Originally Posted By DAR <a href="http://www.foxnews.com/politics/first100days/2009/02/05/graham-says-obama-awol-stimulus-debate/" target="_blank">http://www.foxnews.com/politic...-debate/</a>
Originally Posted By Bob Benchley Let's see. Obama is obviously reaching out to the public with his TV appearances and Op-Ed work, something the last President didn't have a clue about. Sounds to me like Graham's got his feelings hurt, and/or is posturing himself already for a run in 2012. Either way, shut up and fill the perceived leadership void yourself Lindsey instead of whining about it.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan I think Obama's strategy is very similar to what Reagan used to do -- take his case directly to the people.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 ^^^^ transparency in what you are doing - and taking it to those who voted you in - what a novel concept. How did the work for Reagan in his second election vote wise ? Obama is taking that page. Talking to the people instead of at them will go a long way in buying you passes on some things - let face it none of them are perfect angels... heck even I gave a pass to Obama on Daeschle - which was a horrible slection as a whoopsie because he is at least saying the right things after the fact...
Originally Posted By dshyates I just wanted to smack Graham. Listening to him lecture us on bipartisnship and the Dems need to negotiate. WTF is he talking about. The Dems did comprimise on the Stimulus Bill, it was the GOP who didn't budge a millimeter. The GOP really has no ability to use logic in any form or fashion. Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!Tax Cuts!
Originally Posted By mawnck Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Spending increases! Alex, I wanna see what's behind door #3. Grrrrrrrrrrr.
Originally Posted By dshyates Hey the GOP increased spending to the point that they spent more than all the other presidents put together. Unfortunately most went to Haliburton who moved their offices to Dubai so they wouldn't have to even pay taxes on the billions they stole.
Originally Posted By dshyates The GOP spent money like a drunk in vegas, and cut taxes. How did that work out. Oh yeah. a complete world economic crash. Lets beg for their advice.
Originally Posted By mawnck Regardless of what the GOP did, neither increasing spending nor cutting taxes is going to help this situation. RAISING taxes and CUTTING government spending is the only real solution for the government's problems. On that, Ahnold and I are in agreement. But you don't get the big donations pushing that agenda ...
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder Looks to me like Obama is showing exemplary leadership. Rather than dive into the quagmire, he's taking his case directly to the people. They, in turn, can call their representatives and offer support or opposition to whatever he's propounding. This way, there's nothing lost in the translation. Exactly what kinf of "leadership" is Graham expecting? Coming hat in hand to Capitol Hill certainly isn't that. Is Graham incapable of ascertaining what to do without Obama? Is that what he's telling us? It's like he's upset he didn't think of it first.
Originally Posted By dshyates obama has tried to be more bipartisan than anyone in my short 45 years, and listening to Graham whine is pathetic. They don't like the bill, their constiuants will cut the manly bits of if they don't vote for it so this is all Graham has. Its called the Piss and Moan Plan.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 I agree on the surface Obama has tried to be more bi partisan day 1 than anyone I can remember -- the Daeschle selection not withstanding- that was a crappy one to please someone in his party. The trouble is he can;t control some of his own party either.... hopefully he will weed out the buttholes in his own party also- as for the GOP buttho9les- many of them got voted out of office - the remainder should be put on notice. Figure this thing out - don't give the spend thrift dems ( the ones that exists yet) all they want- so review items, but also find some compromises. if only the GOP had actually acted like the GOP and not spent hand over fist themselves- they 'd be in a better position from which to negotiate.
Originally Posted By dshyates I like how Graham said "Doing news shows and coming to lunch..." Well I know why he picked News Shows. Because Obama is taking to the people, and the people are going to force the GOPers if they don't vote for this. That is why we voted Obama in. TO do this. And what is his point about lunch. So a lunch meeting with them isn't meeting with them. They really are that desperate aren't they.
