Originally Posted By Hista98 So i know this is a dead horse but i saw video of MILF again today. and I am still baffeled as to why it ended up in Tomorrowland. It has nothing to do with the future, why didn't disney replace sounds dangerous with this ride instead. Disney was one of the last theme parks that worked hard to theme the rides approiatley and this and pirates lair were the last straw for me. i think its awefull that management approved a ride they knew would kill the themeing and would not work landwise or geographicly. because they know most people won't care. and honestly imho juust beacuse it is popualar, doesn't mean people will be ok with it breaking the theme. lets just move star tours to Frointier land, it doesn't theme well, but it's popular so no one will care (this s the mindset of TDO currently it seems. what happened to quality. they are openley killing what should be imho one of the funniest lands to imagineer for in all of disney, I think another redo is in order, and I know the ride is popular, but why not move it to the studios, help bring people in there, then we can get a cool furture baesd attraction in Tomorrowland. (Rant over)
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo Because Disney is no longer the company generations of people were conditioned to expect the best from, and because Joe Public are so stupid, many do not care about theming, certainly not in Europe :-(
Originally Posted By sjhym33 I think there are a couple of things going on. The first happened a while back when EPCOT Center opened. Now instead of looking to the future in one park they now had two parks to contend with. I think it got to be too much. I also think Disney felt the Circlevision 360 format was no longer a crowd draw. I think both the China and Canada redo's are great but neither has really increased the numbers the old movies were getting. I also like Timekeeper but it wasn't drawing hardly anyone at the end. I also think that Disney has succumbed to this notion that the characters need to be everywhere OR they synergy of having the characters everywhere helps the bottom line across business units. I think it has hurt the parks in general. Love the characters, but not everywhere I turn. Lastly, I think Imagineering is adrift. They still produce some good things. But Eisner years changed how Imagineering worked. I think Imagineering used to be the creative driver for the parks where now the parks are more like consumers who buy things from Imagineering and dictate needs and costs. Imagineering is now a business unit like attractions and foods. Also there seems to be no one person who is in charge of the overall theming and care for a particular park. I think that is why things get muddled. I think you see that in the MK in places and don't get me started on the Studios.
Originally Posted By barboy It is clear to me now that the more adult-like parks of '98 to '01(Animal Kingdom, Islands of Adventure, DCA and Disney Sea)would have never taken their original form had they been built from '07 to 2010. Times have changed dramatically in what Disney thinks the guest wants or will accept. The days of fresh, mature, congruently themed ideas for attractions is over and the age of cartoons, screens, interaction, clones and shoehorning is here. Under this new Disney park model MILF in Magic Kingdom's Tl, unfortunately, works perfectly. The fullest expression of this new dumbing down model of attractions is Toy Story Mania and Crush Talk, two very popular offerings. ///Joe Public are so stupid, many do not care about theming, certainly not in Europe/// Exactly, but I'd say that the US and Japan are caring less these days too.
Originally Posted By Hista98 Also there seems to be no one person who is in charge of the overall theming and care for a particular park. I think that is why things get muddled. I think you see that in the MK in places and don't get me started on the Studios. Wel lactually, DL has Tony Baxter in charge of creativity, and Animal Kingdom has Joe Rhode. plus I think Disney Seas is very good at staying orginal and creative, Most of the rides there are orginal and not based on anything and are quite popular, I'm hoping the whole living chraecter cheap over comerical thing is just a fad, like the huge AA fad that was around in the 1960's-1980's remeber that when all they would build were AA shows and then slowley they got out of that to where they own't do them, anymore, well I hope this current fad goes the same way. although I do miss AA shows.
Originally Posted By Hista98 at least the AA shows changed and where improving, the living charecter junk is the same stupid thing everytime, ascreen with an actor behind it.
Originally Posted By Hista98 the scary thing is that honestly today's park mamgment probably would never have approved a ride like Haunted Mansion, if it had been suggested today a rde like that would never have seen the light of day, which is scary considering how big of a hit it is. can you imagine how many Huanted Mansion type experiences managment is turning down a day. Disney really could have some great attractions but thanks to management they won't take a chance on some good one. Honestly I wouldn't have minded the laugh floor if it had been themed to the future, maybe with aliens in place of monsters,. But no.
