Originally Posted By friendofdd I am constantly bemused by the hatred many Americans show for politicians. Even here on LP, it is not uncommon to see posts made that revile and hate George Bush or Bill Clinton. Both are men loved by thier wife and child(ren) and that says to me that they are men of some worth even when I disagree with their politics. I have been hesitant to discuss this topic because some seem so intent on maintaining their hatred no matter what. And that just puts me in their line of fire. However, in my reading, I found a quote on hatred that so clearly expresses what I think is right I'm sharing it with you. >>>Hatred is a passion requiring one hundred times the energy of love. Keep it for a cause, not an individual. Keep it for intolerance, injustice, stupidity. For hatred is the strength of the sensitive. Its power and its greatness depend on the selflessness of its use.<<< Olive Moore - 19th century English writer Imagine what kind of person, and world we could be if we hated only causes that were intolerant, unjust and stupid rather than individuals fitting the description.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip <<Imagine what kind of person, and world we could be if we hated only causes that were intolerant, unjust and stupid rather than individuals fitting the description.>> So it's OK to hate the Republican Party's Platform? ;-) Sorry... couldn't resist.
Originally Posted By trailsend Refreshing to read, friendofdd. There is an old saying something like this . . ."He might be a son of (you know) but he's OUR son of . .." I don't mean to get admined, just trying to point it out. I'm not as happy when democrats are in office, but I will always respect the office of President of the United States and give the person occupying that office my respect. I was appalled recently when Harry Reid told school children Pres. Bush is a "loser". Complete lack of common decency especially in front of children on Mr. Reid's part making him the loser. It's difficult to give a person like Mr. Reid the benefit of the doubt in a case like this.
Originally Posted By friendofdd Roadtrip, I know you were mostly in jest, but the answer is yes. If you truly feel the Republican, or Democratic, party platform is intolerant, unjust or stupid, then hate it and fight against it. Just don't start hating the party members because you disagree with their politics.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip <<Just don't start hating the party members because you disagree with their politics.>> Yes... in fact I occasionally come to the defense of Bush on these boards when I feel he is being unfairly blasted, even though I disagree with many of his administration's policies. Neither he nor Clinton is the 'devil' that some make them out to be.
Originally Posted By Kennesaw Tom Maybe RoadTrip's point is that there are "useful idots" among both partys.
Originally Posted By patrickegan “to see posts made that revile and hate George Bush or Bill Clinton. Both are men loved by thier wife and child(ren)†Do you really think Hillary loves Bill?
Originally Posted By friendofdd >>>Do you really think Hillary loves Bill?<<< Yes, I do. It seems a very strange relationship to me, but I don't think she would stay with him just for political ambition. Most of our population would be quite understanding if she had divorced him. She chose not to do so after his many known shenanigans. The only explanation I can think of is love.
Originally Posted By Dabob2 I remember reading this quote - it far predates the Clintons, but it was quoted in reference to them: "Other people's marriages are like a foreign country where you don't have a passport." Worth remembering, and not just for politics.
Originally Posted By Jafar30 In the case of Bill and Hillary, she's holding all the cards in that marriage. He asks if he can go golfing, she replies "oh will interns be there". He asks if he can play poker, she replies........
Originally Posted By woody "Yes, I do. It seems a very strange relationship to me, but I don't think she would stay with him just for political ambition. Most of our population would be quite understanding if she had divorced him. She chose not to do so after his many known shenanigans. The only explanation I can think of is love." No, I see several other reasons. 1. Power 2. Money 3. The Presidency
Originally Posted By SuperDry So, do people think that a divorce at this point would work against Hillary's polticial career, be neutral, or help it? Unless you believe that it would hurt her career, then staying married to Bill at this point doesn't make sense from a career standpoint. I could understand that argument back when she was First Lady, but now as a US Senator, I think she's established her political foundation independent of Bill. Maybe it really is love. Who knows?
Originally Posted By woody Bill has massive political power. He is the opposite of Hillary in style. He will compliment her skills. The divorce will change the dynamic. Hillary will be hurt. Also, divorce will be background noice that will damage momentum for Hillary. Nothing will be gained from divorce. Hillary is better off staying married. She made it this far. What's another ten years?
Originally Posted By woody Also, you forgot that Hillary won her Senate seat in BIG part by Bill. A chastized and softened Bill started the political machinery in New York to overwhelm her competitor. It was much of an election.
Originally Posted By woody Correction: It wasn't much of an election. She won from the shear power of the Bill Presidency. Unfortunately, Al Gore lost because he didn't use Bill. See, the opposite strategy of ignoring Bill worked to Al Gore's demise. I think a divorce won't make Bill neutral. He may campaign against her.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip Hillary isn't the first woman on earth to remain married to a skirt-chaser. I think she loves him and has decided that the good outweighs the bad. Who knows? Maybe she has little sex drive and is OK with him going elsewhere. (Although she would have to wish he was a little more danged discrete.)
