Originally Posted By jonvn Seems like our generally worthless Congress is starting to get the idea that something needs to be done. Even the White House has issued a 244 page report on what they are planning to do to combat the problem. A consensus is building on Capitol Hill as to the global warming issue, but partisan politics are working their way in to that as well. As always. Maybe they should each get a copy of that petition signed by the 17,000 scientists from ten years ago. That'd show them all it's all a giant left wing fraud. <a href="http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2006/09/23/WARMING.TMP" target="_blank">http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/arti cle.cgi?f=/c/a/2006/09/23/WARMING.TMP</a>
Originally Posted By Beaumandy Why would you do this jon? Why start the global warming BS again? If global warming is such a threat then the Kyoto protocol would have been a great idea. You know... cut down on that horrible CO2 gas. Hold on.... when Kyoto was voted on it only lost 95-0 in the senate. Maybe now jon you can get 4 or 5 votes!! Also, we are well over 17000 scientists who know man made global warming is a fantasy and a scam. Have a great day. I hope it gets to 90 degrees so I can lay out and get some last minute sun. But... that would make me selfish in the eyes of the global warming crowd. LOL
Originally Posted By jonvn At least the congress is starting to get it. And apparently it is common knowldege in DC that as soon as the current idiot in chief is gone, we'll have some more concrete work done in this area. Hopefully we'll be able to do something about it.
Originally Posted By YourPalEd <<<If global warming is such a threat then the Kyoto protocol would have been a great idea.>>> Every nation in our world joined it but the criminal, and known traitor, george bush. George bush would not sign, because all his friends make their fortunes, and mansions from poisoning everyone, including themselves.
Originally Posted By fkurucz I am now purchasing 600 kWh per month of wind generated electricty. It costs $9 more than regular juice. Regardless of its impact on global warming, it will help cut down on pollution generated by coal burning power plants, and that is a good thing!
Originally Posted By YourPalEd Visually the photos of the alps melting is scary. In china i hear the melting ice caps while killing off a lot of wild life, has also spread diseases. I believe the bird flu started in china higher up in the mountains. I believe that is where the flu was traced to.
Originally Posted By jonvn "I am now purchasing 600 kWh per month of wind generated electricty. It costs $9 more than regular juice." I frequent a winery where they have covered all the rooves of their buildings with solar power generating cells. They make an excess of power for what they need, and sell back the extra to the power company. Their meter actually runs backwards when they do this. It doesn't work all the time, though. Sometimes, they use more power than they can generate, which is not a shock since solar doesn't really generate that much power, but for the most part, they not only get buy, but they also produce an excess. Is there any reason we don't all have these things on our rooves now? Why is the government, if not mandating it, making it very plainly a thing that should be done? We have the technology now to not only massively cut down on greenhouse gasses, but to also rid ourselves of dependence on foreign sources of energy. Are we doing anything about it? Gee, no. Yet another failure on the part of our government to do what it is supposed to be doing. Instead, they're more worried about things like burning flag ammendments. How the government of this country is letting down the people in nearly every possible way is really a very sad thing to watch.
Originally Posted By DouglasDubh <Why is the government, if not mandating it, making it very plainly a thing that should be done?> It offers tax credits on solar energy use, as well as other energy saving devices. What more do you expect them to do?
Originally Posted By vbdad55 <when I was a kid is was global cooling, what a scam!< I do remember the covers of Popular Science showing the coming of the next ice age... so I am a little more cautious about jumping on board.
Originally Posted By YourPalEd <<<I am now purchasing 600 kWh per month of wind generated electricty. It costs $9 more than regular juice.>>> I even took in my electonics to a drop off spot they set up for a saturday. I have a bag just for aerosol spray cans to be recycled. I seperate out all paper for recycling. I also... oh you don't want to know. But again, as computers develop, you will need less and less electricity. Soon they will be able to operate or recharge will operating with solar panels, and possibly solar panel plug on's, so you can save your battery for after dinner, and before bed. Remember to zip up the tent. Those mosquitoes are 4 times as big as they used to be. Now that the birds are dead.
Originally Posted By Beaumandy << A consensus is building on Capitol Hill as to the global warming issue, but partisan politics are working their way in to that as well. As always. >> Funny jon how you start this thread and put a link about it that says members of congress have seen Al Gores movie so they are now starting to really think about this huge scam...err... serious issue. You even go back to the " consensus card " that you insist on playing as we laugh. Yet in the last global warming thread you kept saying Al Gore didn't matter when you were accused of buying into his propaganda. Nice consistency. No wonder I am on your "ignore list" as I point these things out.
