Originally Posted By DAR <a href="http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091209/ap_on_re/us_rel_religion_today" target="_blank">http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/200...on_today</a> Pretty interesting article. And actually I've been meaning to ask some of our non-believing members of LP. If you're invited to wedding, baptism, funeral, first communion anything that would likely take place in a church do you still go?
Originally Posted By ecdc I still have a tree, put on Christmas music, all that stuff. I'd argue that Christmas is far more about American commercialism than it is about Christianity. My Christmas celebration is almost entirely unchanged as an atheist from how it was as a Christian. A handful of churchish things are cut out, but otherwise, it's the same. I think you'd have to find some hardcore atheists to find people who refuse to celebrate Christmas. I don't think it's all that common a thing within atheism to be that opposed. I know Christians would like to believe otherwise, but most of us just ain't into the winter solstice celebration.
Originally Posted By DAR <<A handful of churchish things are cut out, but otherwise, it's the same.>> I'll guarantee that it's pretty much the same for me expect I do attend Mass on Christmas Eve with my family. Really one of the few times I go anymore.
Originally Posted By ecdc Oh yeah, me too. I've got no beef with being invited and attending those things. I find some religious ceremonies to be interesting. [Hops on soapbox quickly] However, this is part of the ongoing double-standard between belief and non-belief. If an atheist refused to participate, they'd be seen as stodgy, uptight, and insensitive (and I'd actually agree). But it's perfectly acceptable to lecture or preach to atheists in an attempt to "save" them out of "love." [Hops back down]
Originally Posted By ecdc >>Oh yeah, me too.<< Sorry, not on attending Mass, just on if I'm invited, I've got no problem going to baptisms, etc.
Originally Posted By fkurucz <<I'd argue that Christmas is far more about American commercialism than it is about Christianity.>> Wasn't there a Charlie Brown special about this?
Originally Posted By DAR So blood doesn't poor out of the Jesus statue when an atheist enters a church, I knew it.
Originally Posted By mawnck >>Wasn't there a Charlie Brown special about this?<< Yep. And I bet Target has the DVD on sale this week. ;-)
Originally Posted By wahooskipper It's always nice to see the members of my parish that I hadn't seen since Easter. But, they really don't deserve to complain about not getting a seat when they walk into Christmas Eve mass five minutes before it starts. There are plenty of seats the week before......and the week after.
Originally Posted By danyoung I'm much more of an agnostic than an atheist. That is, I don't really believe that there's some big powerful creator, but I'm keeping an open mind about it. That said, I think there's terrific value in people believing that there's a higher power. It gives them great comfort to believe that someone is watching out over them. In some ways I'm jealous of them, feeling as I do that there's no one but me watching out for me. But I would never do anything to dissuade others from practicing their beliefs. I was raised in a Christian home with a preacher for a father, and am well-steeped in the traditions. When I visit family at Christmas I have no problem quietly watching as they practice their communions and midnight prayer services, etc. It's enough for me to be with family at the holidays - why complicate it with discussions about belief systems?
Originally Posted By Sport Goofy Considering that Christmas evolved from the pagan traditions of celebrating the winter solstice in the northern hemisphere, it's pretty natural for anyone to celebrate -- Christian or not.
Originally Posted By alexbook I become more Jewish in December. I still don't believe in the miracle of the lights, but I do give Hanukkah presents and cards. It's an American thing, really. I've even been known to put on some Hanukkah music (cf. the "What are you listening to?" thread).
Originally Posted By fkurucz <<Considering that Christmas evolved from the pagan traditions of celebrating the winter solstice in the northern hemisphere, it's pretty natural for anyone to celebrate -- Christian or not.>> Bear in mind that its northern European that adopted those customs: trees, wreathes, etc. Mediteranean/Latin Christians have very different traditions than we do in the uS.
Originally Posted By RockyMtnMinnie >>>Pretty interesting article. And actually I've been meaning to ask some of our non-believing members of LP. If you're invited to wedding, baptism, funeral, first communion anything that would likely take place in a church do you still go?<<< Of course I go. I am an agnostic, but love to watch the pomp and ceremony, plus it means so much for my friends and family and I love to see them happy. I was asked to get up and read some passages at my niece's bat mitzvah and was very happy to do so, because it meant so much to her.
Originally Posted By Mr X ***If you're invited to wedding, baptism, funeral, first communion anything that would likely take place in a church do you still go?*** Since I became an ex-Catholic I've been to countless services (mostly dragged there by my fundie Uncle and his family) and a few weddings and didn't mind a bit aside from the boredom factor (no different from my "Practicing" days, I've always found church to be an awful bore). However, only in the past few years (and largely thanks to what I've learned here on WE) have I been truly outraged and disgusted by the actions of certain religions. Since that time, the only time I've been in a church has been for a friends' Grams funeral and I was exceptionally uncomfortable to be frank. And it wasn't even one of the religions I have a problem with, it was a Lutheran church. But still, knowing what I know now I can't just walk into one of those places without thinking about the hypocrisy and dishonesty and downright maliciousness of the whole "business" end of religions. I'm not sure what I would do if I were invited to a Catholic function. I suppose I'd go and keep quiet, though I would surely hope the priest doesn't try and strike up a conversation beyond "nice weather today". (I'd say the same for the Mormons, but it's never come up and I'm reasonably sure it never will)
Originally Posted By FaMulan I, too am more on the agnostic side. However, if I receive an invitation to be a part of a friend's very special day I will attend if I am able. If the event happens to happen in a Church or Synagogue, I will still go and pay the proper respect a "non-believer" should when visiting someone else's place of worship. Meaning I will be respectful of the service and respectful of the people and not mock it by partaking in things I know I shouldn't.
Originally Posted By quincytoo I, also am more on the agnostic side. I don't celebrate the birthday of someone I do not believe in. I celebrate peace,love, family and goodwill towards my fellow human beings. I just got into a fight with my daughter because I refused to buy wrapping paper with the name Jesus on it. LOL, thought I raised her right but I guess she has been spending time with her Morman side of her family, my ex mother in law...somone who I love very much despite her religion. I grew up Catholic, dappled in other parts of Christianity and quickly realized there was so much more out there. Like Famulan and others if I do got to a church or place of worship I am respectful and actually listen and take from it what I can. I believe in a higher being just not the Christian religion. I have many friends who are Christians and they are wonderful caring people who hold fast and strong to their faith but don't judge others and I respect them for that. Much of why I feel so strongly against the Christian religion is because of a few select posters on this forum. That said, a happy holiday to all
Originally Posted By mawnck >>I just got into a fight with my daughter because I refused to buy wrapping paper with the name Jesus on it.<< I gotta say, I don't think it was your daughter being silly here. Were you concerned that the printing on the paper would burn holes in the present?
Originally Posted By ecdc >>I gotta say, I don't think it was your daughter being silly here. Were you concerned that the printing on the paper would burn holes in the present?<< Oh I don't know. Jesus on wrapping paper? That seems pretty hyper-religious to me, especially for someone who isn't a Christian. This seems to just support my earlier point. quincy didn't want wrapping paper that expressed a religious belief he doesn't share. Yet his daughter gets mad? Would she be as mad if he refused to buy wrapping paper that said "Muhammad" for Ramadan?
