Originally Posted By Hista98 so does anyone know why exactey dca won't be getting philarmagic. i know it due to budget reasons?? but what exactley are they, since muppet vision is just in a standred building couldn't they just gut the building nd put the new theatre portion in the forward middle of the building, leaving enough room in the back for the presow area,as you can't have the guests enter from the side due to the screen and how much room it needs. anyone know more??
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo Well, budget is probably the key reason as the refit would be mammoth. But I am happy about this, personally I think Phil is weak compared to MV3D and ITTBAB.
Originally Posted By Hista98 i really like muppets too, but Philar would help out DCA!! plus since muppets sees very few people anyway a replacment wouldn't hurt. i hate ITTBAB in DCA cause that whole section has zero to do with California, and thats one of my biggest disney pet peeves
Originally Posted By Mr X I don't see how you could be "happy" about a park NOT getting an attraction, unless there is some replacement idea I haven't heard about? Of course, I'd always prefer something new to just another copy in another location (thus less reason for me to go back to those places). Personally I thought Philharmagic was cute. On par with Bugs, but lots more fun. In fact, Philharmagic was the ONLY reason we chose to visit the Magic Kingdom over MGM on our most recent visit, I'd seen it in Hong Kong and wanted my family to enjoy it. I have no idea what MV3D is, something in Paris?
Originally Posted By Mr X Oh duh. Muppets. Thanks HISTA. Yeah, Muppets is nice too. I wouldn't consider any of those three to be vastly superior though...all cute and nice shows (Bugs is a bit dark though).
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo Muppets and Bugs have some great AA's and real characterisation. Phil just feels shallow and commercial. Plus I am getting sick of Disney toons. I really am. I understand why some people hate Disney. And I am running out of arguements where I used to say they used to stand for more than toons. That is why I am glad muppets are staying and Phil is not coming. Plus MV3D is Sarah's absolute favorite Disney attraction after IASW.
Originally Posted By Mr X Don't go to Hong Kong then, bro. I think you'll be fairly shocked and disappointed with the park...to me it feels like a "cartoon Magic Kingdom" if that makes any sense. I do understand your point. The toons are cool at Disney, in limited amounts. Too much is, well, too much. Probably a lot of the same reasons why you and I adore Epcot, Animal Kingdom, and DisneySea (well, I'm assuming you'll adore DisneySea anyway...I sure do). Oh, so it was remove the muppets in favore of Phil? In that case, sure, I can understand you being happy about it not working out after all. I was guessing it was a planned NEW attraction that just got scrubbed. I love the Muppets, don't get me wrong. However, that IS getting pretty long in the tooth (as are most of their 3D offerings), and it's be great if they made a MUPPETS remake.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo I do want to see HKDL with my own eyes, but I will wait a while (or it will be a stop over when we finally make it to TDS). But yep, my love of Disney parks was ALWAYS down to the different themes and how well executed they are. I loved spending a morning in the African, Asian and South American Jungles, having lunch in the moonlit Bayou or Polynesia (before they ripped the Tahitian Terrace out), enjoying America in the frontier, and an evening in the future, or listening to bands in a turn of the century bandstand. To me, that was and is the magic of Disney, not stupid toons. So it stands to reason I love Epcot, DAK, the lodges of the resorts, the detailing of DLP, and I am sure I would adore TDS. To me theming (architecture, horticulture, ambiant soundtracks, menus, merchandise, entertainment, costumes, and state of the art well conceived and fitting attractions) are what Disney is all about. At a good Disney park, I can happily go and spend a day not riding one attraction and come out happy. When I do ride them, I want them to be something I cannot do outside of a Disney park (ok my kids love the Teacups and autopia, so those are hypocritical exceptions). The toons were ok when in Fantasyland (which I spent little time in as a kid) or you happened on them. But when they became the main event, well frankly I am now searching for alternatives. And it ticks me off and depresses me. I used to turn to Disney for fun inspiration. It was like a religious experience for me. And although that still happens to a degree, no where near as much as it used to. And for those that advise me to go to the real Africa or Italy, personally I like the fact the idealised versions and the fact I can go from one to the other very quickly. And this is why toon attractions, homogonised merchandise and dining experiences, and rubber heads instead of live music or improv comedy has me searching for alternative vacation destinations, and Dubai looks better and better each time. Heck, if I could become a Disney suit to sort it out, even though it would likely be a salary drop, I would take the position in a heartbeat, if given the opportunity.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo So I am looking forward to seeing TDS eventually, though the toon obsession of Japanese guests worry me a big too.
Originally Posted By Goofyernmost It's for the same reason that WDW doesn't have the full "Pirates" or the old Tiki Room or the Indiana Jones Ride or New Orleans area. There has got to be some differences between parks or there is no incentive to visit the others.
Originally Posted By Mr X ***ok my kids love the Teacups and autopia, so those are hypocritical exceptions*** And Dumbo. Yeah, I know. Welcome to parents' island lol. And I probably have an unfair fondness for the Nemoisation of the Living Seas, and pretty much only because my daughter simply adored it. Can't discount this stuff too much, kids are a big part of their target market (and you really can't say, all said and done, that Nemo at Epcot ISN'T something "the whole family can enjoy together). So, I don't think you (or I) are hypocritical on this one. We have kids now, and when they love something we tend to appreciate it too. Back when I was childless, I might have wished for them to tear out all the lame Dumbos and stupid autopias and all the other amusement park "crap", but I can't say that I feel the same way anymore.
