledge and competitive advantage. Manufacturing by and large is not one of them. Live with it. In a global economy what else can you do? We need to prepare Americans for the jobs where we will be competitive in the future, not for jobs where we were competitive in the past.
