Originally Posted By dkleaphart Hi Folks, I'm in the process of writing a new book on Walt Disney World Railroads. The old Fort Wilderness RR is a key chapter. The RR ran back in the 1972-1982 timeframe. I want to include memories of camping at the Fort in those years, and maybe even riding the old RR. Photos would be a big plus. Any contributions would be clearly credited...............
Originally Posted By sjhym33 The first time we camped at Fort Wilderness the train was still running. I remember that we rode is several times. I also remember that we tried to hit the beds early one night because we were exhausted and could feel the train rumble past our site.
Originally Posted By dkleaphart Hi sjhum33! Fantastic! Can I interest you in jotting down some memories for publication in the new book?? David
Originally Posted By sjhym33 I amy be able to do that. I am sure you already know about this great site: <a href="http://www.fortwildernessrr.com/" target="_blank">http://www.fortwildernessrr.com/</a>
Originally Posted By brotherdave During my first Fort Wilderness stay in July 1980, the train was already mothballed. The tracks and stations were still there, but the trains no longer ran.
Originally Posted By dkleaphart Hi sjhym33 and brotherdave, Thanks for your postings. Thanks for the link and yes, I've been conversing with Dave Rose on the RR. I'm looking for memories from guests at the Fort that I can publish. They would be 1st person stories told "directly" to the reader. The stories can be your experiences camping at the Fort in those days; and if you can include references to the RR, all the better. Brotherdave, it doesn't matter that the RR had stopped running. The story(ies) would be your experiences with camping and seeing/exploring the remnants. All in all, I would like to include your words, not really mine. If I can interest you in contributing, please check my web site at www.steelwheelonsteelrail.com. It will give you some idea on the book, and my email address is there too! With email, we can converse about your contribution!! Thanks! David
Originally Posted By sjhym33 There were capacity issues, safety issues about the proximity to campsites, the land that the track ran on was soft and the tracks shifted. Take a look at www.fortwildernessrr.com it gives the whole story with some great pics. It seems all of the engines have been rescued from decay several years back and renovations started but the website doesnt have an update since 2004. Anyone know what the current situation with the rehab of the trains are?
Originally Posted By dkleaphart Hi Folks, The items you mentioned were certainly factors for the trains being discontinued. However, in essence, the main factor was money and Disney's view of its "return on investment".......The locomotives are now at home in California spread over three owners. All three of the owners are members of the Carolwood Historical Society. Brotherdave, a big THANKS! I got your email with some terrific memories and stories of your experience with the Fort and the RR!!! The book will be all the better..... David
Originally Posted By ImaginingDisney001 does anyone have one of the original FortWilderness Maps with the train layout indicated? I found one of the tressels last time I was at the campground and now I am interested where the tracks were laid. Thanks ID
Originally Posted By Kennesaw Tom I found a video of the Ft Wilderness Railroad on youtube. <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d3wshRnX0lY&feature=related" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...=related</a> But can not find a map. Perhaps there is a map in Michael Broggie's book?
Originally Posted By tonyanton very cool...wish they could find a way of bringing this back, along with River Country and campground canoe rentals!
Originally Posted By Kennesaw Tom Sure it added ambiance to the area.. but I have to admit I like getting into a nice air conditioned bus between campground and the parks. The MK has a steam railroad and that is good enough for me.
Originally Posted By magic0214 Hey Dkleaphart, I am really intrested to know when your book is published, please tell all of us LPers when it is done!
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo I take your point Tom, but this train was part of the Disney difference we used to know and love.
Originally Posted By iluvdisneyland "I found a video of the Ft Wilderness Railroad on youtube." Now that's a gem! Thanks, Tom!
Originally Posted By Kennesaw Tom The Ft Wilderness Railroad just looped around the park. So it was very limited and intended for internal campground use only, something that would be impractical today. The current Boone and Crocket buses not only provide internal transportation but also transport guests to the parks, the Wilderness Lodge as well DTD. Not to mention the fact that live steam engines can be dangerous and take some expertise to properly run and maintain. From what I was reading about the engines they had to be filled with water each time they made a loop around property. Also Disney attracts a larger crowd of guests that have a multitude of needs. The trains were never designed for strollers, wheelchairs, etc.
