Originally Posted By dlkozy on the taxpayers! ABC did the investigative reporting <a href="http://abcnews.go.com/video/playerIndex?id=9402610" target="_blank">http://abcnews.go.com/video/pl...=9402610</a> I will be interested to see what Obama does about this. 5 million would provide a lot of jobs. Hope he is embarrassed.
Originally Posted By ecdc >>Hope he is embarrassed.<< You mean you want him to be embarrassed because you don't like him. What on earth does some FAA employees behavior have to do with Barack Obama? ABC filmed some FAA employees drinking after their training, going to bars, and hitting on people, and this is news? How desperate can you get to attack Obama? Did he have a spaghetti stain on his tie, too? Here's another newsflash: this is what businessmen have done for years in private industry. Now, if the cost is excessive, that's another story and that can be analyzed. Did they spend too much on the training? It was done at about $1,200 per person, which isn't outrageous when you factor in airfare and hotel rooms. But since when is it a problem for people to go out at night when they're on the road?
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder "I will be interested to see what Obama does about this. 5 million would provide a lot of jobs. Hope he is embarrassed." I would be interested to see you articulate what Obama's connection is to any of this and why he should be embarrassed.
Originally Posted By ecdc I watched this again. There's precious little footage, actually. It's interesting, when ABC first shows the footage of the event it's accompanied by loud party music. They do it again later when they start interviewing someone there. But then the music fades out and you realize it's not at all from the convention, but ABC just pasted it over the footage. Once it's gone during the interview, there's no music at all and it's clearly a low-key event. We also get split-second shots of alcohol and people drinking. This could have been at an opening night gathering. We certainly didn't see any footage of the training, which could have been all-day the next day. That's usually how these things go down. But if dlkozy or anyone else is concerned about the costs, then what they should really be complaining about is outsourcing, privatization, and contractors. There's a huge, multi-billion dollar industry out there of "corporate training," "leadership motivation," etc. These people charge obscene amounts to corporations for their trainings. Much of our government waste comes from stuff like that. 30 years ago something like the FAA would just put together their own training. Now, it's outsourced to private businesses that charge much, much more. That's your tax dollars at work and where the money really goes - not to some party.
Originally Posted By dlkozy It is amusing to see how some Dems react when something happens under O's watch and the way they reacted to when something happened under Bush's watch. Guess some have forgotten about O's pledge during the campaign about all the changes about government waste that he was going to fix. He has done little to nothing so far in that dept. >>>" But if dlkozy or anyone else is concerned about the costs, then what they should really be complaining about is outsourcing, privatization, and contractors."<<< I will be concerned about ALL the waste-not just the outsourcing etc. The FAA's booze junket was a WASTE of taxpayers money pure and simple. Under O's watch. As far as the training goes-those procedures have already been in place over 2 months-as was reported on the newscast. This was a multi-week long event with FAA management flying in from different parts of the country to attend and drink. This particular group had online training groups that accomplished the same kinds of things this so called training junket provided. Documents of that were on the report that was shown on TV. Loved it when ABC at the drinking part of the report asked FAA management about the event and they couldn't seem to say anything of value about it.
Originally Posted By dlkozy >>>" But since when is it a problem for people to go out at night when they're on the road?"<<< When millions of people are out of work and the taxpayers are paying for it!
Originally Posted By dlkozy >>>"Here's another newsflash: this is what businessmen have done for years in private industry"<<< Newsflash for you-this was not private industry.
Originally Posted By dlkozy >>>"ABC filmed some FAA employees drinking after their training, going to bars, and hitting on people, and this is news? How desperate can you get to attack Obama?"<<< This was filmed in the lobby of their hotel and the taxpayers picked up the bill. How desperate can you be to support O when things such as this are happening under his watch?
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan So, everything that happened "under W's watch" can be blamed on him as well? Ridiculous.
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder This still hasn't been answered: "I would be interested to see you articulate what Obama's connection is to any of this and why he should be embarrassed."
