Originally Posted By Expo_Seeker40 One thing fanboys tend to do is argue with the sweatshirt moms over Disney not being a museum....that is Walt's opinion blah blah blah. The thing is, while thinks change at Disney Parks all over the world, in Florida, WDW is gradually turning into a museum or time capsule of sorts. Sure....there's new hotels coming, a fantasyland expansion, and star tours 2, but let's look at some other things: The monorails are becoming heavily worn out. The Transportation and Ticket center has received no major enhancements since the early 1990s, which was slapped on top of the 1970s infrastructure. The bulk of the Magic Kingdom is still very much from the 70s. Half of Tomorrowland is from 1975 cosmetically. Space Mountain had minor enhancements and tweaks but is rough and old from the 70s. It's exterior has been powerwashed (atleast the top) but has not been repainted since 2005. The carousel of progress is very much as it was in 1994. Buzz Lightyear runs on a ride track created in 1972. Wishes is from 2003 and will most likely play as long as "fantasy in the sky" did. Parade floats are years old, some over 15 years old. The Main Street Electrical Parade will die a quiet death in Florida. It will not be going back to CA. The country bears (love it) still plays on from 1971. Tom Sawyer island has gotten worn out. There are closed restaurants and shops throughout the magic kingdom. At Epcot, there is still unused property for new countries. France still plays the same film from 1982. The universe of energy has not been updated since 1996. Test track not since 1999. (except for the post show) Circle of Life is from 1994, Living with the land from 1993? minus the new narration Great Movie Ride is from 1989 minus it's updated movie montage. Indiana Jones.....Muppet Vision.....the aging and getting smaller and smaller backlot tour. Animal Kingdom has not seen major changes since 1998.E:E is the big exception. Downtown Disney changes, but the bulk of it is still from the mid 90s remake. The water parks haven't changed or expanded greatly either. The harsh reality to Team Disney, is that WDW is no longer the top dog in the vacation capital. Walt Disney World has not produced anything significantly groundbreaking since E:E and the yeti animatronic (but he hasn't been working for a while). The new fantasyland won't have anything groundbreaking. It may have new things, but it's all been done before at some point. Instead, we have seen shops and stores close, we're being offered less, but get charged more. Team Disney wonders why fanboys go back and forth over the museum argument. I don't want to ride delta dreamflight....I don't care about 20,000 leagues under the sea....what I do wish would have remained in the walt disney world museum was the QUALITY and VALUE from the 70s and 80s. I spend more and get less at walt disney world. I go past closed or seasonal facilities and walk around DVC booths, and a cart selling crocks in adventureland, and a cart selling neon fans in tomorrowland. WDW, especially the magic kingdom has become an orlando six flags park. It's trashy. Team Disney knows it. Some of them feel bad about it. ...but they rely on the one target that will keep WDW stuck in the 90s and 70s....."the average guest"...the average guest knows nothing significant about WDW, they go a few times in their entire life....and if that means less changes, and bombard them with interactive things and merchandise then by all means do it. The average guest is easy to sell to. So, by 2015,don't be surprised that Ellen is still talking on a cell phone with an antenna, or spaceship earth's unfinished ending is still going strong, or that the circle of life film looks like its about to split apart from overuse, or why grandma is still playing the same video game from 1994, or why the sound system in country bears hasn't been repaired since its 2007 refurb.....it's because team disney can financially get away with it. While the two younger resorts up the highway continue to improve their product and bring a sense of value that walt disney world had in the 70s and 80s, walt disney world of the 21st century will continue to sink as an overpriced, overstimulating, expected, pixie dust and princesses brand that has become too much to the average person. Does team disney read yelp, tripadvisor etc? Do they see that even the average guest knows something isn't right, that the grandparents and parents who went once in a blue moon years ago, are now taking their kids to the parks for the first time and see how trashy and commercialized it has become? Sometimes I think those in their offices in the pretty little pink building off I-4 bury their head in their cubicle because they know how deep in crap WDW has gotten, and their only way of making money is to target the lowest common denominator.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 ^^Very, very well said. Lots of good points. I really don't disagree with any of them. But I bet Lou would ;-)
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer In short... WDW has peaked, yes? It's too big to support itself, and without massive spending and revitalization, it'll remain this way. Not everything can be updated all the time, which is certainly an issue, but the main issue is that nothing groundbreaking and new is being added. If that were the case, it'd be easy to overlook some of these issues.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip I more or less agree with a lot of what you say, but not at all with Impressions de France. As far as I'm concerned it is by far the finest attraction in the World Showcase and I would hate to see it changed. The photography is gorgeous and the soundtrack exquisite.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer ^^^ amd it was recently given a digital overhaul, from what I understand. Looks as fresh as ever.
Originally Posted By Bob Paris 1 "Lots of good points. I really don't disagree with any of them. But I bet Lou would ;-)" So you have read my posts about the afforementioned smarmy little Italian and decided to check him out, huh? Funny, I was just thinking yesterday how glad I am I gave his sanctimonious, TDO backside-kissing podcast the flick two years ago.
Originally Posted By Manfried The problem is they have that stupid admin building over by I-4. They should tear that building down and layoff all those useless suits.
Originally Posted By FerretAfros I pretty much agree with everything you said. For quite a while, WDW has been a microsm of what's wrong with today's business culture. The people working there now are getting the benefits for themselves, without leaving anything for future generations, both guests and the corporate types. The goodwill and reputation has been fading, and soon there won't be any left. I can only hope that they figure it out before it's too late. Sadly, that doesn't look like a possibility any time soon. >>...or spaceship earth's unfinished ending is still going strong...<< I'm still not convinced that anything else was ever planned for the ending. I think they knew what they could get away with, and built just that. Why add more, when you know that you can do less and get away with it.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>The problem is they have that stupid admin building over by I-4. They should tear that building down and layoff all those useless suits.<<< Please. (As in I approve, not as in I question this stance. LOL) >>>I'm still not convinced that anything else was ever planned for the ending. I think they knew what they could get away with, and built just that. Why add more, when you know that you can do less and get away with it.<<< Things were planned, but money and time ran out so we got the bare minimum...
Originally Posted By fkurucz >>I pretty much agree with everything you said. For quite a while, WDW has been a microsm of what's wrong with today's business culture.<< Being a "suit" is where it's at these days. Being an "individual contributor" is no longer a rewarding career option in most organizations, which is why on most college campuses the Biz Schools are bursting at the seams while the technical programs are a lot less popular than they used to be.
Originally Posted By standor Disney knows that people will come whether or not they give us a good product. If they don't have to they won't.
Originally Posted By Goofyernmost How do you define good product? Is Disney a bad product? If so, what of life's experiences do you draw on to make that comparison? What have you seen that is substantially better? In what way, that made a sizable difference? Do you think that Disney Parks reflect anything vaguely similar to real life? If so, is it better or worse then real life? What would it take to make you a completely happy camper?
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo Gooyernmost, I think it depends on points of comparison. I see modern Disney a lot like Coke in the 80's. New Coke was not as good as old Coke, and I feel new Disney is not as good as old Disney. I am hoping like CocaCola, they wake up and sort it out. But I do have to say, there are elements that are better elsewhere. Within the Disney empire I would say that Disneyland offers a higher quality product overall than WDW. In Europe, for theme environments, I would actually argue that Phantasialand and Europa Park offer better themed environments in their hotels than WDW or USO. Better shows too. Their attractions are still not quite though. But I like Pepsi as well as Coke, sometimes the trade off can be better value.
