Originally Posted By Kayoss I just posted a lengthy reply in the Tokyo board about how I feel that the Tokyo Disney Resort expansion was, at least in part, a freak occurrence. WDI had SO MUCH money to spend, so beyond their wildest dreams, it's likely we'll never see another "Mount Prometheus" built ever again. Certainly not with the build quality (visible 360 degrees around and inside), the marble, the crazy detail work that anyone who's been to DisneySea (and involved with architecture) is dumbfounded to see. And while we know DCA was built (and largely designed) around the same timelines as DisneySea, they came out quite different (something to do with $$$) But..that reality and soap opera aside (this is NOT what this thread is about).... I went to Tokyo and then, upon my return, went to the Disneyland Resort (what can I say, I'm sick) and I specifically looked for stuff that compares to the quality of DisneySea. I thought at first I'd find nothing, and for the most part, that's largely true. But every now and then, some wonderful similarities pop up at our home base resort, and I wanted to show you what (in my opinion) is very much DisneySea quality in our own backyard: Most, perhaps surprisingly, is in DCA. The thing here is (of course) most of it is themeing without an attraction. TDS is guilty of some ‘empty theming’ as well, but has so many E Tickets of high quality, that it’s not focused on by fans. DCA doesn’t have an E Ticket home-run outside of Soarin’ (which is now sadly cloned)...which makes it look more pathetic then it actually is. With 1.2 Billion coming for our resort... I thought it would be nice to look at what’s already there, and why I think it can actually be a really cool park in the end. Chief things I noticed: Probably obvious, but the whole Grizzly River Run area, particularly the portion as you walk towards the bridge lift just passing the tiny SF alley near Paradise Pier, is absolutely stunning. It’s so immediately beautiful, and wondrous that it makes the shortcomings of DCA stand out even more... thusly making it very underrated in the theme park community. But really, this is quite a work of art! Next time, really spend some time to admire the enormous water wheel, the huge timber in the lift hill, the (while not that tall...still nicely done) bear as the mountain.... even the landscaping (now that it’s grown in). There’s some totally DisneySea- stuff in here. Especially on that ‘back alley’ path under the lift and beyond, where you see (‘needless’ to some, but essential in Disney architecture) theming details like the mine train, railroad tracks in the cement, and one really wonderfully done waterfall after the other. The actual rocks mixed with chicken-wire/plaster rocks. There’s some great visual tricks going on here. Next time you pass by that little nook next to where people watch the rafts go down the spinning drop, try and see if you can pick out the real, authentic Yosemite region boulders that are mixed in with the Disney-made ones. I think you’ll be pleasantly surprised at the care put into this. I always say this, but I’ll say it again: the Sorcerer's Workshop in the animation building (except for the unfortunate bare ceiling) is absolutely, 100% DisneySea quality in it’s build. I get chills every time I walk in there because I’m reminded of the dozens of similar rooms throughout Fortress Expeditions. Pay close attention to quality of the walls and their curves, the deep, rich paint job, the copper and metal, the light fixtures, the heavy cranks.... it’s a first class job. My only nitpick would be the magic mirror, only because it’s done so much better in the little mermaid walkthrough at DisneySea (higher-definition... with Ursula) although it’s still a wonderful touch. It’s especially apparent as you move into the next room, the library, which (although wonderful in concept) has cheap wire mesh bookshelves contrasting with the fabulous (and incredibly beautiful) rose effect... making the rest of the room’s budget cuts seem to stick out more. Same with Ursula’s Grotto... some wonderful DisneySea touches, but far short of the previously mentioned DisneySea walkthrough. It’s amazing then, and certainly very special that (sans the ceiling) we got such an amazing Sorcerer's Workshop. I always visit here at least once during every visit to the resort, because it always brings back such great memories. Flik’s Flyers in A Bugs Land (although a little kid’s ride) is incredibly intricate in design... right down to the amazingly crafted wood n’ leather cue posts. Same with the entrance to “It’s Tough to be a Bugâ€.. some great rockwork in the forced-perspective exterior... and modest but quite effective theming in the interior. (Those mushrooms, sware to God, were cast from the same mold as the mushrooms inside Journey to the Center of the Earth just sans the over-the-top lighting effects of the Tokyo attraction) That big train converted into an ice cream shop near the entrance. Just superb work. The “Wharf†area looking back from the bridge crossing to Paradise Pier. The detail in the paint and aging here is like a super-mini version of New York Harbor. Yes, there’s no interiors (unlike Tokyo) but man! The artistry is right there! You can see the amazing talent behind it. The interior (and exterior) of the ‘wine cellar’ room where you watch the wine movie. That whole wall of fake barrels. How the doors slide open to reveal the current season. The movie may be bland, but the cellar itself is outstanding. - Roz in Monster’s Inc (along with a couple of the “Jack Sparrow†figures in Pirates at Disneyland) are Disneyland’s Resort’s first next-next generation AA’s, which are used extensively throughout DisneySea. And last but not least, the lobby (just the lobby mind you) of our Tower of Terror matches the quality of Florida’s (perhaps surpassing it) and comes close to Tokyo’s. The boiler room I feel is lit too much like Toontown... but nevertheless has some outstanding sculpture work. Tokyo’s just has more to look at... Florida’s is darker... but, refreshingly, they’re all different. DCA boasts having the most thrilling ride out of the three, with the smoothest (and most thrilling) drop... compared to Tokyo’s version feeling toned down in comparison due to the use of shoulder restraints. (Florida’s tower still is king as far as the ride goes.... as I’m a huge fan of the 4th Dimension ‘dark ride’ portion) And that’s really it. Everything else I can think of has too many flaws and shortcuts to even be possibly mentioned in the same breath as Tokyo, but these little existing details show me there’s talent alive and well for CA, and makes me really excited for the future.
Originally Posted By Kayoss -- wanted to add a couple oversights.... "Buzz" in our Tokyo-cloned "Astroblasters" is another next-next generation AA.... and TOT is certainly an E Ticket, but I forgot to say DCA doesn't have another home-run-out-of-the-park *original Disney-style* attraction now that Soarin' has been cloned (which I think is severly overrated anyhow...) Screamin' is cool, but with so many coasters in Southern California, it's 'just not uniquely Disney' enough to be counted in my book. I can't wait for DCA to get some fantastic original attractions.
Originally Posted By dennis-in-ct Nice perspective. You really hit on the corners and details I also find most endearing to DCA. I have never been to TDS so I can't compare to that theming but I do know what I was impressed with during my DCA visits. I flew from Connecticut 3 months after DCA opened to check it out. Been there twice since (including the 50th). My impressions were a lot different than all the negative spins I kept reading online. (THAT should have been applied to WDSP - for *real*) Anyway - I remember thinking that the Animation Building, EUREKA!, Steps In Time, and SOARIN' were worth the price of admission alone. The place was a nice start - sort of the MGM in the beginning and I knew it would grow. The Animation Buidling is stunning. And I was sooo disapointed that the WDW version in MGM was such a cop out as was the Paris version. How could they NOT duplicate this place int he other locations. For gods sake man!! the MGM and Paris locales make me feel I am in a mall at a photo kiosk. AWFUL!!!! Grizzly Peaks is stunning and gorgous. And I have that little area on video. I remember being very impressed at the details. Same goes for the other locales in the park you mentioned - You mentioned all my favs. Another details I was impressed with was the tile work near SMOOZIES. I look forward to seeing the TALENT call the shots and "have at it" with DCA I look forward to watching and reading all the updates on LP. It will be another exciting time for LP to track and follow this whole process. It will really fire me up and definately get me out to CA for another visit. *goosebumps* indeed
Originally Posted By dennis-in-ct Kayoss - you posted some incredible shots of your TDS visit. Some of the prespectives and vantage points were unlike anything I had ever seen online. Great work. Thank you for that.
