Originally Posted By Donny This is Obama's war <a href="http://www.thewashingtonnote.com/archives/2010/08/senator_obama_v/" target="_blank">http://www.thewashingtonnote.c...obama_v/</a>
Originally Posted By Donny This is Obama's war <a href="http://www.thewashingtonnote.com/archives/2010/08/senator_obama_v/" target="_blank">http://www.thewashingtonnote.c...obama_v/</a>
Originally Posted By dshyates I may be wrong, but I kinda remember Pres. Bush taking us to war in Afghanistan. Please, Donny, explain how it was Pres. Obama's fault that Pres. Bush took us to war in Afghanistan.
Originally Posted By ecdc From the link: >>comments made by then-Senator Obama on Iraq in 2007 & President Obama on US policy towards Afghanistan.<< I know this is a tough concept for you (and a lot of people upset about Afghanistan), but Iraq and Afghanistan are two totally separate and different countries. I know, I know, I thought they were the same place at first too. I mean, they both have brown people who speak funny languages and wear weird clothes and they look kinda deserty. But yeah, totally different countries. Wild, huh? So once someone grasps this radical notion, they start to realize that Obama's done EXACTLY what he said he would do in Iraq and Afghanistan. During the campaign, he always said the right front was Afghanistan. And remember how furious people like Donny were when Obama said he'd go into Pakistan without their permission to get bin Laden? Oops. And then there were the liberals who thought they were electing a Whole Foods hacky sack champ with a Ph.D in chillaxin' and a lifelong career in guitar strumming while casually mentioning what a genius Jean-Pierre Melville was. This country is so bloody stupid, but they think they're brilliant because they finished the TV Guide crossword last week (this week's is REALLY hard though!) and they know all about Obama's socialist agenda from Uncle Wayne's emails.
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder There aren't rocks in Donny's head, there are freaking boulders. He does this just to start fights on here now. Donny's a troll, plain and simple.
Originally Posted By Dabob2 I think Donny is simply easily led. Remember how totally he was into the idea of Trump for President when Trump was pushing the birther crap? Convinced that Trump (Trump??) was the answer to our problems. Several people here told Donny that Trump was just playing him and wasn't serious about running for president - that he probably didn't even believe the birther crap himself (hey Donald, how's that "investigation" that was "finding unbelievable things" going?), and he was just doing all this to raise ratings for his moribund TV show and get NBC to renew it for another season. But Donny didn't realize he was being played. And Trump's rise in the polls shows you that Donny is not the only one easily fooled. And he gets links like the one above and doesn't realize that he's being played by right-wingers who hate Obama who know that they can trick the easily led by comparing Obama's attitude about Iraq with his one about Afghanistan (two completely different situations) and get them to go "Yeah! Look at that! Bad Obama! Bad!" Frankly, I think most Tea Partiers are easily led people being manipulated by very powerful people into doing their bidding and protecting the wealthy (Dick Army, the Koch Brothers, and the other savvy people who finance and organize these groups), while letting them think they're a grassroots movement of "real Americans." The very fact that upwards of 70% of Tea Partiers think Obama has raised their taxes when he's actually lowered them tells you they are, at the most charitable, "low information voters." But they pass each other misleading or downright false internet links, are convinced they know more than others, and get riled up. And, as the other thread showed, really are dominated by the same old southern Christian conservative and borderline (or outright) racist wing of the party.
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder Dave, I hear you, but after all that has gone down in the world lately, with the lowering of the S+P rating among them, simply put, tea partiers are easily manipulated stupid people who shouldn't be tolerated anymore. They're dangerous to our survival as a nation, period.
