Originally Posted By Mr X Interesting video here... <a href="http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Uv72urCWJcU" target="_blank">http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=...2urCWJcU</a> I could say a lot...but I think this says it all anyway
Originally Posted By Mr F I can't believe these brainwashed cults called "religions". I will never look at religion the same way.
Originally Posted By nemopoppins Oh- my- god. ^ That just slipped out. To those under its influence, "religious freedom" means bondage and control for everyone! (And a complete blindness to reason.)
Originally Posted By EighthDwarf Hmmm, I wonder if Catholics really understand what the Mormons believe. The Catholic Church, in their eyes, is the great suppressor of truth. It is the "great whore of Babylon". It took the place of the real Christianity that Joseph Smith was called to restore. No rituals performed by the Catholic Church (baptism, marriage, etc.) have EVER been valid in the eyes of Mormons, which is why they do geneology and perform their temple rituals for as many Catholics as they can find. The Prop 8 campaign really created some strange bedfellows. Ironic if you think about it.
Originally Posted By nemopoppins Why do people like to gang up on others? I guess this religious principle is stronger than the ones EighthDwarf mentioned.
Originally Posted By Route66 Mormons have the names of all the Catholics and they rebaptize Mormon children over and over again in the names of these pople. The Mormons belive that the Catholic baptism was invalid and wont get people into heaven (the proper level or whatever), My aunts and uncles have been baptised over 15+ times for different people. I wonder what the catholics would think if they knew this..
Originally Posted By gottaluvdavillains The irony of the comment on the commercial about the mormon missionaries going through there personal items and violating their rights... LOL!! Hello Prop 8 violates their right!! This Guy is a Professor of Theology and yet lies about religous freedom... I just don't get it!
Originally Posted By ChurroMonster I like how the guy said "Church of Latter Day Saints" and "Mormon" but never actually said the full name of the church. I don't think that was an accident.
Originally Posted By ShivaThDestroyer {{{nemopoppons))) always a warm fuzzy to see one of your posts. Many of you know that I'm Christian and that I seldom post in WE (villains, don't snitch on me). All I can say is that there have been a lot of strange things done in the name of religion, both good and bad. I personally can't find anything in the bible about same sex marriage, one way or the other. I'm also fully aware that many Gays have known that they were Gay from a very young age and I have a hard time believing that God would unjustly penalize them because of the way they are "wired". *My personal views* are: 1) Do I believe that Gays should be entitled to the same civil rights and protections that are afforded traditional married partners...Yes 2) Do I believe that we all have a desire to be loved and to share that love...Yes I will admit that I *initially* had a difficult time with the word "marriage" and that another term might have been more acceptable to me. Further reflection, and it's not always easy, made me realize that it was just semantics. I do believe that the various religions should be allowed to follow their own faith and beliefs but not impose them on others, it's also one of the principles that our nation was founded upon. I'm not sure if many of the people who oppose same sex marriage feel threatened by a fear of the unknown or if they are just acting upon there own beliefs, religious or otherwise. It's a lot like the recent election. Some people saw Obama as a black man, I saw him as a man. The same holds true for my friends, some of them are Gay and I wish them the same happiness and opportunity to commit to a lasting relationship that I would wish for any of my friends. If a civil marriage gives them that happiness and security, I don't feel it's my place to deny, nor would I want to. By the same token, I would not want to see anyone attacked because of their religious convictions. Scottydem, I really hope that hate isn't an issue here.
Originally Posted By nemopoppins Hello Shiva >>>Scottydem, I really hope that hate isn't an issue here. <<< This too could be an issue of semantics. The Yes side had nothing to lose, yet they deliberately denied the freedom of others. Those in favor of 8 could be thinking of love, but their act in passing that amendment was hateful, whether or not the hate was intentional.