Originally Posted By Kayoss <<Kayoss - you posted some incredible shots of your TDS visit. Some of the prespectives and vantage points were unlike anything I had ever seen online. Great work. Thank you for that.>>> I admit to being a detail nerd.... it's what happens when you're married to an architect. I’m actually grateful I can contribute to my Disney park fandom in any meaningful way, since it’s one subject that certainly doesn’t suffer from ANY shortage of photo galleries and discussions. There’s so much out there that I figured I probably didn’t have anything unique to add to the literal SEA of Disney Park sites. The funny thing is, I didn’t even even purposely realize I was doing the ‘details’ angle until it was mentioned to me on the board. It’s just always the things I’ve admired and subconsciously basing my photo essays on. To me, the details are what makes these parks so interesting, as well as the satisfaction in coming back to find even more. I’m as cynical as they come, so to have a fetish for something as seemingly ‘bland’ as theme parks, is as surprising to me as it is to many friends. Oh.... and I had some technical bugs to work out (new software and all) but over the holiday weekend I should finally get around to posting the other half of my Tokyo images (and finally... the videos...)
Originally Posted By dennis-in-ct << It’s just always the things I’ve admired and subconsciously basing my photo essays on. To me, the details are what makes these parks so interesting, as well as the satisfaction in coming back to find even more. >> Amen to that brother! Well said. I drool over the details. Having an Industrail Design education and a career in ad agencies - I am all about detail. Frank Loyd Wright said "God is in the details". I look forward to seeing the rest of your photos and videos. Art and design is such a beautiful expression of humanity and the ART that goes into the Disney themeparks is top notch (except WDSP where the designers need to be slapped). For example, the TREE OF LIFE is a sculpture that makes me tear up when I am standing at it's base. The ole' art school question is "what is art" ... well, when something triggers thought or emotion and makes me feel a connection to humanity - for me, it's art. The talent that is behind these parks are a perfect example of what can be achieved when funded. Let's make a HUGE MOUNTAIN with a lava monster .. tee heee .. well, they made the impossible REAL. When I ride a real live magic trick (the Haunted Mansion) again I feel the Disney magic. I can't wait to see DCA after the TALENT gets their hands on that place. Perhaps some more TDS quality.
Originally Posted By trekkeruss I never had the opportunity to eat at the Soap Opera Bistro, but I was looking at the Yesterland page, and it looked pretty nice, IMO. I wish it was still there because it looked like fun. <a href="http://yesterland.com/soapopera.html" target="_blank">http://yesterland.com/soapoper a.html</a>
Originally Posted By WorldDisney Wow great observations Kayoss . I was recently at DCA and TDS within a week of each other and so much of the trip still stands out for me and yeah, I have to agree on basically everything you said. Actually, out of boredom I admit, I went back to the animation studio at DCA and walked through Ursela's Grotto and the Library which I haven't through in YEARS and glad I did!! The place was always too busy before the few times I went, so just lost interest. Haven't been there since 2003 maybe. This time completely dead lol. Anyway, I was amazed by how richly themed it all was. You're right, its one of the few area's that truly stand out of DCA that doesn't anywhere else! Of course, I STILL think Both Exploration Fortress and Ariel's play area at TDS are miles ahead. Besides just having a lot more to do and experiences in them, they are grander and truly blend in to the themed ports in which they reside. Sadly for the Animation Studio, it stands on a street of cheap facades and an uninspired area. Classic DCA . Ariel's playhouse is obviously under the sea in a completely underground area where the whole place, rides, shows, restaurants and shops are completely themed to that little mermaid. We are truly part of her world. (Enough puns for you kids ;D) Exploration Fortress, along with a castle full of Italian inventions and things to do, has its own PIRATE boat (with 'working' cannons) in the area and you look out of the fortress and has views of the harbor, Mira Costa, Point Vecchio brigde, S.S. Columbus and NOW TOT. And that's just the VIEW of the place. Disneysea is just AMAZING!!!!!! Ironically, I just completely walked through the GRR area on my last visit, now I wish I spent a little more time there . I RARELY ride the ride, so if I don't go on it, I don't really hang around the area even though its the most beautiful and best themed in the whole park. Also, interesting all the places you talked about GRR, FFF are the only places that WON'T be touched when the fix start. Coincidence? I mean the majority of the park will be changed, revamped and altered in some way IF what we been reading is true. That's why I FINALLY have hope for this park. The guys who are now in charge of it seems like they GET what we fans been saying all along in terms of changes to the place, so who knows maybe in a couple of years we will be able to pick out a lot more TDS quality in the near future .
