Originally Posted By vbdad55 <I believe that if hillary makes it to the oval office, the remaining republicans in DC will be so contentious that they'll create roadblocks for any meaningful legislation or reform. I don't see that they would be quite as obstructionist with an obama administration. But I've been wrong before. < unfortunately those who will be obstructionists ( on both sides of the aisle) will likely continue to be so because we have allowed them to be. There is no innocence on either side btw... look at the loading up of the stimulus package also -- does anyone think it was unreasonable to ask that illegals don't benefit from it ? My hope would be that a McCain presidency would make some of the far right idiots in the GOP outcasts - and get rid of them - and that some of the Dems that won't work with the GOP because they can't stand that same group - also become slightly more centrist at the same time. Then maybe people can approach future elections without having a feeling that if the 'other party' wins - the end of the world is near.
Originally Posted By gadzuux Well, look what happened in 2000. And guess what - the end of the world is closer than it was seven years ago. Look where we are today - mired in two wars - both of which we started, and one of which was wholly unjustified. Record deficit spending, a crushing debt load, economy spiraling into the tank, rampant corruption within our government, and no accountability from the people who actually got us here. That's a far cry from 2000. Both parties are not the same. Even during the clinton administration, priority one among the GOP controlled congress was going after the clintons hammer and tong over anything they could find. We haven't seen the same from the democratic controlled congress and the bush administration. What hearings have been held have been about actual issues - sanctioned torture, the corruption of the justice dept into a partisan attack machine, and violations of the constitution's protection against unreasonable search. All of them justified by actions and misdeeds of this administration. And even then, nothing close to an actual indictment has been presented. There's no reason to believe that the GOP won't resurrect their same old animosities should hillary be president. We'd be hearing about the travel office and whitewater for the next eight years. That won't happen with obama.
Originally Posted By planodisney you have got to be kidding with that analyisus gadzuux. Denocrats have been chasing Bush around D.C. with a nuece ever since the 2000 election because of their anger over the outcome. From day 1 this guy has been called a liar, theif, killer, hitler, fascist, idiot and the list could go on and on. The democratic leadership went on a strategy of angeringing the party faithfull with any tactics possible and were willing to to put a party victory in the 2006 election ahead of solutions to win in Iraq, getting the population fearfull of the economy, which can create a recession. they didnt care about any of that, just give us power baby. They have done squat since they have been in office and in fact have behaved axactly the way they promissed they American people they wouldnt. Hence the lower approval ratings for the Democratic congress than for the President. Now, I could begin a list of all the stupid mistakes the GOP have nade in the last few years, but those already get beat to death here on a daily basis anyway.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan Denocrats have been chasing Bush around D.C. with a nuece ever since the 2000 election because of their anger over the outcome.<< That's knot how you spell it. But seriously, there was indeed anger over the 2000 election. However, after 9/11, people rallied around this president not just in this country, but around the globe, at unprecedented levels. And that was all squandered. Now all but the most blindly partisan are sick of this administration and the messes they've made. It's also why no matter who wins, we'll be better off.
Originally Posted By Mr X **But seriously, there was indeed anger over the 2000 election. However, after 9/11, people rallied around this president not just in this country, but around the globe, at unprecedented levels. And that was all squandered.** This is exactly what makes me so angry about Bush, AND his followers. Living abroad, I saw firsthand the huge amount of goodwill our nation was offered after the attacks. It was indeed heartwarming, and I felt the potential for a true global community more powerfully than ever before. And we threw that away. Not only threw it away, but basically said "screw you" to the world community at large that was firmly in our corner. Every time I'd mention it, one of the Bushies would come back and say something like "why cares what they think?". Well, I care.
Originally Posted By ecdc Step aside SPP, we have a new King of the Typos. I love how Bushies try and equate the blind hatred conservatives had for Clinton with the kind of disgust almost everyone has for Bush. If it weren't so absurd and transparent, it might be quaint.
Originally Posted By dshyates "Denocrats have been chasing Bush around D.C. with a nuece ever since the 2000 election because of their anger over the outcome." That and the perpetual investigation of Bill Clinton. Hundreds of millions of dollars and how many investigations to come up with, he had a consensual extramarital affair, oh, and lied about it.
Originally Posted By Sport Goofy Bill Clinton raised taxes on the wealthy and subjected himself to 8 years of partisan attacks as a result. The lesson learned? Don't mess with the monied interests of this country. If Obama or Clinton make a reversal of the Bush tax cuts their priority when they get into office, either one of them will face the same challenges from the Republicans for as long as they are in office. The sorts of things aren't about ideology -- it's all about money. The wealthy people in this country will fight tooth and nail with anyone that tries to siphon off some of their largesse.
Originally Posted By dshyates "Bill Clinton raised taxes on the wealthy and subjected himself to 8 years of partisan attacks as a result. The lesson learned? Don't mess with the monied interests of this country." He also pushed through the largest increase in the minimum wage in the history of the country. This really pissed of companies like McDonalds and DISNEY who employ huge numbers of low end workers. You are absolutely right in the facts as to why they pounded him so badly. Greedy spoiled rich people. Bill used the money he took from the rich people to clean up the mess W.'s dad and Reagan left with the disasterous "Trickle Down" debacle. I love listening to the Reaganites talk about how it worked, "it only took time for it to reveal the benifits". Yeah, time, and Bill forcing it to actually trickle down. Before that I believe the biggest benifactor of the trickle down theory was all the new Science Buildings and Libraries with CEOs names on them the Ivy League schools were gifted.
Originally Posted By fkurucz >><<Again, as someone from Illinois who has watched this man become so very popular - except for moving oratory, why?>> Two Words: Integrity. And Integrity.<< This is what got Jimmy Carter elected. It didn't help him a lot the second time.
Originally Posted By fkurucz ^^^I seem to recall on his concession speech that he reminded the electorate: "I never lied to you".