Originally Posted By gadzuux The GOP is doing exactly what they said they would do - obstruct the president and democrats in any way they can. The ironies abound. For one thing, the GOP is using the media in an attempt to redefine the entire stimulus package. They're doing so by picking out nits - as obama stated, their objections amount to less than 1% of the overall bill. They're also moving the proverbial goal posts. The purpose of this stimulus is to rescue the economy. Yet republicans are turning this into some kind of larger philosophical discussion about deficit spending - as if they have any room to throw stones after the past eight years. Their "solution" is the same tired refrain about tax cuts - primarily for businesses. We tried it their way for eight years and look where it got us. They're also crying about a lack of "bi-partisanship". Again - coming from them that's pretty rich. Obama has bent over backwards trying to accomodate their concerns - and what has it gotten him so far? A kick in the shins, that's what. Exactly zero republicans voted for the bill in the house, and this is AFTER he went to the capitol to meet with them privately about passage of the bill. They "say" they want tax cuts, but then turn around and complain about the tax cuts that are included within the stimulus plan - specifically the $500 refundable tax credit on individuals and families. The GOP only wants tax cuts for business and industry - not you and me. An important part of the stimulus plan is aid that goes directly to the states - money that the governors desperately want and need, even the republican ones. Do you think the GOP senate members will listen to arnold and other republican governors? Nada chance. They're not interested in reform, and they're not interested in salvaging the economy that they nearly destroyed. All they want to do is to demonize democrats. It's as if they've forgotten that they lost in November. Personally, I think bipartisanship is overrated. Forget most of the GOP and just try and peel two or three away from the republican pack - enough to sustain a bare majority, and let the rest of them squawk to hannity and rush all they like. They're disenfranchised and they know it. If they further isolate themselves they may well be out of a job soon. Which is really the best outcome - we don't need them for anything at all. They're worse than useless - all they want to do is impede the president and his efforts to try and undo the damage that they caused in the first place.
Originally Posted By DouglasDubh <Exactly what kinf of "leadership" is Graham expecting?> Well, earlier today the President said he wanted to see "additional improvements" to the stimulus bill, but at the same time, he dismisses some of the complaints as "bickering". Why doesn't he tell us what items should be improved, and how'd they should be improved, and which items he wants to keep. And, at the same time he's acknowledging the bill is flawed, and doesn't meet the conditions he set up, he's saying, "Hurry up and pass it." It's a mixed message.
Originally Posted By dshyates "Well, earlier today the President said he wanted to see "additional improvements" to the stimulus bill, but at the same time, he dismisses some of the complaints as "bickering"." Those aren't in conflict. Obama is calling for the Dems to trim over a billion from their wish list. I think Obama would conside that "improvements". And without a doubt the republicans are 'bickering' about tax cuts. I think Obama was pretty clear on tax cuts today. The Repubs will get siome in the name of the spirit of bipartisanship, but that is a failed philosophy. And so he is saying it is flawed, there needs to be improvement, stop bickering, and get-r-done. maybe Repubs are easily confused, but it seems pretty logical and straight forward.
Originally Posted By DouglasDubh <Those aren't in conflict.> True, but why can't he tell us which items should be improved, and how they should be improved? And I disagree that the Republicans are bickering about tax cuts. Most of what was proposed are not really tax cuts, but were part of the President's campaign promise to "spread the wealth around". If he wants the Republicans to vote for a stimulus bill, then it needs to be a stimulus bill, not a bill to redistribute wealth, reform health care and help with energy independence, especially when it probably won't do those last two things anyway. Mr Obama claims he wants change, but this is the same kind of take it or leave it, all inclusive stuffed with unrelated pork projects that we've seen too much of late, and epitomizes what's wrong with Washington.
Originally Posted By dshyates "Mr Obama claims he wants change, but this is the same kind of take it or leave it, all inclusive stuffed with unrelated pork projects that we've seen too much of late, and epitomizes what's wrong with Washington." You are right. The Republicans need to stop being obstructionists. It was in no way take it or leave it. What part about the Dems already comprimised and included their tax cuts and the Repubs still stonewalled it. obama meet with congress, he meet with senate, he had them to cocktail parties he bought them lunch at a 5th meeting. No what Graham said is COMPLETE BS. And obstructionist. Graham made a complete ass of himself today. You can't make crap up and spew it on TV and expect THIS president to smirk and shrug.
