Originally Posted By AutoPost This topic is for Discussion of <a href="http://www.LaughingPlace.com/Lotion-View-1291.asp" target="_blank"><b>LP Lotion: The New Blue Sky Cellar at Disney California Adventure</b></a> Video and pictures of the newly updated Blue Sky Cellar at Disney California Adventure including a complete video of the film that plays inside.
Originally Posted By Schmitty Good Vibes Gret update! Two things I really liked were the CM's costumes and how much inspiration they took from the original Flying Saucers poster for the Luigi's Flying Tires poster.
Originally Posted By Dabob2 ...to the point of having one rider per "tire" on the poster, though in reality it they'll fit two.
Originally Posted By FerretAfros I saw this in person a couple weekends ago, but never really got a chance to talk about it. I think it's interesting to see how the videos have progressed through the various iterations of the Blue Sky Cellar. The first few were pretty straightforward about what the changes were going to be, and what we could expect; they were also about 5-7 minutes long, which was great for strolling by and catching most of it. While it's not nearly as bad as the Buena Vista Street video, the current one no longer focuses on the attractions and changes, it gets all touchy-feely. They do talk some about what we can expect to see, but it's all about how we'll feel while we're there. Maybe they think that this is a better way to connect to audiences. However, I'm a technical person, I want to know what will be there; I don't really want to hear about your feelings. It's great that the Imagineers are so passionate about what they're doing, but these last couple videos have just seemed very strange to me. Add in the comically long length (at 12 minutes, it's the second longest attraction in the park, behind MuppetVision), and it just doesn't work for me. And they talk about how the best thing that Disney does it take guests to places they've never been before. I believe this is true. However, I've been to Radiator Springs before; I saw the movie. While after watching the video I have no doubt that the additions will be high-quality, I really have to question their timelessness and relatability. Yah, Carsland seems like a fun idea. But give it 30 years. Will it still be good? Will guests still relate to it the same way that people are reacting to New Orleans Square or the pavilions at Epcot? Those are also ultra-immersive environments, but they seem to have a broader appeal. I know that Harry Potter has been a huge success at IOA, but I even question how great that will be in 30 years. For the amount of money Disney is spending on this thing, it better not feel like it needs a massive overhaul in a couple decades; I just don't think that will be the case. *rant mostly over* But overall, the changes to the Blue Sky Cellar are nice. It's good to get a more detailed look at what is appearing to be a very detailed area. It will surely be well executed for the theme; the more I hear, the less convinced that it's the right theme for the long haul. Thanks again for the update! It's always great to see what details they've hidden in the Blue Sky Cellar. Anybody know what their plans are for it after Carsland opens? Any chance we'll get Seasons of the Vine back?
Originally Posted By oc_dean ^^^^ Let me take a guess ... They didn't just speak in a "Brady Bunch" way ... they spoke in a "Brady Bunch 1995 movie parody" way. Right? More syrup than an IHOP breakfast! ;-)
Originally Posted By oc_dean You know ... there was a time ... when current and future projects were spoke in a tone, that really made you feel the enthusiasm. But it's seems so forced now, it's really a turn off.
