Originally Posted By nbodyhome >> Love makes you do crazy things. << There is such a thin line between love and hate. I would like to know what the whole story now is. Have I missed it? I think definitely more needs to be said, instead of just a couple of lines. It may have been a near tragedy, I have no idea! I still have popcorn in the pantry...
Originally Posted By mickeyboy43 [<<WDW's last good CM retired in 1988!>> wow, that show my age! I was six!] Wow i wasnt even born!!!
Originally Posted By nbodyhome >> [<<WDW's last good CM retired in 1988!>> wow, that show my age! I was six!] Wow i wasnt even born!!! << I was 22.
Originally Posted By juicer "Why don't you just apologize to me here for your "get back into your closet" post?" I have been going to this site for almost 4 years now and have always enjoyed it - But with posters getting comments like "get back into your closet" - Man oh man...what's going on?
Originally Posted By mousermerf Quick notes.. A) Someone on another magical board posted after returning from their trip - there was apparently a small electrical fire at DQ and they cleared the peeps out of the building. Just one person, but enough details to make it seem plausible. B) I've been on a sinking boat at WDW! Boat from WL to MK took on water - something about it had the rear dig into water and the wake to come over the side. Got as high as the base on the seat in the back rows. Everyone was fine, the CM noted it and did what it took to get us back to shore. There she spent a good 15mins exploring the bowels of the boat and making various phone calls. So, i dont think they're poorly trained, but things sometimes happen.
Originally Posted By nbodyhome I agree that things happen. Like sometimes, the monorail doors will slam shut if the driver makes an error (it has something to do with cycling on and off the train while it's stopped). You may be walking onto the monorail at that time. I have never seen it happen, but it can cause injury. THAT is driver error, though.
Originally Posted By danyoung After reading 84 posts all at once (well, a few less what with all the moderator editing), and while I have great respect for my friend the Spirit, I have to return to WilliamK's comment - >Face it, you look for any reason to slam WDW, even if it means exagerating the truth.< I don't know about "any reason", but it does seem as if you jumped the gun on this one. Pointing out an accident is one thing. Blaming it on a "lousy CM" with no more information than what you have doesn't quite seem fair.
Originally Posted By nbodyhome >> Blaming it on a "lousy CM" with no more information than what you have doesn't quite seem fair. << I do agree. I thought that there would be a quick follow-up to the story. I have certainly had some bad CM's (though a Disneyland one I just read about where a parking CM hit a guests car and said "hey, where the H*** do you think you are going"? pretty much takes the cake). I have had very few "lousy" CM's. Some, not so good. One who apparently thought my feminine protection (at DL) right after 9/11 was some sort of terrorist weapon and lifted it high out of my bag to ask me what it was. I did go to City Hall for that one, and told them that I thought they should have a chart so that all their male "security" could identify womens items.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 There wasn't a 'quick followup' because I wasn't able to speak to my friend until 20 minutes ago. I also don't consider this story, thankfully, earthshaking, so I hope no one was sitting on pins and needles but here are more details. The group of 11 took a NYE fireworks cruise out of the Poly Marina. They had an 18-year-old CM, who is a lifeguard and according to my friend 'got pressed into duty likely because it was New Year's Eve.' They hadn't been out more than five minutes when the boat began tilting to one side and some of the group freaked and screamed. The CM was caught off guard, even as water started coming on, and said 'oh, it's just the weight isn't even. one or two of you move to the other side.' He then started to speed up quickly saying he couldn't stay in that area. As he did so water began pouring over the front and the CM began to get nervous saying he had never had that happen. ''He freaked out and said we couldn't be over here and had to go quickly. I told him he needed to slow down that by going faster he was causing the water to come over. It didn't come close to capsizing, but it sure could have if we didn't yell at him to slow down. My mother (89) was in a wheelchair and very scared and even I'm not that great of a swimmer. It really could have been a tragedy that you read about where 4-5 people die. I asked him how deep the water was and he said 25 feet. ... there was one small light on the boat. I asked him if there were any life-preservers on the boat and he said oh yeah they're in there (pointing to a cabinet). They might as well have been left at the dock. I'm surprised that a safety conscious company like Disney would let an 18-year-old pilot a boat with no safety briefing, no nothing. How do you run a boat on a lake without putting life preservers on the passengers?' Those are the most pertinent details. I asked him if he asked to speak to management when he returned and he said he didn't want to get the kid fired, but that his sister was writing a letter to Disney. He also said that for $612 (no refund was asked for or offered) the view wasn't much better than standing on the beach.' He then asked me if as 'a Disney freak' what happened was something I've heard of and what he should do. My response was 'it's never normal when water is pouring over the deck' and that I wasn't sure. If he complains a week later, people in management might view him as someone trying to get something from the company, but at the same time, a complaint might wake someone up to not overschedule cruises on big money-making nights.' All things considered, the headline for the thread is pretty accurate. I can't speak to the kid's training because I don't know what he had. But I do know he wasn't able to react properly in a bad situation and he almost made it much, much worse. But at least the kid would have been able to perform CPR on them if they had washed ashore!