Originally Posted By StillThePassHolder "Also, you forgot that Hillary won her Senate seat in BIG part by Bill. A chastized and softened Bill started the political machinery in New York to overwhelm her competitor. It was much of an election." Yeah? That's not how others remember it. From wikipedia: The 2000 Senate race When long-time New York Senator Daniel Patrick Moynihan announced his retirement, prominent Democratic politicians and advisors, including Charlie Rangel, urged Clinton to run for the New York Senate seat in the U.S. Senate, 2000, elections. When Clinton chose to run, she became the first First Lady of the United States to be a candidate for elected office. She was initially expected to face New York City's Mayor Rudy Giuliani, but Giuliani withdrew after being diagnosed with prostate cancer and after developments in his personal life attracted negative publicity. Instead, Clinton faced a lesser-known candidate, Rick Lazio, who was a Congressman representing Suffolk County on Long Island. The contest drew considerable national attention and both candidates were well-funded. By the end of the race, Democrat Clinton and Republicans Lazio and Giuliani had spent a combined $78 million. While Clinton had a solid base of support in New York City, candidates and observers expected the race to be decided in upstate New York where 45 percent of New Yorker voters live. During the campaign, Clinton vowed to improve the economic picture in upstate New York, promising that her plan would deliver 200,000 New York jobs over six years. Her plan included specific tax credits with the purpose of rewarding job creation and encouraging business investment, especially in the high-tech sector. She called for targeted personal tax cuts for college tuition and long-term care. Clinton began her campaign by visiting every county in the state, in a "listening tour" of small-group settings. During the race, she spent considerable time in traditionally Republican upstate regions. Clinton faced charges of carpetbagging since she had never resided in the State of New York nor participated in state politics prior to her Senate race. After her decision to run for the Senate, the Clintons purchased a home in Chappaqua, New York, north of New York City. Opponents made the carpetbagging issue a focal point throughout the race and during debates. In the end, according to exit polls conducted in the race, more than two-thirds of the voters dismissed the "carpetbagging" issue as unimportant. Clinton won the election on November 7 with 55% of the vote to Lazio's 43%. This 12% margin is larger than the 10% margin by which fellow New York senator Charles Schumer defeated incumbent Republican Al D'Amato in the hotly contested 1998 race, smaller than Gore's 25% margin over Bush in the state Presidential contest, and considerably smaller than the 47% margin by which Senator Schumer won reelection in 2004 against Republican challenger Howard Mills.
Originally Posted By woody "Yeah? That's not how others remember it. From wikipedia:" That's the cleaned up version. There's always the behind the scenes activity, which I read about.
Originally Posted By StillThePassHolder "That's the cleaned up version. There's always the behind the scenes activity, which I read about.' Do tell.
Originally Posted By woody There are some stories out there. Here's a small part, which amazingly is part of another Clinton scandal. <a href="http://www.insightmag.com/media/paper441/news/2004/07/19/Politics/Investigative.Report.Another.Clinton.Scandal.Coming-702371.shtml" target="_blank">http://www.insightmag.com/medi a/paper441/news/2004/07/19/Politics/Investigative.Report.Another.Clinton.Scandal.Coming-702371.shtml</a> "Hillary Clinton is flying high within the Democratic Party as a marquee star that many hope will launch a presidential run in 2008 or 2012 or join up as a vice presidential contender. But previously unknown federal documents outlining potentially serious election law violations could spell trouble for the junior senator from New York and some high-fliers in the Democratic Party." "At the same time, according to legal and federal law enforcement sources who have spoken to Insight on condition of anonymity, the failure to pursue alleged wrongdoing by Clinton's senatorial campaign in 2000 and among a variety of party and White House officials involved in fundraising at the time raises questions about the integrity of the Justice Department which has failed to bring indictments against key players in Hollywood, Washington, New York and Florida despite mounting evidence." "Paul also planned, hosted and paid for the bulk of an elaborate star-studded Hollywood gala on behalf of Bill Clinton that was part of a big fundraising event for Hillary Clinton when the Democratic Party was holding its national convention in Los Angeles back in 2000. Not only was Paul publicly thanks by both Clintons for each of these events but also was thanked by Bill, Hillary and even Chelsea Clinton in personal thank you notes." <a href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/campaigns/keyraces2000/stories/hillary102699.htm" target="_blank">http://www.washingtonpost.com/ wp-srv/politics/campaigns/keyraces2000/stories/hillary102699.htm</a> "NEW YORK, Oct. 25—Hillary Rodham Clinton used the opportunity of her 52nd birthday to bring in a possible $1 million to her Senate campaign tonight, joining her husband at a star-studded "Broadway for Hillary" fund-raiser and birthday bash." "Clinton's public appearance at the event, Hillary Clinton's biggest fund-raiser so far, comes as he is stepping up his behind-the-scenes effort on behalf of his wife's 2000 ambitions. On Sunday afternoon, he golfed with B. Thomas Golisano--the Rochester businessman who heads New York's small but potentially influential Independence Fusion Party and who won 7 percent of the vote in last year's governor's race."