Originally Posted By oc_dean This is an interesting read: <a href="http://micechat.com/forums/disneyland-resort/163914-modern-disney-difference-enthusiasm-vs-selling-future-projects.html" target="_blank">http://micechat.com/forums/dis...cts.html</a>
Originally Posted By FerretAfros Haha, now that you mention it, I really can't get the image of faux-Carol Brady out of my head! I know that I don't react to 'emotional' situations the same way as most people (I analyze the situation, and if there's nothing I can do to make it better, that's the end of that. Despite being a good listener and rememberer, I don't really sympathize well.) so these recent videos just haven't connected with me. It's great that your daughter loves Cars, lady; just tell me about what you're building please. With one of the old versions, my friends and I created a fun little game: on your way in, stop at the wine bar. Once the video starts, take a sip every time they use an unnessecary adjective. If you're not done by the time Mary Niven says "really really great and wonderful", bottoms up! The newer versions just aren't as fun as the 'good old' ones. I guess we could drink every time they say "feel" (or a synomyn), but we'd need several drinks to get through the new director's-cut-length video! : )
Originally Posted By FerretAfros I've only gotten through the first page of that thread, but they've hit on a LOT of my major gripes with the company lately. It is interesting to see how big of a change they've made in their approach over so little time. I know that they felt like they didn't have much to say to the average guest about Buena Vista Street (perhaps rightfully so), so I'll give them a 'pass' on that video, but this one just seems so strange. It focuses on so much, but manages to have so little. With 12 minutes to talk about 3 attractions, a couple restaurants, and a handfull of shops, you'd think they'd get a lot in; but it's just a lot of people trying oh-so-hard to connect with the audience. Even John Lasseter (and the ever-moving camera) gets into the act. I had another rant I posted a little while ago (I've been on a roll tonight) in a John Carter thread, and I think that a lot of the recent stuff really boils down to Iger's insistence on pushing the existing properties at the expense of trying something new. He knows that guests like certain types of things, so why not give them to us? But at some point (which the studio is rapidly approaching), you run out of old things, and don't really remember how to make anything new. And with all the remakes/spin-offs coming up, it doesn't appear that they're pushing the envelope any. If only you aim to meet expectations, how can you ever exceed them?
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt "Maybe they think that this is a better way to connect to audiences." Of course it is. Hasn't one of the primary complaints been that DCA was too "hip and edgy" and didn't have the heart and warmth that has traditionally defined Disney Parks for decades? What you're witnessing is a fundamental change in the way these projects are being developed and sold to the public from the top down. Disney has heard us loud and clear, and that's a good thing.
Originally Posted By SuperDry <<< sold to the public >>> I think a lot of what was wrong with the original DCA was that it needed to be sold to be understood. In a venue like Blue Sky Cellar or online promotional videos, there's going to be some amount of salesmanship going on, and that's to be expected. But as for the general park-goer and how they perceive something new, it has to just work on its own merits. The guest doesn't necessarily have to understand the mechanisms used or why or how they work (and I don't mean mechanical mechanisms), but they have to work nonetheless. Much of the original DCA just didn't work. Take for example Hollywood Studios Backlot. Years later, I learned from Tales and other sources that it was supposed to be not only kitschy, but that the point was that YOU the guest were the Hollywood star. This notion was totally lost on me during my first visit, and it was a contributing factor to leaving the park early that day completely disappointed. Hopefully, what they've done with the new stuff will be able to more or less "sell itself" to the general public and be understood intuitively without people having to think about it much or have to go through some sort of "guest training" in order to learn what the proper viewpoint to have is.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt All that is true SuperDry, but Disney has to do some flex some marketing muscle with any major theme park project today much in the way that the Disneyland TV show sold Disneyland Park to the American public back in 1954. The marketing team's job is to get folks excited about what's been baking in the oven for the past few years and I think the return to a tone that underscores creativity, uniqueness, and Disney attention to detail are a welcome change. Just compare the presentations and messaging in Blue Sky Cellar to the incredibly bland DCA Preview Center circa 200 (<a href="http://tinyurl.com/6mzg73a" target="_blank">http://tinyurl.com/6mzg73a</a>) and the awful 2001 TV adverts for DCA and you'll see what I mean.
Originally Posted By FerretAfros >>What you're witnessing is a fundamental change in the way these projects are being developed and sold to the public from the top down.<< I guess, but I really wouldn't consider the old style of videos "hip and edgy". They were like something you'd find on the Travel Channel, explaining what was going to be there and what you should expect from it. If anything, the recent ones feel a lot more modern, with cameras that are constantly moving (zooming in slowly, or moving by on a dolley) in interviews, and people sitting in front of a blank background, while the old ones had a fixed camera looking at someone in the construction area or next to a model of what they were making. Maybe the switch was always a part of their plan (it is hard to get touchy-feely about the Swings redo), but it just seems strange that there's such a contrast. The recent ones do feel a lot more corporate than the early ones ("I am an Imagineer."), constantly reminding us that it's a Disney Park (Trademarked, Registered, Copyrighted).
