Originally Posted By ChiMike <a href="http://progresscityusa.com/2011/07/24/the-horizons-story-part-i/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+ProgressCityUsa+%28Progress+City%2C+U.S.A.+Posts%29" target="_blank">http://progresscityusa.com/201...Posts%29</a> Michael Crawford's posting on Horizons was very interesting. From the POV of GE. I have seen an immense amount of material on Horizons, especially during the active yahoo groups, but not this. A very interesting read, thanks Michael! For those who think that some folks on here hate Disney, read the last two paragraphs. I think the thoughts expressed certainly mirror how we all felt about the property back at that point of time. ...And why we expect a lot from the company today.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer Fantastic read.... Love how the article fully shows that Horizons was the synthesis and capstone of Future World. Which it was... it was the future personified and on a relatable level. You could imagine yourself in the setting, and see things you knew. It felt very familiar, and warm... It was a fantastic attraction. ...and something like it is really needed in EPCOT, today.
Originally Posted By 3disneylocations While Mission:Space is an amazing attraction, Horizons was my fav @ Epcot... At least there is a little of it left in Spaceship Earth. I even like how they had the trees flanking the building trimmed to match the roof line. Ah well...
Originally Posted By Manfried Kumbaya, let's all pretend its still 1983 and the world has not changed, and people haven't evolved, and corporations haven't changed. It was a highly detailed, very boring attraction and only caught on with the hard core fans. Which only number in the couple thousand.
Originally Posted By ChiMike >>It was a highly detailed, very boring attraction and only caught on with the hard core fans. Which only number in the couple thousand.<< See, I would argue (you here GOB?) that this is a bad opinion stated as fact. It is a bad opinion because it is not rooted in reality. The attractions ride counts were very high for the first 8 years prior to the expiration of GE's sponsership. At one point it had the second highest ridership in FutureWorld ala EPCOT Center.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>Kumbaya, let's all pretend its still 1983 and the world has not changed, and people haven't evolved, and corporations haven't changed. It was a highly detailed, very boring attraction and only caught on with the hard core fans. Which only number in the couple thousand<<< Manny, NO ONE IN THIS THREAD said anything about pretending it was still 1983. No one is advocating that the attraction be left unchanged in this thread. No one is saying that technology is still viable. So I don't understand the point of this post... especially when chiMike has already chimed in about Horizons' popularity, which did NOT wane. Of course, I wish it was still around, kept up, changed, and refurbished to match today's issues and vision of the future. EPCOT Center is the only park to have it's classic core attractions ripped out, and gone from the park. The ideas and theme of the park is gone. I don't see how that is acceptable. My honest apologies if this post is too forceful, but seriously... No one really advocates the parks being turned into museums, which is something I know you are against. This is history, and it's meant to be brought up and discussed. That's all. ~GFC, EC, all that Jazz!~
Originally Posted By Manfried <<EPCOT Center is the only park to have it's classic core attractions ripped out, and gone from the park. The ideas and theme of the park is gone. I don't see how that is acceptable.>> But the original attractions ran out of gas. They were no longer topical, much less about the future. What are the ideas and themes of the park? Should it even be a theme park? When was the last time a new country was added to the World Showcase? It was the eighties. Nothing since then. Where are all the big corporations with the money to spend building new attractions? Gone. So. what does Disney or anyone do to somehow project the future? I would like to see it, but wishing for the old days is not the way to do it. Instead, let's focus on what could be done on the future. Come on, kumbaya.
Originally Posted By DlandDug By all means, stop discussing a Disney theme park attraction in a thread devoted to Disney theme park attractions...! I loved the original Horizons attraction and was very sorry to see it go. I was especially sorry in light of the fact that it could have been retained with no harm to the rest of Epcot. There was (and is) plenty of room to build new attractions. Also found it interesting the GE stressed that Horizons should look forward with an emphasis on the future, since they took "Great Big Beautiful Tomorrow" out of Carousel and had it replaced with a song celebrating today as "The Best Time of Your Life." Maybe they realized they got it wrong?!?
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>But the original attractions ran out of gas. They were no longer topical, much less about the future.<<<< And that's why you REFURB. You give them new life. You add things. Ripping out Horizons and JII and WOM is akin to ripping the HM out of DL in 1975 when it needed a refurb. >>>What are the ideas and themes of the park? Should it even be a theme park? <<<< EPCOT is a modern day World's Fair. It is there to show technology, what can be done with it in the future, and what man has done in the past to get to that technology. It's a optimistic exhibition space, focusing on tomorrow, and a realistic one at that. >>>When was the last time a new country was added to the World Showcase? It was the eighties. Nothing since then<<< 1988. So? We know Disney management sucks. Why blame that on the park? Are you determined to dislike EPCOT, or something? That's the vibe I get, Manny... >>>Where are all the big corporations with the money to spend building new attractions? Gone. <<< The originals are gone, but EPCOT still has a sponsors for most of the rides. >>>So. what does Disney or anyone do to somehow project the future?<<< Right now, Spaceship Earth is the only real ride for it... and that's a problem. Don't see how this relates to a historical discussion on Horizons. >>> I would like to see it, but wishing for the old days is not the way to do it. Instead, let's focus on what could be done on the future. Come on, kumbaya.<<< No one is wishing for the old days. What we are discussing here is the implications of Horizons. And yeah, I guess "wishing" that Disney would return to the same style of showman ship and class, but that's in no way "old".
