Originally Posted By DAR In Iraq. <a href="http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/08/22/iraq.boy/index.html" target="_blank">http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/ meast/08/22/iraq.boy/index.html</a> Can someone enlighten me on this? This story just makes me angry. It just shows what monsters and what really what cowards these people really are. Real tough person there setting a five year old on fire. Real manly. Before the arguments start how this would never have happened had we not been there, just cut the crap, this is the same stuff that happened when Saddam was in power. I just can't fathom being that cold of a human being.
Originally Posted By Dabob2 There's a disconnect between this story and your questions. The motives behind this are still unknown (apolitical family vendetta? Could be. Sectarian violence/payback? Could be. We don't know.) Also, how could our presence in Iraq have stopped this? It seems to have been a cowardly, hit and run style attack and no one even knows the motive, let alone who did it. So how are we supposed to "fight" this? And if we're expected to occupy every country with horrible violence like this, we should be occupying Darfur and any number of other places. Moreover, it's simply not true this sort of thing happened with Saddam in power, at least not on the horrendous everyday scale we see now. If this WAS a particularly horrible example of a sectarian motivated attack, it's worth noting that Sunni/Shia violence was quite uncommon before we invaded, as Saddam would not stand for it or allow any Shia militias as they exist now. He himself was very brutal, but you didn't have to worry about your neighbor doing it to your 5-year old. Now you do.
Originally Posted By ecdc DAR, like Dabob, I see a complete disconnect between your question and the story. No one that I know says we "shouldn't fight terrorists." But it's exactly the black and white "we either fight terrorists or we don't" thinking that has us in this mess. Do we fight terrorists that attack us? Absolutely. (We aren't doing that right now - at least not well, since Al Qaeda is back to 9/11 strength levels.) What about terrorists that attack other countries? Suddenly that's a grayer issue. Are you really advocating that we get our military on the ground to help Israel fight Hamas and Hezbollah? But if we don't, we aren't fighting terrorists who are just as bad (or worse) than those in Iraq. Israeli cafes and buses have been blown up and children have been killed. What about the South American terrorists that have been operating for decades? When are we going to fight them? If you don't want us fighting over there, then you don't want us "fighting the terrorists." Welcome to the kind of silly, simple-minded attacks opponents of this war have been facing since day one.
Originally Posted By gadzuux Let's define terms a bit here. The person/people who did this are brutal savages, but not necessarily "terrorists", and unlikely to present any danger to US citizens. We didn't go to war in iraq because we don't agree with the islamic culture. And stories like this don't even begin to justify our presence in iraq. But I can understand your confusion because there IS NO justification for our being in iraq, and some people are still groping around looking for good excuses. There was a similar story a few months back about a family that dragged their daughter out into the street and stoned her to death (while the neighbors watched and took pictures) because she was in a relationship with a boy from outside their particular sect of muslim beliefs. Other stories circulated about the shooting of iraqi tennis pros - killing them in a hotel driveway - because they were wearing shorts. We don't have to agree with these people or even like them, but we don't have the right to invade their country because of our differences. Even if we did have the right, it's a bad idea, as we've seen. We're not going to bring these people around to our way of thinking, and if we kill them simply because we don't like their religion, we're no better than they are. Finally, don't allow yourself to get caught up in the trap of wishing other people harm due to whatever heinous act they have committed. It does nothing to them but reduces you as a civilized person. It's pointlessly reactive and you're just self-inflicting damage on your own peace of mind.
Originally Posted By ecdc Great post, Gadzuux. DAR, believe me, I'm just as appalled and disgusted as you are. Honestly. But getting myself all worked up and outraged doesn't hurt these people. It just hurts me. If I read a story tomorrow that the people responsible had been killed, would I shed any tears? Not a one. But focusing on it corrodes my humanity.
Originally Posted By jonvn The boy is getting help from around the world now. <a href="http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/08/23/iraq.boyfolo/index.html" target="_blank">http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/ meast/08/23/iraq.boyfolo/index.html</a> You can make a donation to his fund by going here: https://www.applyweb.com/public/contribute?s=childb There's a drop down menu under the "general donation" area that is marked "Youssif's fund."