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt Which old ones are you talking about Ferret? Circa 2000 or more recent? Or are you talking about vintage clips like the one that OC linked to? What I'm talking about is the spirit of the recent promotions. Everything about them seems much more "Disney" to me than what we've seen in recent years. Again, the slapdash DCA Preview Center compared to the elaborate storytelling of the Blue Sky Cellar pretty much sums up the difference.
Originally Posted By FerretAfros I was talking about the first few videos that they had at the Blue Sky Cellar. Living on the other side of the country at the time, I (mercifully?) never got to see the vast majority of the initial DCA marketing. I knew that they were building another park, and on one visit after being away for a few years, suddently there was a fully-built-but-not-yet-open theme park sitting there. I didn't have a chance to actually go inside the park until I came back for the 50th. From what I can tell of the early DCA stuff (what was actually in the park, rather than the marketing), it was well intentioned, but just wasn't what guests were expecting or wanting. Having also visited WDW several times (in fact, I went to WDW many times during DCA's early days, which was part of the reason I didn't make it to DCA until much later), I had a more broad definition of what it means to be a Disney park, and I think that I would have enjoyed a lot of the early stuff. Yes, they underbuilt the place, gave it a strange layout, and could have made it a whole lot prettier, but the stuff that was there all seemed to be pretty good. It was just so different from DL that the west coast crowds didn't know how to react.
Originally Posted By TP2000 I'm glad I'm not the only one who feels that way about the current videos in the Blue Sky Cellar. What I think we're seeing on display here in those videos is some basic ego and narcissim on the part of WDI. It comes off more as a celebration of the Imagineers who worked on it, rather than a celebration of the theme park they are building. It takes some healthy ego to create that type of film, and then display it publicly to a paying audience who is assumed to care about the Imagineers feelings instead of the Imagineers products. The current video is the worst of the recent ones, and in several sections it feels like a morale-boosting video they would play at the WDI company Christmas party for a WDI-only audience. Big chunks of it don't quite feel right to be shown to a public audience who just wants to know what new rides are coming to the theme park they pay money to get into. And when the middle-aged man Imagineer begins to cry in the current video, I literally cringe. Yes, Imagineers are humans with all of the same emotions all other humans have. But it's a bit presumptuous of them to assume we are so interested in their human foibles that we need to know how this one section of ride track on the race car ride reminds him of childhood road trips with his late father and brings him to tears conveniently caught on video tape. I just need to know how cool the ride is going to be, and then let me create my own memories and emotions for it please. I am the customer paying for your product, and it's my emotions that matter more than yours, to be very blunt. The Cellar videos have become very touchy-feely, and a tad creepy. But the underlying tone is a celebration of the people who work for WDI, and not the products they are creating for their client (theme park operations) who have paying customers to entertain on the rides (us, the DCA guests). It's a good thing this is the last Blue Sky Cellar video, because they've swam too far into the deep end of the pool with this last one.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt "I (mercifully?) never got to see the vast majority of the initial DCA marketing." It was bad to nonexistent, and probably the single biggest misstep in the launch of the place.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt "The Cellar videos have become very touchy-feely, and a tad creepy." I haven't seen them, so I can't speak to that point, but what you describe sounds weird.
Originally Posted By FerretAfros Hans, check out the video of the video in the LP update, liked in the first post of this thread and at the bottom of each page. That guy starts talking at about 8:30, and the tears start about a minute later. It really is a unique combination of bizarre and uncomfortable. While I initially hadn't taken it as an ego trip, I can see how these newer films do stroke the egos of the people at WDI. It seemed to me that they were more a victim of increased budgets (Blue Sky Cellar was successful, so add more money. With more money, the filmmakers get more adventurous. With more adventure, more schlock.), but after reading your interpretation, it really does seem like Egos Gone Wild. I guess it's assumed that we care about their feelings, because we'll soon be able to have feelings like those of our own. But frankly, I want to experience it for myself. Just give me some sort of expectation of what's going on over there, and leave it to me to draw a conclusion. But when big budgets and big egos get involved, that's seldom the case. It seems like they were trying to create an attraction on its own with this film, rather than just a preview for other attractions. Sadly, they failed at both.