Originally Posted By ImaginingDisney >>>> The Ft Wilderness Railroad just looped around the park. So it was very limited and intended for internal campground use only, something that would be impractical today. <<<<<< This is interesting. I just came off a group of websites that talks about the Fort Wilderness Rail Road. The FWRR was only intended for intermal campground travel. It had no spurs to take it anywhere except to the parking lot/ticket office for fort wilderness. as impractical today, the track could have been extended where ever needed. Extending train track us much cheaper than extending the monorail track. >>>> The current Boone and Crocket buses not only provide internal transportation but also transport guests to the parks, the Wilderness Lodge as well DTD. <<<< Its been a year or so but they dropped the names and call the busses by color now, I think. been a couple years. The buses ran to the parks in the day of the train as well. The shuttles took over after the train stopped running but was quickly out grown and the buses took over. >>>> Not to mention the fact that live steam engines can be dangerous and take some expertise to properly run and maintain. <<<<< This is very true. These trains were appearantly automated to a state that Disney was putting ride operators on board to run the trains. I know when the water level started to drop in the boiler, a dangerous state, the train would shut down. A tea kettle is easy technology and a boiler is much like that. >>>> From what I was reading about the engines they had to be filled with water each time they made a loop around property. <<<<<< Yes, The train had to stop at the water tower by River Country for fuel and water. I read they needed to do this every time they came by the water tower or the train would stop somewhere along the track. >>>> Also Disney attracts a larger crowd of guests that have a multitude of needs. The trains were never designed for strollers, wheelchairs, etc. <<<< Neither were many other rides in the parks. they all adapted, as would have the train cars. The Train was an ICON and a popular attraction for FW. Disney knew everyone likes the old steam engines. The big reason for shutting the train down was the track system. There were many reasons why the track failed, marshy land, poor rock ballast, poor and improper track construction, and the small water tanks/fuel tanks for the engines boiler left the CM's no room to forget to fill with water and fuel. At one point, DISney actually rebuilt the entire track because of too many problems on the curve tracks. Someone had stated the trains were a safety concern near the camp grounds but I had just seen a map and the trains were not all that close, more by the road mostly. Another thing that may have helped the trains on the road to no where was the whistle. It was able to be heard for a mile, not so great for a campground with sites with in a short distance of the tracks. I think I read the train ran from 7AM to 11PM so the whistle would be like rooster waking you in the morning and would keep you up late at night. It was a great ICON for FW, and the whistle problem could have been limited. But the track problem was sever and at one point DISney stopped paying for improvements and it was a mater of time. If you are ever at the Whoop Dee Doo Revue, they have pictures of the FORT WILDERNESS RR Train on the upper floor walls on the south ( to the right as you walk in the double doors ). There are sites that have many good pictures of the train as well. Another memory now at the UnDISney site. ID
Originally Posted By ImaginingDisney I found this note about an expansion that was planned before the wars..... The FWRR was planned in this expansion, too bad it did not happen, take a read.... While it seems unlikely that the Fort Wilderness Railroad will ever return, there was a brief window in time during which it was poised for a revival. During the so-called “Disney Decade” of the 1990s, plans were underway for a new resort between the Wilderness Lodge and Fort Wilderness. Alternately called “Wilderness Junction” or “Buffalo Junction”, the hotel would be similar to Disneyland Paris’s Hotel Cheyenne. It would resemble the street of a western town in the late 19th century, providing a thematic link between the early frontier theme of Fort Wilderness and the early 20th century national park theme of the Wilderness Lodge. The hotel would combine lodging with dining venues, shops and entertainment; it would also allegedly feature a stateside version of Paris’s Buffalo Bill’s Wild West Show. Most important to our tale was that in order to provide day visitors transportation to these new attractions and River Country, a return of the Fort Wilderness Railroad was discussed to link Fort Wilderness, Wilderness Junction and the Wilderness Lodge. Sadly, due to tourism concerns stemming from the first Gulf War and accompanying recession, the 600-room Wilderness Junction was postponed in late 1992. It was re-announced as “Buffalo Junction” in 1993, but never heard from again. and you can find it here.... <a href="http://progresscityusa.com/archives/the-coolest-thing-youll-see-today" target="_blank">http://progresscityusa.com/arc...ee-today</a> ID
Originally Posted By sjhym33 We stayed at FW while the train was running. While it was a great themed transportation system, I can still remember trying to get to sleep early one evening and being woken up by the train whistle every 15-30 mins. Not fun.
