Originally Posted By Labuda Ok, so... turns out that the governor of Arizona, one Jan Brewer, has publicly stated multiple times that she believes most illegal immigrants are drug mules. This just floors me - will Republicans stop at nothing to prejudice people? How dare she say something like that without having any research to back it up? Oh, and yeah, damn all those immigrant babies and children who are drug mules! Shame on them! <a href="http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/06/25/arizona.immigrants.drugs/index.html?iref=NS1" target="_blank">http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/06/...iref=NS1</a> I certainly hope the US Dept of Justice *does* file suit against AZ over their crazy new law.
Originally Posted By Longhorn12 >governor of Arizona, one Jan Brewer< Hopefully she isn't as locked in as Governor Goodhair is... Are you ready to see Perry win AGAIN... >< >This just floors me - will Republicans stop at nothing to prejudice people? How dare she say something like that without having any research to back it up?< No, but to be fair this seems to be a normal human trait...
Originally Posted By pecos bill It gets much better than that. According to Republicans, if you are unemployed you must be a lazy, drug or alcohol addled, good for nothing bum. They remind me of a bunch of old Nazis who lack any Human compassion.
Originally Posted By skinnerbox "Blame the victim" has been the conservative mantra for eons. It allows the person who is in power or wants to be, an excuse for abusive or apathetic behavior. At the center of the excuse is the need for control and unbridled greed. Having more is never enough; these folks are never satisfied with what they have, once they obtain something. They need to keep acquiring more wealth/power/assets/etc in order to feel any speck of self-worth. However... in order to obtain more and more, they must first take it away from someone else, since we live on one planet with finite resources in a closed system. And the takers also have to justify the taking in order to not feel guilty or ashamed about what they've done. Hence, the "blame the victim" mentality. The justification for the taking stems from vilifying those they took from, which in this case, is the people they're keeping unemployed by shifting resources for hiring American labor into outsourcing foreign labor, which increased the profits that went into their pockets. They're OK with the taking, since the people they took it from (the victims) aren't worthy, are bums, are lawless, are evil, ad nauseum. It's the oldest trick in the mental grab bag. Justify hurting someone by conning yourself and others that the person you hurt deserved it.
Originally Posted By fkurucz >>According to Republicans, if you are unemployed you must be a lazy, drug or alcohol addled, good for nothing bum.<< So true. Never mind that there are 6 unemployed for every job. And Joe Biden publicly admitted yesterday what we all knew already: the 8 million jobs that were lost during the crash won't be coming back anytime soon, if ever.
Originally Posted By ecdc The choice of language is very telling, isn't it. Let's put aside the issue that she's most likely wrong, that most illegal immigrants are not smuggling drugs. The choice of labeling a specific ethnicity "mules" is really what this is all about for most of these people. It shows the contempt and the bigotry behind the sentiment. She could have said, "I understand that our new law is very controversial. However, those outside of Arizona do not understand the struggles we face. While many illegal immigrants, though misguided, come to America seeking a better life, many others have less pure motives, and are smuggling drugs into our nation in an already tense border environment." But she instead called them "mules." And this is a public politician; imagine what people who aren't being videotaped and recorded are saying. Make no mistake: protests to the contrary, racism has a huge role in this immigrant debate.
Originally Posted By skinnerbox <<Make no mistake: protests to the contrary, racism has a huge role in this immigrant debate.>> Yup. Racism often hides behind the "blame the victim" attacks. Once again, the conservative wingnuts are focusing on the wrong problem and wrong solution, in an effort to turn the public's attention from the actual problem and correct solution: going after the employers who hire and abuse undocumented workers, instead of going after the undocumented workers who seek the employment. If Arizona businessmen would stop hiring the Mexicans crossing our border for jobs, then they wouldn't come here, pure and simple. Sure, the anti-immigration proponents will tell you that the undocumented workers would still have decent schools for their kids and less poverty to contend with by being here instead of most parts of Mexico, and will continue to cross the border to get it. But that would only help them in the short term without steady income. After a few months of no employment and no pay, the money would be gone. How would rent be paid? How would food be purchased? Any type of general assistance these folks could get would not cut it beyond a short period of time. Without those jobs and business owners willing to hire undocumented workers, the immigrants would be forced to go elsewhere. The solution to this problem is not building a multi-billion dollar fence on the border. The solution is taking those funds, hiring five times the INS agents we have now, and policing the employers who hire undocumented workers. Slap these guys with very heavy fines the first time they're caught, and lengthy jail time if they hire again. But no politican with the Republicans or Democrats who are desperately dependent upon corporate support to win their elections will ever seriously advocate focusing on the employers hiring undocumented workers instead of the workers themselves. And that's what I'm fed up with, regarding politicians like Brewer and McCain and those who defend them. America is no longer governed by the people. Corporations and businesses rule. That's why these immigrants keep coming here, because those corporations and businesses keep hiring them! And the stupid, STUPID tea party voters who are LOSING their jobs because of these illegal business practices keep voting these pro-business politicians into office! When will the citizens of this nation finally start voting for candidates who have the nation's interests at heart instead of the corporations who've taken over???
Originally Posted By Dabob2 Where did he say that? Hint: he didn't. In fact, he outlined the one measure that would actually make an impact.
Originally Posted By Donny "Make no mistake: protests to the contrary, racism has a huge role in this immigrant debate" As a person who has been waiting for this kind of enforcement I can tell you racism had nothing to do with it. I have seen to many time alot of these illegals come here and drain our resources and give very little back.