Originally Posted By DDMAN26 I love attractions like Test Track and Mission Space in their own way, because compared to their predecesssors it's apples to oranges. But there was something quite neat about Horizons and World of Motion. The attractions that were replaced. WoM had nice whimsical feeling to it. Loved the song It's Fun to Be Free, I bring it up anytime I can. And Horizons more than Spaceship Earth at least for me seemed closer to Walt's vision for Epcot and the future in general.
Originally Posted By DDMAN26 Something I never realized until just recently but many considered Horizons to be a sequel to CoP.
Originally Posted By Manfried <<Are you determined to dislike EPCOT, or something? That's the vibe I get, Manny...>> No I am not. I do not like the fact that EPCOT seems to have lost its way. To me, this is the one theme park asset that should not only be updated, but has the greatest potential for growth. What is required is for management to realize that. They should take a small group of bigwigs, newer Imagineers, and business type folks away somewhere for a week and figure out a plan to re-invigorate that park and set it up for a great future. Instead, I think they are waiting for something to drop into their respective laps. A good business changes with the times and positions itself for the future, instead of waiting or relying on the past. The EPCOT model is stuck in the past. It needs to be jump started.
Originally Posted By ChiMike Indeed DDMAN. And as Doug pointed out, it was somewhat of a mea culpa on COP's change of focus in 1975. I was most familiar with COP at WDW so I didn't feel the same way a lot of Westcoasters felt about the change (including the Sherman's themselves) but I recognize the issue with retreating from a look towards tomorrow. Back to Horizons, it was a stellar attraction. In my head I go back and forth on what I miss more, it, or WoM. I guess it depends on my mood. Horizons does not get a lot of love from Disney fans in general because a lot of them are DL based and were never really exposed to it. I guarantee if the EPCOT version would have been in DL's tomorrowland (a smaller deviation of it was proposed once) you would have seen an update instead. The DL guest base would have been as protective over it as they are POTC or HM.
Originally Posted By ChiMike >>I do not like the fact that EPCOT seems to have lost its way<< Can't agree with you more Manfried. I also agree with your past comments on corporate sponsors .. That's not going to happen anymore. There are no GEs, GMs, or EXXONs that are going to step up to the plate to bankroll an attraction for Disney, so then, Disney can collect their $80.00/day at the gate. Corporate American has drastically changed from the 70's. All the more reason to be impressed that they got Siemens. Not sure how many more Simens are out there.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>I love attractions like Test Track and Mission Space in their own way, because compared to their predecesssors it's apples to oranges. But there was something quite neat about Horizons and World of Motion. The attractions that were replaced. WoM had nice whimsical feeling to it. Loved the song It's Fun to Be Free, I bring it up anytime I can. And Horizons more than Spaceship Earth at least for me seemed closer to Walt's vision for Epcot and the future in general<<<< I certainly don't enjoy Mission Space and Test Track the way I enjoyed WOM and Horizons, but yes, I agree.
Originally Posted By DDMAN26 <<Back to Horizons, it was a stellar attraction. In my head I go back and forth on what I miss more, it, or WoM. I guess it depends on my mood.>> I don't know if you're familiar with Subsonic Radio, well besides just about every sound that came from a Disney park, my Pal Mickey anyone, they have both Horizons and WoM broken down into the ride itself and individual vignettes of the ride. It's always amongst the most popular for the requests.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>No I am not. I do not like the fact that EPCOT seems to have lost its way.<<<< Neither do I. EPCOT needs to regain it's optimism, it's technology, and it's spirit of exhibition. EPCOT is not about story. >>>To me, this is the one theme park asset that should not only be updated, but has the greatest potential for growth.<<< I agree. And to do that, they need to build on the past, and make it new. >>>They should take a small group of bigwigs, newer Imagineers, and business type folks away somewhere for a week and figure out a plan to re-invigorate that park and set it up for a great future.<<< Agreed. It needs to be a cohesive, inspiring, vision of the future. >>Instead, I think they are waiting for something to drop into their respective laps.<<< I think that's the attitude in the entire company. >>>A good business changes with the times and positions itself for the future, instead of waiting or relying on the past. The EPCOT model is stuck in the past. It needs to be jump started.<<<< In the fact that it needs sponsors? I agree. But the idea of big concepts told through massive rides is hardly outdated. Yes, there might be a need for more thrills in this day and age, but there's no excuse for things like Horizons or WOM to be torn out. Those rides were the spirit and heart of the park.
Originally Posted By skinnerbox <<The EPCOT model is stuck in the past. It needs to be jump started.>> Sell it to Steve Jobs.
