Originally Posted By jonvn Is it me, or does it seem that people who call themselves conservative and take on certain right wing viewpoints have a harder time making rational arguments? I've been chatting with a few of these people on here, and there doesn't seem to be a one of them that can understand what's presented to them. There are some moderate types, who tend a bit right of center, but they seem ok. It just seems the neo-con right wingers just can't get it, and don't understand something that is said to them. This results in the endless repetition of information, and their endless inability to absorb the same. I say this not because they disagree, but because it becomes obvious that they aren't even trying to refute the information, they simply repeat the same tired old song, as if the information was not there. I just find it interesting.
Originally Posted By jonvn The question I guess I'm asking is, are there conservative intellectuals? Do they exist elsewhere, or is that simply a non-existant thing? People of reason can disagree on certain things, and I've seen people on some shows who can put forth a cogent conservative argument, but that simply isn't happening here. Why is this?
Originally Posted By Beaumandy You are wrong about the NSA program, global warming, Irag, the Establishment clause and other subjects... and you are going to act like some advanced thinker jon? Spare all of us. You are also told again and again why you are wrong, you are given evidence, links, quotes, studies, historical reference and you still never get it. It's like talking to Rainman with you Ray....errr jon. The left always said Reagan was dumb, that Bush is dumb, yet these same people follow failed liberalism and conspiracy theories as their ideology.. and then they claim nobody is up to their level of thinking?? Take this to the bank. The people who say they are the smartest people in the room are the morons in the room.
Originally Posted By Beaumandy What? That jon can start a thread claiming conservatives can't keep up with him, yet he has been taken to task on countless threads? Conservatives are so stupid they run the entire country, are happier, and don't get AIDS nearly as often as liberals. ( look it up ). Yet this blowhard comes on here and claims he can't get a good debate? He reminds me of the liberal professors that troll for idiots in so many of our colleges to impress with their flawed and ignorant world views. Yep, he really made his point.
Originally Posted By friendofdd >>>in¡Etel¡Elec¡Etu¡Eal /ˌɪntlˈɛktʃuəl/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[in-tl-ek-choo-uhl] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation ¡Vadjective 1. appealing to or engaging the intellect: intellectual pursuits. 2. of or pertaining to the intellect or its use: intellectual powers. 3. possessing or showing intellect or mental capacity, esp. to a high degree: an intellectual person. 4. guided or developed by or relying on the intellect rather than upon emotions or feelings; rational. 5. characterized by or suggesting a predominance of intellect: an intellectual way of speaking. ¡Vnoun 6. a person of superior intellect. 7. a person who places a high value on or pursues things of interest to the intellect or the more complex forms and fields of knowledge, as aesthetic or philosophical matters, esp. on an abstract and general level. 8. an extremely rational person; a person who relies on intellect rather than on emotions or feelings. 9. a person professionally engaged in mental labor, as a writer or teacher. 10. intellectuals, Archaic. a. the mental faculties. b. things pertaining to the intellect.<<< I'm sorry, Jonvn, but I don't see either side fitting the definition much when it comes to the political discussions in this section. Most rational presentations rapidly disolve into something else. Being rational makes a presentation stand on it's own and saying the other side doesn't "get it" may just be an excuse for a poor presentation. All areas of the political spectrum have true intellectuals who make their case in a logical, understandable way. To disagree with them does not necessarily make one less intellectual. Is there any possibility in your thinking that liberalism has it's share of dummies? If not, then you are being intellectually dishonest. There are plenty of names going back and forth in world events. Intellectual, as a term, would be far more meaningful if one side applied it to the other as it is merited.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 <There are some moderate types, who tend a bit right of center, but they seem ok. It just seems the neo-con right wingers just can't get it, and don't understand something that is said to them. < first off I hope I am one of the bit right of center moderates( many issues - not all )- here, otherwise I may have to tear up my Mensa card...--LOL ! as for the second part though - it's not just the far right, it's also the far left that tend to let precious few 'facts' get in the way of an agenda. So to me it's not the inability to be articulate...it's the fact they really do not care to be on any of these topics. Most people here can and do put together interesting analysis, even if one doesn't agree with their stance.....it's once the name calling starts and emotions takeover .. even the most articulate get sucked in. IMHO Now there are one or 2- and one for sure not anyway near the far right - for more left, although likely more far out - that have no intention of every putting anything in writing but a rambling diatribe on God knows what. just my 2 cents for what it's worth...I am sure some think the same thing about me...