Originally Posted By DAR <<So, everything that happened "under W's watch" can be blamed on him as well? Ridiculous.>> Oh I'm sure if you ventured to the Democratic Underground you'd find that sentiment. Regardless it's a ridiculous sentitment regardless of who's President. Now I will admit that 5 million does seem to be a little high, but then again I'm the guy who cuts coupons, finds 2 for 1 deals, finds price adjustments when I can and saves up his money. Hell I've had the same car for 14 years.
Originally Posted By ecdc >>Guess some have forgotten about O's pledge during the campaign about all the changes about government waste that he was going to fix. He has done little to nothing so far in that dept.<< Can you enumerate how Obama's to blame for this? Can you show how this was government waste? Did Obama even know about this? Did he approve? Was he briefed? You haven't even drawn a link to Obama yet, but you want to blame him. >>I will be concerned about ALL the waste-not just the outsourcing etc. The FAA's booze junket was a WASTE of taxpayers money pure and simple. Under O's watch.<< You have no evidence that it was a waste of tax payer money. You don't know how much was spent on booze, you don't know how much was spent on training. You see the 5 million figure, you see the alcohol (since you don't drink) and then you label it a "booze junket" with absolutely no evidence to support you. >>As far as the training goes-those procedures have already been in place over 2 months-as was reported on the newscast.<< It's extremely common for personnel to be trained on something weeks or months after it's rolled out. I work for a very successful company and it even happens here. It's the nature of business. And that's really what this boils down to - a total ignorance of how business works. Ultimately, even if this is shown to be a "waste" then the link to President Obama remains non-existent. Claiming it happened "under his watch" shows a total ignorance of the size and scope of government, the slow wheels of government, delegation, etc. All it reveals is a deep-seated dislike of Obama and an attempt to smear him at every turn, then a weak attempt to defend it by saying, "Well people did it to Bush!" >>When millions of people are out of work and the taxpayers are paying for it!<< What evidence do you have that after-hours drinking in bars was paid for by the government? >>Newsflash for you-this was not private industry.<< But thanks to outsourcing and contracting promoted by Republicans, government is now run and beholden to private industry. It's how stuff's done. You can't sing capitalism's praises and defend contracting and private industry then turn around and whine when it doesn't go how you want it to. >>This was filmed in the lobby of their hotel and the taxpayers picked up the bill. How desperate can you be to support O when things such as this are happening under his watch?<< A logical fallacy and a weak attempt to turn the tables. Responding to ludicrous charges of Obama dropping the ball because this happened "on his watch" does not make me desperate to support him. It means I'm interested in fairness; assigning blame to Obama for this is not fair.
Originally Posted By ecdc Let's try this for you, dlkozy: A seven year old girl was sexually molested by a Mormon Sunday School teacher during worship services in an empty classroom. This happened on Gordon B. Hinckley's watch! After he promised to get rid of abuse in the LDS Church! I sure hope he's ashamed and embarrassed. How desperate can someone be to support him if they don't immediately denounce him for letting this happen on his watch! Same thing, dlkozy. Same thing.
Originally Posted By DAR <<What evidence do you have that after-hours drinking in bars was paid for by the government?>> Do you know how much some drinks cost?
Originally Posted By ecdc >>Do you know how much some drinks cost?<< Unfortunately, yes I bought one too many rounds the other night at my sister-in-laws birthday party. All I'm saying is I've been on business trips. The company will pay for my food and it's very carefully documented. If I want to hit the bar after the meetings, it's on my dime. If an FAA employee or supervisor inappropriately used FAA funds or credit cards for this, then it should be investigated. Apparently dlkozy thinks Obama himself should be on the case. Maybe he should cancel all his appointments, cabinet meetings, etc., fly to Atlanta immediately and inteview bartenders, examine receipts, and conduct polygraphs on employees.
Originally Posted By mawnck Better he fly to Atlanta and deal with this rather than plunge us into terminal Socialism with his Muslim Nazi abortionist death panel healthcare plan! Oops, sorry. It's just the drugs talking. ;-)
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt This is the biggest non-story ever and sloppy reporting to top it off. Where did the $5 million figure come from? The report never produced evidence to show that the FAA really spent that on the event.