Originally Posted By Sport Goofy << They hadn't been out more than five minutes when the boat began tilting to one side and some of the group freaked and screamed. >> What was the angle of list? Had anyone in the group ever been boating before? Were they engaged in a turn. It would be unusual for a boat not to list to one side in the middle of a turn. If weight distribution was the source of the problem, that would have manifested itself from the moment they left the dock and I doubt would have caused a specific instance of "freaking and screaming." << He then started to speed up quickly saying he couldn't stay in that area. As he did so water began pouring over the front and the CM began to get nervous saying he had never had that happen. >> Were they crossing the wake of another vessel -- perhaps a ferry boat? Was the pouring of water momentary or continuous for a long period of time? It's not uncommon for water to come over the bow of a small boat when crossing a moderate wake. << How do you run a boat on a lake without putting life preservers on the passengers?' >> It's not a Coast Guard requirement. Disney would probably generate a lot more complaints from guests if they required life jackets to be worn -- they are very uncomfortable to wear for long periods of time out of the water. As long as people stay within the railings on the boat, there is very little risk of danger from not wearing a life jacket. << didn't come close to capsizing, but it sure could have if we didn't yell at him to slow down. >> Did the person make this assessment based on any experience with small boat? Again, what was the angle of list? I think capsizing was likely not even a remote possibility. I have sailed 44" sailboats on the high seas in extremely bad weather -- there was certainly risk of capsizing there, but a pontoon boat would require some really bizarre conditions to capsize. << there was one small light on the boat. >> What kind of lighting did the passengers expect? If the boat was underway and making way, it is only required to have on all around white light and the accompanying red/green sidelights. These are Coast Guard requirements. Anything additional to that makes it difficult for other craft on the water to distinguish boats on the water in order to properly maneuver according to Coast Guard rules that govern how waterborne traffic is supposed to behave. It would have been inappropriate (and against Coast Guard rules) to have any additional lights while the boat was underway and making way.
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder "All things considered, the headline for the thread is pretty accurate." With these details, certainly. Without them, no.
Originally Posted By MPierce >> Damn straight. WDW's last good CM retired in 1988! << TDLFAN left that long ago? >> >> [<<WDW's last good CM retired in 1988!>> wow, that show my age! I was six!] Wow i wasnt even born!!! << I was 22. << << A mere child. Thanks for the follow up story Spirit. My own personal opinion is this young Lad should not have been driving the boat. OH PLEASE, nobody say anything bad about me for my opinion! I've got a great idea!!! Why don't we all walk in lock step, and sprinkle pixie dust on each other!!! I can't believe there was that many ADMIN'S last night, and I wasn't a part of it.
Originally Posted By Sport Goofy << My mother (89) was in a wheelchair and very scared and even I'm not that great of a swimmer. >> I would fault Disney for allowing an 89 year old woman in a wheelchair to participate in a thing like this. It's one thing to put someone like that on a relatively large and stable ferryboat, but completely inappropriate on a much smaller pontoon boat. It's great that Disney can accommodate people this way but I don't think I would allow it. I've been around boats and the water my whole life and there is always an amount of danger in operating boats. Adding the element of frailty and old-age to the mix is not a good thing.
Originally Posted By Sport Goofy << All things considered, the headline for the thread is pretty accurate. >> Hardly. Was the CM "lousy" or lacking in some amount of experience? What about the passengers on the boat -- they apparently lacked in boating experience, too and may have caused more commotion than was really warranted. Maybe the guests were lousy, too based on your liberal use of the word. Was it a "near disaster?" I doubt it. Everything described in the "detailed" version sounds very familiar to me as someone who has a lot of experience operating boats -- including pontoon boats. I can't envision any sort of "disaster" that might have taken place based on the description provided. It sounded to me like a very normal small boating event. People who are used to being on small boats like this wouldn't have been surprised at all. It sounds to me like the guests had an unreasonable expectation for what sort of things might happen on a pontoon boat excursion.
Originally Posted By nbodyhome >> can't believe there was that many ADMIN'S last night, and I wasn't a part of it. << I was reading everything last night, and I'm not sure what was deleted! Denise
Originally Posted By mickeyboy43 [ can't believe there was that many ADMIN'S last night, and I wasn't a part of it. ] I know, i was doing history HW for the holdidays... Yeah, that couldve been dangerous.
Originally Posted By danyoung I find myself in complete agreement with Sport Goofy - a rare thing! I also grew up around boats. And this sounds like a combination of an inexperienced skipper combined with passengers who didn't really know what to expect in this type of craft. If there's any fault here, it's with the manager who posted the kid to captain the boat. So perhaps a title of the thread should be "Inexperienced CM Involved With Minor Boating Incident". Lousy? Uncalled for. Near tragedy? Not even close. Also, I want to see that 44" boat that Sport Goofy had out on the high seas - that's an itty bitty boat!
Originally Posted By Sport Goofy << Also, I want to see that 44" boat that Sport Goofy had out on the high seas - that's an itty bitty boat! >> Yup, we all got shrunk down to atomic level to fit in that one. Of course, feet not inches -- still too small to be out navigating in 20 ft seas. I'll never do that again!
Originally Posted By nbodyhome Unlike some, I don't have much boating knowledge. But, considering that pontoon boats are rented out to guests with just a few minutes instruction (just like the speedboats are), I can't imagine that they are difficult to operate. That doesn't mean that they can't be dangerous (a boater could collide with a ferry, for instance), but it isn't something that probably needs much training. I've been on pontoon boats many times - no issues yet, except for people spitting off the side of the bridge in Epcot. Yuck.
Originally Posted By CMDad <<>> [<<WDW's last good CM retired in 1988!>> wow, that show my age! I was six!] Wow i wasnt even born!!! << I was 22. >> Dare I admit that I was 35? Or that my son was 8 - my daughter 10? Do you realize what that makes her next birthday? Arrrrrgh!!!!!