Originally Posted By gadzuux Could you post another link to your TDS pics? I must've missed it on some other thread.
Originally Posted By Kayoss <a href="http://web.mac.com/okwhatev" target="_blank">http://web.mac.com/okwhatev</a> Just click the link at the top of the page for the mini-gallery. I'd give you a direct link, but it may change since I may need to re-upload the whole site due to some tech glitches.
Originally Posted By k_peek_2000 I both agree and disagree. As beautiful as some parts of DCA are. It lack's something TDS Thrives... Imagination. Theres nothing special about a watermill, compared to an Arabian Coast, or lost river delta.
Originally Posted By TDR_Fan Great thread, Kayoss! I've always felt that the Grizzly Peak area was the most themed and detailed in DCA. The Grand Californian, though not as integrated into the park as TDS' MiraCosta, is still a beautiful hotel. Still, it doesn't make up for the incredibly cheap and tacky looking areas in the rest of the park. TDS is still light years ahead in the theming and details department. <<Ariel's playhouse is obviously under the sea in a completely underground area where the whole place, rides, shows, restaurants and shops are completely themed to that little mermaid. We are truly part of her world. (Enough puns for you kids ;D)>> I think Ariel's Playground is one of the most underrated areas of the park. It's one of the most detailed walkthrough attractions I've ever explored. Very pretty. And I love the background music there, especially in the sunken Galleon room. It's so haunting. Thank god I bought the Mermaid Lagoon BGM CD. <<Exploration Fortress, along with a castle full of Italian inventions and things to do, has its own PIRATE boat (with 'working' cannons) in the area and you look out of the fortress and has views of the harbor, Mira Costa, Point Vecchio brigde, S.S. Columbus and NOW TOT. And that's just the VIEW of the place. >> Explorer's Landing is by far my favorite walkthrough attraction, beating even DLP's Adventure Isle. It's just so detailed and so beautiful, especially all those mystical lighting effects in the chambers that give it an otherworldly glow. And yes, the view from the Fortress Explorations is just breathtaking. You get a panoramic view of all the majestic vistas in the park. It's a fantastic place to watch the lagoon shows from too, and it frames the MiraCosta perfectly.
Originally Posted By TDR_Fan <<You get a panoramic view of all the majestic vistas in the park.>> Well, most anyways. You obviously don't get to see the wonderful vistas located in the back of the park .
Originally Posted By bean As one couple from B.C. said to me one day while walking thru the park. "This is my first time to Anaheim, and I had read bad things about this park but still decided to bring my family. Disneyland was our main priority but I am amazed how much fun we are having here. Disney really did a good job this park has lots of detail. It just needs more attractions."
Originally Posted By TDR_Fan I think to many non-locals, DCA is considered to be a great park. It has more attractions than any of the non-Magic Kingdom parks in Walt Disney World; I've heard several people comment that they liked DCA better than Epcot, DHS, and DAK.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo DCA is my British wife's favorite park anywhere! I don't agree, but she prefers DCA to DL, DLP, any WDW park, Tivoli Gardens or anywhere else. But even she agrees it needs more (and she said the other day, "I hope they don't ruin it by putting more toons in!"). I was proud of her for that.
Originally Posted By WorldDisney <<As one couple from B.C. said to me one day while walking thru the park. "This is my first time to Anaheim, and I had read bad things about this park but still decided to bring my family. Disneyland was our main priority but I am amazed how much fun we are having here. Disney really did a good job this park has lots of detail. It just needs more attractions.">> While I'm glad the family enjoyed it, the new TPTB seem to disagree with them about the details of the place since the 1.2 Billion overhaul seems like it will include a massive new look to much of the park. Also I agree with TDR_FAN, it seems like the non locals likes it better than the locals and while that's fine the majority of the place ARE locals, something the people who built the park oddly seem to ignore in many ways.