Originally Posted By avromark <<will admit that I *initially* had a difficult time with the word "marriage" and that another term might have been more acceptable to me>> How about the term Bondage? I mean Union is so British. Bondage just tells about the emotional and physical connection made. Err on second though maybe Marriage does sound better. I'm happy to see Mr. X is ecstatic about Prop 8 being passed. It helps when he goes with the status quo
Originally Posted By nemopoppins >>>By the same token, I would not want to see anyone attacked because of their religious convictions.<<< Having religions convictions is one thing. Calling upon those convictions to justify discrimination is another. Once people forced their religious convictions upon others and used them to deny civil rights, they were opened for attack. It should be recognized that the proponents of Proposition 8 were the ones on attack. It was not their life style that was threatened and it still isn't. The people that were hurt by 8 were and still are only on the defense. The victims shall not be demonized.
Originally Posted By SuperDry <<< The victims shall not be demonized. >>> That's right. They just just repent and convert
Originally Posted By dennis-in-ct << ShivaThDestroyer >> Great post! Well said and spot on. I agree 100% and I am happy to know that people like you live in this world. It gives me hope. <<<I will admit that I *initially* had a difficult time with the word "marriage" and that another term might have been more acceptable to me>> I am Gay and have been raised Catholic. I propose the word "Farriage" You can get Married and I will be "Fairied" lol ... I think a lot of people get hung up on the word. All I want as a Gay man is to have all the same rights, laws and privileges you get. You get 5000 more laws, rights and privileges being federally recognized compared us gays being recognized only on the state level - be it marriage or Civil Union. And then we only get those laws in THAT state. urgh ... If we move to a state that doesn't recognize civil unions, then we have to back to a lawyer can have new paperwork drawn up. I we have adopted kids, living wills, shared real estate, insurance policies, etc etc etc ..... it sucks. I propose all marriages are called "civil unions" with the same equal rights and if people choose to have a religious ceremony, then call it a marriage. I understand that marriage is one of the seven sacraments in the Catholic church. So, all those people screaming that the institute of marriage must be protected ... are the attacking the two atheists that can get married by a justice of the peace or at a drive-through wedding chapel in Las Vegas by an Elvis impersonator or are they attacking just the gays. Do only gay people make a mockery of the "sacred institute of marriage"? *sigh* or do the drunken Las Vegas one-night stands that end up at a drive through wedding chapel at 3am make a mockery of marriage.
Originally Posted By dennis-in-ct << ShivaThDestroyer >> Great post! Well said and spot on. I agree 100% and I am happy to know that people like you live in this world. It gives me hope. <<<I will admit that I *initially* had a difficult time with the word "marriage" and that another term might have been more acceptable to me>> I am Gay and have been raised Catholic. I propose the word "Farriage" You can get Married and I will be "Fairied" lol ... I think a lot of people get hung up on the word. All I want as a Gay man is to have all the same rights, laws and privileges you get. You get 5000 more laws, rights and privileges being federally recognized compared us gays being recognized only on the state level - be it marriage or Civil Union. And then we only get those laws in THAT state. urgh ... If we move to a state that doesn't recognize civil unions, then we have to back to a lawyer can have new paperwork drawn up. I we have adopted kids, living wills, shared real estate, insurance policies, etc etc etc ..... it sucks. I propose all marriages are called "civil unions" with the same equal rights and if people choose to have a religious ceremony, then call it a marriage. I understand that marriage is one of the seven sacraments in the Catholic church. So, all those people screaming that the institute of marriage must be protected ... are the attacking the two atheists that can get married by a justice of the peace or at a drive-through wedding chapel in Las Vegas by an Elvis impersonator or are they attacking just the gays. Do only gay people make a mockery of the "sacred institute of marriage"? *sigh* or do the drunken Las Vegas one-night stands that end up at a drive through wedding chapel at 3am make a mockery of marriage.
Originally Posted By dennis-in-ct Sorry for the double post and "hi" to Mr. X" and his family. We just saw on CNN tonight that Japan is officially in a recession. <<< hugs to Japan >>> Hang in there my friend !!
Originally Posted By avromark Mr. X what do you see at the end of the sentence? Usually the sticking out tongue smiley when used by me, displays sarcasm.