Originally Posted By leobloom I like Turtle Talk, but that's probably because it was the first "living-character" show I saw. Monsters Inc, however, seemed redundant and a lot less clever than Turtle Talk. In fact, it seems like Disney has no sense of restraint. They develop this new tech and suddenly everything has to involve it. I suppose the same could be said of AAs in the 1960s. But the difference, I would argue, is that AA really was an impressive technological milestone. The "living characters" seem gimmicky, especially after you've seen one of these shows. They're even less impressive after you realize they are essentially pulling the Wizard of Oz trick--a person speaking behind a curtain.
Originally Posted By barboy ///I think Disney Seas is very good at staying orginal and creative/// Hista, we have a problem!!! Disney Sea has added/will add 4 attractions since 2001 and all 4 ideas have been borrowed from other parks: Raging Spirits(DlP) Hightower Hotel(DCA, MGM) Crush Talk(DCA, Epcot) Toy Story Mania(DCA, MGM) Disney Sea is now a prime offender and his older sister very close by is guilty too with recent additions like Buzz and Monsters flashlight tours.
Originally Posted By barboy Actually I should have included Buzz (with Toy Story Mania and Turtle talk) as epitomizing this new model of dumbing down attractions.
Originally Posted By barboy ///I like Turtle Talk, but that's probably because it was the first "living-character" show I saw./// I first saw it being tested in DCA and I thought that it would make a very nice experience for the little ones. And over in Epcot it seems well placed. But enough already! As you more or less say leobloom I really don't want that technology replicated over and over: We have Crush Talk at Epcot and Disney Sea, MILF in Magic Kingdom and Stitch in Hong Kong.
Originally Posted By sjhym33 Also Joe Rhode is now in Hawaii working on the resort there. So no FL park as an Imagineer over it.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo Stitch is also at WDSP too Barboy, and fun too. But I think 1 living character show per resort is enough. I think we could be in the minority though.
Originally Posted By barboy ///Also there seems to be no one person who is in charge of the overall theming and care for a particular park./// ----could be, but then I'm reminded of what happened at Rhode's Animal Kingdom with the abysmal Chester and Hester county carnival setup which was so poorly and cheaply done that could sit side by side with Disney's other embarrassment: DCA's Paradise Pier/Route 66.
Originally Posted By sjhym33 ^^^^Definately a poor page in Imagineering history. I remember talking to a friend in Imagineering who worked on AK before opening and he thought the whole idea of Chester and Hester was fun. From the idea of the tacky road side stand to the college guy dinosaur digging adornments around Restaurantosaurus. I think the area lost something when it lost the dinosaur bone exhibit. Once again I think both of those areas points to the fact that Imagineering is less the creative force that it was and is more a provider based on someone elses percieved ideas.
Originally Posted By barboy ///Stitch is also at WDSP too Barboy/// Was it there 2 years ago? I don't remember seeing on the attraction lineup. Anyway learning Stitch belches live in Paris doesn't surprise me in the slightest--- I guess no continent and no destination is safe from the recyled, toonified, 'hightech' screen based/interactive attractions that have become standard issue in Disney parks.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo If memory serves, Stitch Live opened last year in the old Disney Channel Building, with Playhouse Disney Live openening next door this year.
Originally Posted By Hista98 whats ibnteresting is that they tried to clone stitch live at WDW magic kingdom with the supersonic celebration and it cloesd instantlety maybe this will let disney know that just because it has a charecter doesn't mean it's a hit. plus i think sticth is not as succesful as WDW management beleives to me he wa spopular at first but it now seems like he's being forced on everyone.
Originally Posted By barboy ///Why Monsters in TL??/// I guess I never directly answered your question. Joke telling monsters setup camp in Tl because: 1) after becoming huge international stars in 2001 Mike and Roz wanted to ride their wave of success all the way to shore. And one way to stay in the spotlight as long as possible was to tell corny jokes in a nightclub full of easily pleased or unsuspecting WDW guests. 2) they could borrow Crush's technology and play it off as their own and few would know or question it, thus saving costs and ideas. 3) they saw the Time Keeper's building as a physically workable location for their show. 4) Mike knew that Fantasyland's Dumbo, Mad Hatter, Peter Pan, Snow White and Pooh were a close knit classic toon family who wouldn't take too kindly to upstart Pixar creations.