Originally Posted By YourPalEd #9 #9 #9 #9 9. a person professionally engaged in mental labor, as a writer or teacher. What does this mean? You mean you can actually be paid to write? Why hasn't anyone offered me any money yet? You cowards!
Originally Posted By Kennesaw Tom In response to post #1: << they simply repeat the same tired old song, as if the information was not there.>> Hello, Is there anybody in there Just nod if you can hear me Is there anyone at home Come on now I hear you're feeling down I can ease your pain And get you on your feet again Relax I'll need some information first Just the basic facts Can you show me where it hurts There is no pain, you are receding A distant ship smoke on the horizon You are coming through in waves <<<Your lips move but I can't hear what you're saying>>> When I was a child I had a fever My hands felt just like two balloons Now I've got that feeling once again I can't explain, you would not understand This is not how I am I have become comfortably numb O.K. Just a little pin prick There'll be no more aaaaaaaah! But you may feel a little sick Can you stand up? I do believe it's working, good That'll keep you going through the show Come on it's time to go. There is no pain you are receding A distant ship smoke on the horizon You are only coming through in waves <<<Your lips move but I can't hear what you're saying>>> When I was a child I caught a fleeting glimpse Out of the corner of my eye I turned to look but it was gone I cannot put my finger on it now The child is grown The dream is gone And I have become Comfortably numb.
Originally Posted By YourPalEd 10 years of longevity due to laughing at ed. 1 penny received. Receipt recieved 8-26-06
Originally Posted By ecdc I actually think this is an interesting topic. I'm definitely left of center, but I also find it refreshing to hear intelligent conservatives. Unfortunately, too many talk shows or political roundtables invite the incendiary types to draw ratings. I may not agree with thoughtful conservatives on everything, but they're logical, reasonable, and most important of all (to me) not Jesus crazy. Unlike so-called Christian conservatives, they don't necessarily speak authoritatively and treat those who disagree with them as if they're clueless (kinda like when Beau repeatedly labels opinions as "facts"). A short list of people I can think of: Dinesh Disouza Christopher Hichins (at least he's conservative on Iraq) Joe Scarborough (at least when I've seen him on Bill Maher he seems bright) Dennis Miller Andrew Sullivan These are the conservatives who make Ann Coulter, Sean Hannity, and Rush look like the numbskulls they really are.
Originally Posted By jonvn "it's not just the far right, it's also the far left that tend to let precious few 'facts' get in the way of an agenda." Any extremist is going to basically be nuts. And as I said, I've seen some interesting conservative viewpoints being discussed in places by people who give you pause to consider your viewpoint. That's not what I see happening very often for the right wing viewpoint, though. Especially here. While there are one or two left wing loonies here, not naming names, it seems the right wing is almost uniformly represented by individuals who are incapable of holding a cogent thought, and knee jerk react to every certain idea with the exact same refrain on every single topic. Either that, or they are so bereft of their own ideas on a subject, that they will quote, lock stock and barrel, and entire article, without comment, as if the ideas from these online conservative pundits goes from their eyes to their typing fingers without first stopping at their brain. It is a bit disappointing, actually.
Originally Posted By YourPalEd <<<Any extremist is going to basically be nuts.>>>> This is not true. An extremist is dedicated. The term does not indicate intelligence or sanity. All you know by calling someone, like bush, an extremist is that he is dedicated toward his beliefs, and will not change them anymore, no matter what. It is not discussing the fact he is ignorant also, just the fact he is a known traitor, who is dedicated and will do anything, to hurt america. Since, he has shown himself and all american news media to be liars, propagandists, and anti-american manipulators, he has proven himself extreme, but not intelligent or tactful.
Originally Posted By DAR <<It is not discussing the fact he is ignorant also, just the fact he is a known traitor, who is dedicated and will do anything, to hurt america.>> And this statement is any different from what the Hannity's of the world say??
Originally Posted By YourPalEd The difference between my statement and hannities: Hannitie is paid millions to lie, and to block the truth. I am paid nothing to tell the truth, and it is being cenosroed off the news, even though everyone says, knows, and thinks that the known traitor, george bush, must be impeached immediately, before he let's iran attack us first with an atomic bomb. He let osama attack us, and then didn't catch him. He is going to let iraq bomb us, and then say, see i told you so, and start his war. By cutting off discussion with the iranis and then acting like they are, it means the outing of plame, cut off the secret agents in iran, and no information or truth is known as to these people. The fact they are intelligent and violent, and trained. It will be a real war this time, if we dont start some form of negotiation quick.
Originally Posted By YourPalEd The known traitor, john bolton, is being used to block international discussion in the united nations, not promote discussion.
