Originally Posted By DlandDug So, I had a long automobile trip this afternoon, and while scanning the local talk radio stations, lit on the entire opening segment of Rachel Maddow's AirAmerica broadcast. She went into a lengthy "rant" (her word) about how the Democratic Party needs to get Hillary to concede. According to Maddow, if this contest goes on until convention in August, McCain will have been given a free and clear seven month head start, and it is unlikely that either Democratic candidate will be able to prevail. Maddow took pains to explain she likes both Obama and Hillary, but felt that either needs to be free to engage McCain, and within the next ten days. Maddow also came up with her logic on why Hillary is carrying this battle to such extremes. She pointed out that if Hillary concedes now, she will definitely not be elected President. But if Hillary carries this to the floor of the convention, there is a possibility she could get the nomination, and then have a slim chance of getting elected. So, a slim chance trumps no chance at all. Ergo, Hillary keeps slogging on. It was an arresting argument (I stayed with it a lot longer than I usually do on AirAmerica). I don't know that I agree, but it is compelling , anyway.
Originally Posted By Dabob2 My guess is, if Clinton doesn't get what she wants out of the rules committee meeting the end of this month (having to do with MI and FL), and/or enough superdelegates publicly declare for Obama to put him over the top, she'll suspend but not officially end her campaign. That allows her to hope for something nuclear to happen to Obama, so she can ride into Denver as "savior of the party." It would have to be something really nuclear though and not just the usual dustups, because it would have to be something big enough to make the supers who declared for Obama switch over. If nothing nuclear happens, and she's not knocking Obama between June and August, she won't be accused of submarining his chances. Then she can go into Denver, get some platform influence, and come out embracing Obama and unity and kum ba yah. Obama meanwhile will be able to focus exclusively on McCain, as long as Clinton is not actively campaigning AGAINST him. A lot of people would rather she withdraw officially after June 3, so there's not even a hint of a cloud hanging over Denver, but I don't think she will. I also don't think this need to be fatal to the Democrats, as long as they're not squabbling much after June. It's all in how she handles it.
Originally Posted By WilliamK99 The only nuclear problem I see for Obama is if it is discovered he is a "Sleeper Cell" member of Al Queda which is a distinct possibility. ;o) Don't mind me, just trying to stir it up....
Originally Posted By ecdc I think Dabob2 is probably right. I'm also puzzled by talk of Hillary as VP. If this race has shown us anything, it's that she isn't content with second-place. Having already been through the White House once, I can't imagine Hillary would be content with VP.
Originally Posted By DAR There is no way she accepts a VP nomination. She will play second fiddle to anyone, which is probably how she felt during Bill's presidency.
Originally Posted By DAR <<The only nuclear problem I see for Obama is if it is discovered he is a "Sleeper Cell" member of Al Queda which is a distinct possibility. ;o) Don't mind me, just trying to stir it up....>> He'll probably go after states 51-58 ;p
Originally Posted By Dabob2 <Having already been through the White House once, I can't imagine Hillary would be content with VP.> I can't imagine anyone who's lived in the White House having any particular ambition to go live in Blair House.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan I "think" Hillary will concede after June 3. The negative press if she didn't would surely sink any future plans to run for the White House for her, and all the blame for a November loss would land on her. But then again, I've been thinking she would concede prior to this in the name of party unity. I'm not making any bets on anything at this point. I think the Clintons and the people they surround themselves with truly live for these kinds of battles, and add to it a certain sense of entitlement, and anything is possible.
Originally Posted By WilliamK99 I "think" Hillary will concede after June 3. The negative press if she didn't would surely sink any future plans to run for the White House for her, and all the blame for a November loss would land on her. But then again, I've been thinking she would concede prior to this in the name of party unity. I'm not making any bets on anything at this point. I think the Clintons and the people they surround themselves with truly live for these kinds of battles, and add to it a certain sense of entitlement, and anything is possible.<< Come on Kar2oonman, if we have learned anything this election it's that Hillary Clinton doesn't care about the Democratic Party, or the voters for that matter, she only cares about becoming President.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan >>Come on Kar2oonman, if we have learned anything this election it's that Hillary Clinton doesn't care about the Democratic Party, or the voters for that matter, she only cares about becoming President.<< That's largely true it seems. Like I said, I'm not taking any bets!
Originally Posted By mele I'm not sure any politician cares that much more about their party or voters. I don't think it's about not caring about voters but more that she believes she needs to soldier on because she believes that it's her destiny AND because she does have a lot of support. She's not seeing the support she doesn't have, she's obsessed with the support she does have. I don't thinks she's thinking "screw everyone, I deserve this" but more "I deserve this and many people agree with me". I think it's more that she's obsessed and isn't admitting the truth as opposed to knowing that she's going to lose and deciding to fight to the end. I think she really does think she can win and that she deserves to win and so she's not even the other thoughts (reality) enter her brain. It's still messed up, maybe more. I don't think Hillary fans should be making any snide comments about how stubborn *Bush* is. As we can see, absolute stubbornness in any world leader is a frightening trait.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan >>She's not seeing the support she doesn't have, she's obsessed with the support she does have.<< I think that's about right. I do think Obama has made a serious error in judgement by sort of handing over certain states to her. I know it's strategery. He may not have won anyway in those states, but I think it's important to at least show up in places like Kentucky. It's the only way to alter some perceptions, or at least to start to pave the way for November.
Originally Posted By oc_dean >>A lot of people would rather she withdraw officially after June 3<< I follow that camp. Let her finish the final set of state primaries ... let her finish whatever fundraising she can muster to pay her bills .. and GET OUT! She's only hurting the party by going on like this. And it's REALLY disturbing how she goes on the record to -claim- she has won the popular vote - WHICH IS NOT TRUE! In order for her to claim the state of Michigan .. they would have to redo the primary where they are BOTH on the ticket. But for a litany of reasons, we know that's not going to happen. Delegate count, Super Delegate count, popular vote - Obama is ahead! <- proudly wearing an "Obama '08" t-shirt right now!
