Originally Posted By Donny want to understand Mitt Romney ? <a href="http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/RomneyCampaignEvent8" target="_blank">http://www.c-spanvideo.org/pro...gnEvent8</a>
Originally Posted By Dabob2 That's from 2008. He'll have flipped and flopped and zigged and zagged a few dozen times since then.
Originally Posted By gadzuux <a href="http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/06/06/6797039-fact-checking-romney-correct-on-some-claims-inaccurate-on-others" target="_blank">http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com...n-others</a> Fact-checking Romney (excerpts from link) While Mitt Romney attacked President Obama on the economy and taxes, he touted his own record as governor of Massachusetts on fiscal issues and education. But an examination of his record reveals some of his claims are either inaccurate or, especially on the state’s finances, although linguistically correct, conceal subtle manipulations. 1. Did President Obama raise taxes on corporations? Romney said Thursday of President Obama, "Instead of encouraging entrepreneurs and employers, he raise[d] their taxes." In fact, President Obama has not raised taxes on corporations during his three years in office. 2. Did Romney really not raise taxes? While Romney was technically correct when he said he did not raise taxes, he is responsible for the largest hike in fees in the state's history. "There is a difference between fees and taxes," contended Noah Berger, president of the non-partisan Massachusetts Budget and Policy Center. "But Romney was responsible for the largest raise of fees in our state's history." 3. Did Romney balance the budget every time? As governor, Romney did balance every budget, but only by dipping into the state’s rainy-day fund early and often. He also fell far short of restoring “a $2 billion rainy day fund," as he claimed. He also co-opted money from funding pools set aside for Medicare assistance, infrastructure projects, and tobacco settlements. In 2007 alone, Romney's budget relied on $600 million from the stabilization fund. The center’s documents also show during his four-year governorship, Romney diverted more than $1.5 billion in revenue from other sources to help balance the budget despite record growth in tax revenues.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 That's from 2008. He'll have flipped and flopped and zigged and zagged a few dozen times since then. --- point me to someone who this description doesn't fit running for top office-- that's the person I want
Originally Posted By Dabob2 <--- point me to someone who this description doesn't fit running for top office--> It fits most. But there's also a question of degree. Romney ran into trouble with it last time, and he's only flip-flopped more since then.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 I'm no Romney fan.just another in the sad stable of unelectable people in the GOP right now IMHO.. and I agree some are way better at flipping and flopping than others -- Kerry comes to mind
Originally Posted By skinnerbox John McCain is far, far worse. Funny how your mind didn't swing towards a Republican first for a stellar example of flip-flopping.
Originally Posted By Donny Yeah Obama flip flops on a number of important issues as well. <a href="http://www.nelsonguirado.com/index.php/asymmetric/2008/07/09/comprehensive-obama-flip-flop-list" target="_blank">http://www.nelsonguirado.com/i...lop-list</a> to be honest I flip flop on my opinions.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 John McCain is far, far worse. Funny how your mind didn't swing towards a Republican first for a stellar example of flip-flopping. --- funny how yours did.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 skinner- type flip flop politician into google and see what comes up first -- mione is an LA Times article that starts with John Kerry. So unless you choise not to pay any attention to anything negative that election year- to me it was fairly obvious Kerry and flip flop got the mot press- both conservative and liberal -- saturday night live skits- rung up by Leno and Letterman... so fine- go with McCain but let's not try and pretend I don't see it other places as well. You can try and pigeonholeme into a GOP only poster- but I'm very far from it-- but this is the reason why moderates don't stay here long
Originally Posted By Dabob2 The irony is that Kerry's famous flip flop - "I voted for it before I voted against it" - was an explainable position. Many pols of both parties do this either because the bill in question changes, or they're voting one way in protest and then another in pragmatism... happens all the time. Kerry got caught in a Yogi Berra moment that the Bush campaign then pummeled him with non-stop. And he gets the rep as a flip-flopper, when he's actually no worse than middle of the pack on that score. Similarly, Gerald Ford got labeled as a stumblebum for a couple of physical slips, which were then exaggerated and parodied ad infinitum, notably by Chevy Chase. But Ford was actually one of our most athletic presidents. But you know what they say: "in politics, perception is reality."
Originally Posted By vbdad55 exactly- but perception wise what would Kerry's score be if you asked 100people to name a famous political flip flopper. I would think he is the runaway winner- true or not, would yoou agree. Now as time goes by someone will replace him of course and one of the party's will use that theme again to bash someone- because it worked the last time. it's not because I only think of Democrats when flip flopping- I've been very clear about my disgust for both parties at present
Originally Posted By skinnerbox <<this is the reason why moderates don't stay here long>> Really? I thought it was because you folks don't like the fact that WE has flipped to mostly progressive since Obama won the White House. We liberals in WE had to put up with a conservative majority on the boards when Bush was in the White House. Now that the tables have turned in our favor politically, you conservatives are all upset because somehow, we liberals are now treating you poorly on the boards. Give me a break. We weren't treated well during the Bush years, but we're supposed to forget all that and now treat you overly sensitive conservatives with kid gloves. Boo hoo cry me a river.
Originally Posted By Donny I don't have a problem with a person flip flopping on an opinion as long as it's because his belief has changed.Know one is going to be perfect sometimes they do have to bite the bullet.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 Really? I thought it was because you folks don't like the fact that WE has flipped to mostly progressive since Obama won the White House. --- okay - play the fool if you want- but 1/ I am a moderate not a conservative- I vote both parties consistently 2/ I call em as I see em 3/ it's attitudes like your that do cause only idiots like Beau to stay here. well -- you know what- adios again -- you can play with all your fewliberal only pals or play with yourself-- I really don't care. Not every liberal here thinks like you - but your obnoxiousness is why people like me leave W/E -- try and open a piece of your mind- amazing what might come in if you do'-- I don't see you as progressive- just closed minded. enjoy !
Originally Posted By Dabob2 <exactly- but perception wise what would Kerry's score be if you asked 100people to name a famous political flip flopper. I would think he is the runaway winner- true or not, would yoou agree. Now as time goes by someone will replace him of course and one of the party's will use that theme again to bash someone- because it worked the last time.> He's thought of in those terms, no question; my point was that it wasn't entirely fair (same with Ford).
Originally Posted By Dabob2 Skinner, I don't think you're being fair to vbdad55. He's more conservative than us, but so what? That's what makes the world go 'round. And he's fair minded and intelligent - just what we say we like around here.
Originally Posted By Donny Here is Mitt from June 3, 2011 <a href="http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/RomneyTo" target="_blank">http://www.c-spanvideo.org/pro...RomneyTo</a>
Originally Posted By Dabob2 Have you switched from being a Trump supporter to a Mitt supporter, Donny?
