Originally Posted By oc_dean This actually deserves it's own topic: >>So it’s no surprise that the Prop 8 campaign is trying to manipulate the African-American vote—by capitalizing on Obama’s candidacy. Like most dishonest but effective mailers, the piece that hit mailboxes yesterday is not inaccurate—but is intentionally deceptive. It features Obama on the front, with a quote that he’s “not in favor of gay marriage.” But Obama’s personal view on gay marriage does not translate into amending the constitution – as he called Proposition 8 “divisive and discriminatory.” The mailer, however, leaves the quote out of context—hoping that voters will not know that Obama opposes Prop 8.<< <a href="http://www.beyondchron.org/art...250.html" target="_blank">http://www.beyondchron.org/art...250.html</a> (Even though I already posted it in one ongoing thread.) So .. in addition to all the deceitful tactics of Prop 8 .......... the commercial ads that said "children would be taught about gay marriage" was another lie/distortion. You know ... if a campaign attempts to succeed, it can't make up lies! Or it's INVALID! Call me naive!
Originally Posted By melekalikimaka I think the lies gave people the excuse that they wanted to vote 'yes'. People have a duty to research their votes instead of just getting the talking points from adverts which are almost all lies or distortions. Sadly, you don't have to prove you know anything about the issues you're voting on so campaigns can lie all they want and the votes still count.
Originally Posted By gadzuux I got one of these mailers myself. I mentioned it on the 'Yes On 8' thread at the time. The 'Yes On 8' crowd is being sanctimonious in the extreme over this whole issue. But for all their piety, it doesn't change the facts. There are "lies" and then there are "damned lies" - and they're guilty as sin itself. Know this about good christian folk - they'll kiss and smile while they twist the knife.
Originally Posted By melekalikimaka Here's the thing...we keep hearing how they HATE gays, a thing that they deny. I think a better word was they feel gays are inferior to them in various ways and that they need to help us. What they don't seem to understand is that feeling of superiority comes from the same place as hatred does and comes across as hateful. I think we need to stop saying their choices are based on hate and call them what they really are about. Superiority, religious zealousness, the un-American belief that they do not have to deal with people they do not like or approve of, etc. By labelling their comments with words they don't recognize, we are shutting down the discussion. Much like people don't like to be called bigots or homophobic. We need to find labels that are harder for them to deny and even harder to them to disprove.
Originally Posted By dlkozy >>>"we keep hearing how they HATE gays..."<<< Really? Where? Or is this another of your blanket statements again?
Originally Posted By melekalikimaka Oh, there haven't been statements that Mormons hate gays on the forum??? I'm sorry, I thought that's was one of the things that got your panties so twisted in the first place. Here is where your true colors shine through, dl. I wrote that we need to stop saying this about Mormons but you don't see that, do you? Your need to pick fights and be an all-around jerk are far more important. Talking to you is a waste of time.
Originally Posted By dlkozy Maybe you need to define who "they" is so that your post can be better understood.
Originally Posted By ChurroMonster I, for one, have said that Mormons hate gays many times. Many others have done as well. Pay attention.
Originally Posted By dlkozy >>>"Here is where your true colors shine through, dl..."<<< Your true colors, Mel, showed through with another rabid post of yours on another thread here on WE.
Originally Posted By dlkozy Churro-considering how much time you spend here on WE-looks like you are the one that needs to "get a life".
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan It's funny. You seem very aware of how much time people are spending in WE ... by spending so much time in WE yourself.
Originally Posted By Darkbeer Gee, President Elect Barack Obama happens to be Christian, I think most of us know about Reverend Wright and the church that Mr. Obama has attended for decades. Here is what Barack Obama said in March of 2007 (Quote from the Chicago Tribune). >>"I'm a Christian. And so, although I try not to have my religious beliefs dominate or determine my political views on this issue, I do believe that tradition, and my religious beliefs say that marriage is something sanctified between a man and a woman." <<
Originally Posted By imadisneygal And he's free to believe that all he wants. Like anyone else is. But he wasn't out there sporting "Yes on 8" signs and donating large quanities of money and spouting lies to get others to vote for the Proposition as well.
Originally Posted By imadisneygal I am sure there are people who voted against Prop 8 who believe that it's tradition backed up by religion as well. But they used their brains to think about the fact that their own beliefs shouldn't be forced on others, and that the rights of others shouldn't be taken away just because of their own beliefs.
Originally Posted By gottaluvdavillains <<The Democratic Presidential candidate appeared on MTV this weekend to come out against California's Proposition 8, which would overturn gay marriage in the Golden State. At the same time, however, Obama reiterated his belief that marriage is between a man and a woman. Said the Senator from Illinois:>> <<I've stated my opposition to this. I think [Prop 8 is] unnecessary. I believe marriage is between a man and a woman. I am not in favor of gay marriage. But when you start playing around with constitutions, just to prohibit somebody who cares about another person, it just seems to me that's not what America's about. Usually, our constitutions expand liberties, they don't contract them.>>>
Originally Posted By oc_dean >><<I've stated my opposition to this. I think [Prop 8 is] unnecessary.<< This is the most key point to understand. But unfortunately ... the line was twisted and distorted to make people believe he was for it.