Originally Posted By Donny My buddy in the Air force was Mexican and received his American citizenship by serving in the U.S. military.He lived with my family for 1 year until he got his citizenship.I am a republican and I can tee you we just want to see Americans get jobs and Americans get social services.Calling us republicans racists will not help compromise ever happen
Originally Posted By Longhorn12 >I am a republican< Now way.. I couldn't tell >Calling us republicans racists will not help compromise ever happen < No it won't, but having the vocal majority of your party being racist doesn't help either. > have seen to many time alot of these illegals come here and drain our resources and give very little back.< Wow I've seen a lot of the opposite. >Americans get jobs< The immigrants get the jobs because they don't mind doing the labor... >Americans get social services< Because Person X with citizenship who does nothing deserves it more than the guy who is illegal with a family and working? Just FYI without having a family member in the united states (or being famous) it can easily take up to 5 years to get a green card (they only allow so many per year and that number is very small) then after that 5 it can take easily take another 25 to get citizenship. That is one of the biggest issues I have with this conversation. People just assume you can walk up and get a green card and citizenship... it's not that easy. Also for those of you who want immigrants to speak english.... We don't have a national language and hopefully we won't ever.
Originally Posted By SpokkerJones Now that unemployment is running out I wonder if Americans will start applying for those jobs they believe are beneath them.
Originally Posted By Longhorn12 >Now that unemployment is running out I wonder if Americans will start applying for those jobs they believe are beneath them. < No they won't... they went to college... everyone needs to go to college...right? (Another thing I think is wrong with MERIKA)
Originally Posted By SpokkerJones A lot of where you end up is based on luck. There's an educational PC game called Real Lives that uses statistical data to simulate the typical life of a person on this planet. When you begin the game, you will probably be born in China or India. There's a good chance that may be dead by your fifth birthday. The first time I ever played the game, on my second turn it said I had been raped at age 2 and that I died from my injuries. Fun game. At one point in your simulated life you can actually try to emigrate to another country. Give it a try. <a href="http://www.educationalsimulations.com/products.html" target="_blank">http://www.educationalsimulati...cts.html</a>
Originally Posted By Longhorn12 >Real Lives< Haha thanks for reminding me of this game! The first several times I played it I died from malaria/malnourishment before 10. To make this more on topic. I like immigrants.
Originally Posted By SpokkerJones There are illegal immigrants who were brought here as children who face deportation to countries they never knew. Some have college degrees. This article highlights an illegal immigrant who went to Harvard. <a href="http://articles.latimes.com/2010/jun/28/nation/la-na-deport-student-20100628-1" target="_blank">http://articles.latimes.com/20...100628-1</a> Interestingly enough, two of the people highlighted in this article were asked if they were illegal immigrants. They answered honestly, no, they were citizens of Mexico. I wonder if they could have refused to answer.
Originally Posted By Longhorn12 Ahah! Found what I was looking for. Now before you complain this is that durn "liberal media" this comes from the NFAP (National foundation for american policy) so it's legit... The united states only allows 10,000 green cards a year. If you have a relative in america who is a citizen... If you are the spouse or minor of that relative you can get a green card within a year then another five years to become a citizen.. Average time to citizenship 6-7 years If you are not the spouse or minor you have to be a sibling or adult child, and the green card wait depends on country of origin. For single adult children the wait is usually 6-14 years for a green card, married adult children the wait is usually 7-15, for the siblings of american citizens the wait is usually 11-22 years. After your green card it then takes usually another 6 years to become a citizen. Average time to citizenship 12-28 years. If you have a relative who is a lawful permanent resident... If you are not the spouse or child of the resident you're out of luck. If you are the adult child of the resident you must be single (no green card if married) and the average wait to get a green card is 9-14 years. Average time to citizenship 14-20 years. If you are the minor child/spouse of a lawful permanent resident the green card wait (depends on country) but is usually 5-7 years. The wait from green card to citizenship is usually 6 years. Average time to citizenship 11-13 years. If you do not have a relative in the United States... If you are unskilled you almost no shot at getting a green card. (Temporary and seasonal work passes can not become green cards)Average time to citizenship can go to infinity... If you are an athlete/scientist/investor of over $1 million you can get a green card in 12-18 months and a citizen 5-6 years after that. Average time to citizenship 6-7 years If you have a degree in a specialty occupation you must have a job offer and your employer must also be willing to fill out paperwork for a labor certification, conduct an additional job search for you position, and pay up to $10,000 in legal fees. It can take 6-10 years to get a green card this way. After receiving a green card it can take another 5-6 years to become a citizen. If your employer isn't willing to wait 6-10 years for you to start work you only have a 50/50 chance of getting an (H-1B) work visa. If you don't get that you can't work in the country and since you no longer have a job no longer qualify for a green card.
Originally Posted By Donny Lognhorn said "but having the vocal majority of your party being racist doesn't help either." can you share with me 5 things Republicans have done to a specific race of people to make them raciest ??? Since the Republicans are the party of civil rights and freed the slaves I think we can say we have done allot more for minorities then the Dems.
Originally Posted By Donny Lognhorn said "but having the vocal majority of your party being racist doesn't help either." can you share with me 5 things Republicans have done to a specific race of people to make them raciest ??? Since the Republicans are the party of civil rights and freed the slaves I think we can say we have done allot more for minorities then the Dems.