Originally Posted By Beaumandy If you want a very good explanation as to why man made global warming, Al Gore style is totally bogus I would suggest you read this link. At that point you can take what was said and put it up against jon and his left wing " experts " who insist we are all doomed because man is causing the world to heat up due to all that bad CO2 gas. I see their scare tactics are getting them BILLIONS of dollars in research money. Mission accomplished!!! The Real 'Inconvenient Truth' Greenhouse, global warming - and some facts JunkScience.com April 21, 2006 Given the number of JunkScience.com readers expressing some confusion over the "greenhouse effect," carbon dioxide, global warming and climate change, we thought it might be a good idea to pull together a page of questions-and-answers, complete with a few nice little graphics explaining the facts. We thought that since there is long-standing, intense public interest in these topics and that vast sums of public and private monies are being thrown at the much-dreaded "problem" of "global warming," there should be a wealth of quality explanations and graphics to which we can point readers to alleviate their confusion. That was about the time that our quick project and quiet weekend went awry very quickly. Who would have thought so many "issue" sites, environment sites and, yes, government sites, could be hosting so much utter garbage on a topic subject to such intense scrutiny? Who could have imagined having to spend several hours wading through searches to find a few simple graphics correctly expressing the greenhouse effect? Who knew that so many blowhards are out there pontificating from complete ignorance? Some of the bad descriptions appear to be poor efforts at simplifying the material to suit grade school course work and the like, but that does not make them any more acceptable. Obviously a slight rethink of this project was necessary. We will now try to deliver an extremely simplified version of how this greenhouse thing actually works and some indication of what might be expected from what is known about the Earth and what has been measured, rather than simply guessed about. ( read it all! ) <a href="http://www.junkscience.com/Greenhouse/" target="_blank">http://www.junkscience.com/Gre enhouse/</a>
Originally Posted By Spree <<<It offers tax credits on solar energy use, as well as other energy saving devices. What more do you expect them to do?>>> Not good enough. We need to all go back to living like cavemen; no washing machines, hair dryers, lawn mowers, computers, tvs, automobiles, or plane trips(unless you are an important liberal enviromentalist on your way to a conference about the enviroment).
Originally Posted By fkurucz >>Is there any reason we don't all have these things on our rooves now? << One problem with photovoltaic cells is that it still takes more power to manufacture them than they will produce over their lifespan (at least according to the National Renewable Energy Lab in Golden). They are very useful in situations were running power lines is not practical.
Originally Posted By jonvn "One problem with photovoltaic cells is that it still takes more power to manufacture them than they will produce over their lifespan" If true, then of course that is a problem. Same thing is true of fuel cell technology. But only if we are concerned with energy conservation only and not simply the reduction of fossil fuels usage. The thing to do, though, in that case, is to not use fossil fuel to make these cells. I'm all for nuclear power. If we used that sparingly, in order to build other fuel saving tecnologies, then it becomes a bit easier to do. The main idea would be to get off of fossil fuel technology, not to reduce overall consumption of energy. Getting off of fossil fuels will reduce greenhouse gasses, and reduce our dependence on foreign sources of energy. We can do this now, by doing as much solar as possible. Fuel cells are expensive for cars, and are not about lowering energy use, but also about reducing fossil fuel use. We should not try to confuse the issue of energy conservation, and reduction of fossil fuel use. They are two different problems.
Originally Posted By YourPalEd The idea is to make transportation devices that weigh only 50 lbs., yet still, encase , and transport, one body, on one tank of fuel every 600 miles.
Originally Posted By fkurucz FWIW, wind generated power is making some strides. Our local utility often has waiting lists for people who want to purchase wind generated blocks (100 KWh). What truly encourages me is that is currently costs only 1.5 cents more per kilowatt hour, and even with that surcharge we are paying a lot less for juice than when we lived in San Diego and were at the mercy of SDG&E!! Of course it helps that its windy out this way.
Originally Posted By fkurucz Also, I tread this today in a Debra Saunders column: "The overwhelming majority of industrialized nations that signed on to Kyoto amid much fanfare haven't cut their greenhouse gases. In June, the United Nations reported that only two Western European signatories — Britain and Sweden — are on target to meet their greenhouse-gas reduction targets, which call for a worldwide reduction of 5 percent below 1990 levels in 2012. Spain is spewing more than 40 percent above its 1990 levels. Canada is 30 percent over. By comparison, Dubya's America looks good — emitting 16 percent more greenhouse gases than in 1990." So while we haven't signed on the dotted line, we appear to doing more than some Kyoto signatores. How can Spain be up 40%? They practically have Zero population growth. Did they all trade in their fuel efficient SEAT brand cars for SUV's?
Originally Posted By Kennesaw Tom The Kyoto Treaty really isn't about decreasing "greenhouse gases". If it was then why are the two fastest growing Industrialized nations exempt; India and China? Seems to me if you wanted to actaully decrease greenhouse gases wouldn't you want every country to participate? Also please note that two countries didn't sign the treaty, the USA and Australia.
