Originally Posted By DDMAN26 <a href="http://www.jsonline.com/news/state/nov05/368030.asp" target="_blank">http://www.jsonline.com/news/s tate/nov05/368030.asp</a> Honestly is this really hurting anyone. None of the other students are required to go there. They're just reading and discussing, it's no different than a book club.
Originally Posted By DDMAN26 The link may not work since you have to register to read the article: "Every Tuesday last school year, Lance Steiger took a Bible to the basement of his dormitory at UW-Eau Claire and led a small group of friends in a discussion about a particular chapter or verse. Steiger, a resident assistant and a junior at the time, said he was never told he could not lead a Bible study in the dorm where he worked helping students adjust to college classes and campus life. But in July, he got a letter from school administrators warning him that if he continued to hold Bible studies in his dorm this year, he would face disciplinary action. The issue has spawned a flurry of heated exchanges between Steiger, school officials, civil liberties groups, and at least one U.S. representative who on Thursday called the university's position "outrageous and un-American." Essentially state employees The university forbids resident assistants from hosting religious or political activities in the dorms where they work to ensure that R.A.'s are accessible to all students, said spokesman Mike Rindo. Resident assistants are essentially state employees. They receive free room and board and a $675-per-semester stipend in exchange for nurturing and counseling dorm residents. "R.A.s are free to engage in these activities as long as they are not doing it in an environment where they have supervisory roles over other students," Rindo said. In a Sept. 22 e-mail to Steiger, Deborah Newman, associate director of housing and residence life, elaborated on the university's position. "As a state employee, you and I have a responsibility to make sure we are providing an environment that does not put undue pressure on any member of our halls in terms of religion, political parties, etc.," Newman wrote. "As a 'leader' of a Bible study, one of the roles is to gather and encourage people to attend. These two roles have a strong possibility to conflict in your hall." The university's position is backed by a similar written policy at the University of Wisconsin-Madison and is supported by the Freedom from Religion Foundation in Madison. "There's free speech, but this isn't free," said Annie Laurie Gaylor, co-president of the Freedom from Religion Foundation. "This amounts to taxpayer subsidy of worship." Chris Ahmuty, executive director of the American Civil Liberties Union of Wisconsin, said his organization is looking into the issue. Ahmuty agreed with the university's position that state employees should not be organizing religious or political events on work time or place. "The function of the R.A. is almost like a big brother or big sister," Ahmuty said. "When they're in the dorm they're an R.A. 24/7. . . . This isn't like a jail situation where students have no other alternative. They can go off campus." Only a handful of the school's 120 resident assistants have been hosting Bible studies in the dorms, Rindo said. Steiger said he knows of more than 10 who either hold a class in their room or elsewhere in dorms. The school's policy, which also applies to political and ideological activities, is communicated to new resident assistants during a verbal orientation and is not in writing, Rindo said. Steiger sees the ban as an infringement on his First Amendment rights."
Originally Posted By RoadTrip First of all, the title of your thread is extremely misleading. The student could read the Bible all he wanted. He just could not host Bible study groups since as an RA he was an employee of the University and could not be seen as promoting any specific religion at his place of work. That is entirely appropriate. I would feel the same way if he had been forbidden to hold planning sessions for the Democratic Party. When you accept the position of RA, you put yourself in a position where you cannot engage in activities that would otherwise be perfectly acceptable.
Originally Posted By StillThePassHolder Auuugghhhh, Darkbeer disease! DDMAN26 has it now! Is there no cure????
Originally Posted By StillThePassHolder It could have been a bible group or Mein Kampf group. Either way, the guy couldn't host a group. But using the bible is much more sensational.
Originally Posted By Disneyman55 Simple solution. Take it offsite to the local Starbucks. So simple and effective, it blows my mind. Iguess if worse comes to worse you could just take the Bible study off the property. Still not difficult. Solutions, solutions everywhere and not a drop of common sense to find them.
Originally Posted By StillThePassHolder "Solutions, solutions everywhere and not a drop of common sense to find them." Which even the ACLU rep offered, when he said they could go off campus. But the R.A. would rather make a fuss over nothing.
Originally Posted By DDMAN26 <<Auuugghhhh, Darkbeer disease! DDMAN26 has it now! Is there no cure????>> Yes I realize I should have used a different topic heading, but I did give my opinion, I didn't just post the article. Come on is anyone telling me if this student was a practicing Muslim he would have faced this scrutiny? Would the ACLU be telling him to stop what he was doing? College campuses always like to say they promote diversity, but only when it fits their agenda.
Originally Posted By Disneyman55 DDMan, when the system is unfair, work around the system. On a side note, provide some evidence that at the same college a Muslim is doing the same thing but is not being discouraged to do so like the christian, then I would be outraged. Until then, take it to the Starbucks.
Originally Posted By TomSawyer >>Simple solution. Take it offsite to the local Starbucks. So simple and effective, it blows my mind.<< But then it wouldn't be a political cause, Disneyman. I was thinking the exact same thing, though.
Originally Posted By woody I think there is a way around it. Have someone else chair the meeting. The RA is only a participant.
Originally Posted By Beaumandy The ACLU has never gone after a Muslim. Figures.. The ACLU and their perverted version of Seperation of church and state need to be shut down for the good of the country. Bill O' Reilly is all over this subject.
Originally Posted By TomSawyer >>Come on is anyone telling me if this student was a practicing Muslim he would have faced this scrutiny? << It would still be against the university's policy. As soon as you hear a story about a Muslim RA being allowed to hold Koran study groups where Christians are not, we can talk about it. But assuming they would be allowed to without actually having a real story to back that up is a little weak.
Originally Posted By woody I think Muslim are given more leeway. They are usually categorized as an isolated minority. Look at the Paris riots. A virtual news blackout unlike the LA Riots news reporting.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip <<Come on is anyone telling me if this student was a practicing Muslim he would have faced this scrutiny? Would the ACLU be telling him to stop what he was doing?>> <<The ACLU and their perverted version of Seperation of church and state need to be shut down for the good of the country.>> Come on guys… if you are going to comment at least read the original post. The ACLU did not initiate an action to halt the Bible study; the University did. The ACLU has not even taken an official position on the matter yet, although the director has stated that he personally agrees with the University’s decision. << Chris Ahmuty, executive director of the American Civil Liberties Union of Wisconsin, said his organization is looking into the issue. Ahmuty agreed with the university's position that state employees should not be organizing religious or political events on work time or place.>> << Bill O' Reilly is all over this subject.>> Thank God for that. Now I’ll be able to sleep tonight. ;-)
Originally Posted By DDMAN26 The article mentions that he is an employee of UW-Eau Claire since he receives a stipend. Well read the their employee policy in regards to a persons religion <a href="http://www.uwec.edu/affirm/policies/religion.htm" target="_blank">http://www.uwec.edu/affirm/pol icies/religion.htm</a>
Originally Posted By StillThePassHolder I'm sorry, but where in any of the first two posts are Muslims mentioned? Why are they even in this thread? Who's got the Muslim fetish around here? Talk about hijacking a thread.
Originally Posted By DDMAN26 Considering I started the thread I don't think it's hijacking. And I was just using Muslim as an example.