Originally Posted By Dabob2 And I hear you right back. And we need to challenge their faulty assumptions and theories at every turn. The media doesn't help, with its tendency to court controversy and just put on two opposing views, as though they were equal in weight. The birther thing is a prime example. There simply was only ONE correct answer to that question - Obama was born in Hawaii - but they usually put one rational person on with one birther as though they were equally valid positions. And they do it now with positions like "we don't have a revenue problem, we have a spending problem (only.") Or "we mustn't raise taxes on the 'job creators' right now." That crap needs to be challenged every place we see it, so that more and more people see it for the crap it is. We've got the facts on our side - we need to insist upon them. And then we need to encourage every liberal and moderate we know to come out to the polls. In Wisconsin this week, and across the country next year. The Tea Partiers think they won in 2010 because most Americans are behind them (when the polls show that isn't so), rather than just most Americans WHO BOTHERED TO SHOW UP IN 2010 being behind them. We need to give them a big old rude awakening in 2012 and show them up for being the fringe they are. And in the meantime we need to challenge challenge challenge every time we see them spew their crap.
Originally Posted By mawnck >>And in the meantime we need to challenge challenge challenge every time we see them spew their crap.<< How's that working out for you? We need to dismiss, dismiss, dismiss every time we see them spew their crap. When we respond to their talking points, we legitimize them. The only proper response at this point is "shut up, idiots, we're done talking to you." Harsh, but that's the reality of where we're at.
Originally Posted By dshyates "we mustn't raise taxes on the 'job creators' right now." But if we raise Bob Iger's personal income tax by $200,000/yr, how will he ever be able to afford to start that marmalade canning business in his kitchen? Or maybe he will just give the maoney he saves through the tax breaks to TWDC to hire more people. Seriously, he ONLY got a $12 MILLION christmas bonus last year. How will the poor guy ever make ends meeet. You liberals obviously have no heart.
Originally Posted By Dabob2 <We need to dismiss, dismiss, dismiss every time we see them spew their crap.> In a forum like this, sure. In things like letters to the editor, not so much.
Originally Posted By skinnerbox <<Frankly, I think most Tea Partiers are easily led people being manipulated by very powerful people into doing their bidding and protecting the wealthy (Dick Army, the Koch Brothers, and the other savvy people who finance and organize these groups), while letting them think they're a grassroots movement of "real Americans.">> ^^ This. Big time. <<And, as the other thread showed, really are dominated by the same old southern Christian conservative and borderline (or outright) racist wing of the party.>> DING! DING! DING! I don't care how many times teabaggers deny it, I know from personal experience of following politics and voting for decades, that the very core of this Tea Party philosophy is racism. This is the party of White Power™. It's just another flavor of the Southern Dixiecrats from yesteryear. This is what fuels the Obama hatred so much. They mostly hate him because he's not one of them. Same crap, same smell, different wrapper.
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder "<We need to dismiss, dismiss, dismiss every time we see them spew their crap.> In a forum like this, sure. In things like letters to the editor, not so much." Dave, I have to agree with this. It needs to be done everywhere. It needs to be done by Obama, all Dems and any GOP member who resents the tea partiers taking over their once legitimate political party. At press conferences, on the House and Senate floors, on every Sunday morning show, on any political outlet. They need to go back under the rocks that hid them before.
Originally Posted By DDMAN26 As much as I don't care for the Tea Party, if we take this action aren't limiting their right to free speech?
Originally Posted By hopemax "Congress shall make no law..." Free speech does not mean CNN has to invite a tea partier to participate in their round table, or attend their focus group.
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder "As much as I don't care for the Tea Party, if we take this action aren't limiting their right to free speech?" Dismissing what they say and refusing to dignify the tripe they spew with a polite response is not the same thing as the government censoring them.
Originally Posted By mele <,But if we raise Bob Iger's personal income tax by $200,000/yr, how will he ever be able to afford to start that marmalade canning business in his kitchen?>> This made me LOL. (I just bought a jam cookbook today, too. Perhaps it's a sign.) ;-)
Originally Posted By mawnck >>if we take this action aren't limiting their right to free speech?<< They can yammer away all they want. Free speech doesn't mean freedom from a negative response, freedom from being ignored, or freedom from ridicule.
Originally Posted By Dabob2 That's right. And I'm talking about is a difference in tone depending on the forum. Here we can call crap crap and idiots idiots. But in Congress, say, they really shouldn't be calling each other idiots. There is something to be said for keeping the level of discourse higher, while still insisting on facts rather than fantasy.
Originally Posted By Donny I love how you want discuss Obama doing a 180 on Afganistan.Instaed you turn to the Tea Party or me.