Originally Posted By Mr X ***At a good Disney park, I can happily go and spend a day not riding one attraction and come out happy.*** I've actually done that at Epcot many times, and DisneySea a few times (although, I almost always catch at least Aladdin, since the lines are so short lol). Those are the only 2 parks where I feel that way though...even with DAK, you have to do the attractions in order to even make a half-day out of the place. There really is not much there in terms of walkaround enjoyment, quite different from Epcot and DisneySea in that regard (love Animal Kingdom though, definitely).
Originally Posted By Mr X ***It's for the same reason that WDW doesn't have the full "Pirates" or the old Tiki Room or the Indiana Jones Ride or New Orleans area. There has got to be some differences between parks or there is no incentive to visit the others.*** Different lands and different kinds of atmosphere, yeah probably (otherwise, why not just throw New Orleans into WDW in '71...ALTHOUGH, when they built Tokyo Disneyland the park was essentially a COMPLETE amalgam of the two American parks save for the roof over Main Street ("WorldBazaar was a concept that WOULD'VE been quite different, but got axed in favor of the Xerox method). But as for rides? I don't think they build them different "just because". I think it comes down entirely to how much money they have to work with. If, for example, they were to build Splash Mountain into Hong Kong Disneyland (GOD I hope they do! They need it!), and had, dollar for dollar, the exact same budget as Orlando back when it was built there (accounting for inflation and all that), I believe you'd get the exact same product. Maybe TINY details changed just for fun, but essentially the same. It's the budget, stupid! (sorry for the Clinton quite lol) If they have more money, they do more stuff (wow, just look at Tokyo Pooh for an example of THAT at work! Or, Disneyland Paris and the maxed out E-tickets). If they have less, they do as much as they can (Orlando Pirates springs to mind, as that was an afterthought in any case).
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo Oh I don't know Mr X, at DAK, the music groups and dancers are pretty awesome. I suppose I count the animals as a part of not doing attractions (though they are I suppose). But I do not need to get in a line to enjoy DAK. Disneyland and DLP are in this camp too.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo This thread inspired my latest blog article: <a href="http://intobserver.blogspot.com/" target="_blank">http://intobserver.blogspot.com/</a>
Originally Posted By Mr X ***But I do not need to get in a line to enjoy DAK.*** I can spend a good deal of time there, just enjoying the atmosphere (and I agree they have some first class street shows as well!), but I couldn't really go "all day" without the animals. I suppose riding the safari ride is just an utter priority for me when I'm there (no other attraction really is, I think I skipped most of them this last trip save for Everest which was awesome!). So, I see your point. But to me it's just slightly different from Epcot and DisneySea where I can and have just enjoyed the places without riding a single ride (a kind of neat feeling, when you're walking out the door and realize you did that...and why). ***Disneyland and DLP are in this camp too.*** I don't know if it's tradition, or immage, or whatever for me, but I've never, ever been able to set foot inside a Disneyland and hang out all day without riding some rides. Probably my big hangup, or something. I've just GOT to ride SOMETHING (maybe because the place is so traditional, and classic...like "how can I skip PIRATES?", or "how can I skip MANSION?". I can appreciate your point, but I've never done it, never wanted to, and probably never will (well, if I stroll into TDL someday and find everything at a 2 hour + wait, maybe I'll change my tune lol). BUT, that's just a matter of personal preference for me. While I love to enjoy and drink in the essence of DisneySea and Epcot (just the whole FEEL of the places), with a Magic Kingdom the rides (the timeless, classic ones mostly), are the thing..for me anyway).
Originally Posted By danyoung From what I understand, it's simply a matter of building layout. Philharmagic requires a HUGE projection surface, which just wasn't available no matter how they rebuilt the Muppets building.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo I love the attractions, don't get me wrong, but I have been to DLP and found most things 2 hours wait. But having a nice meal with wine pairings, a shave and a hair cut, enjoying the little streetmousphere they have (very little these days unless rubberheads), and taking in the details was a great day!
Originally Posted By Mr X ***no other attraction really is, I think I skipped most of them this last trip save for Everest which was awesome!*** Actually, thinking back, we DID in fact skip all the major attractions at Animal Kingdom this last trip...save for the safari and Everest. So, there you have it. I enjoyed the park immensely (except for one excruciating half-hour I wish I could get back), while essentially skipping all the rides.
Originally Posted By Mr X ***I love the attractions, don't get me wrong*** I know what you mean. I love the attractions at Epcot and DisneySea as well. Just the fact that you can have a great day without ANY of them in such places is pretty amazing. I get it (when I was a kid, I'd have thought the very idea laughable). ***I have been to DLP and found most things 2 hours wait.*** I've gone that route. We try and avoid busy days at TDL for that very reason (we'll even skip a planned day, if the weather seems bad or the crowds look bad...but on the other hand the parks are literally within walking distance from my home so that's a factor). ***But having a nice meal with wine pairings*** Well, you get booze in Paris. No such option elsewhere. ***a shave and a hair cut*** I always wanted to do that in Orlando, when I lived there. Never got around to it. The barbershops in Orlando and Anaheim are no more, right? Bummer. ***enjoying the little streetmousphere they have (very little these days unless rubberheads), and taking in the details was a great day*** Agreed 100%.
