Originally Posted By leemac <<What does this actually mean for the parks?>> To be honest not a great deal. Eric has been relatively hands-off with WDW for a while and Kathy is building her relationships down in the swamp. FLE was largely driven by Jon Georges (former head of blue sky development who wanted operational experience and led the project). Eric has been instrumental on the design elements of the resort hotels and Disney Springs. There just isn't the capex budget in the current AOP or 5YP to justify a portfolio lead for each park in WDW. Just not enough going on.
Originally Posted By leemac <<I'm also a little concerned that Epcot and the Studios are being grouped together, since they're the ones that need the most work. It seems to me like ether one would be a fulltime job, so I'm worried that we won't see much for a while, which is exactly what WDW doesn't need>> A portfolio lead shouldn't have just one park - it isn't a FT role. Even TDR is grouped together as one park. DCA was the anomaly but that was such a huge undertaking. I wouldn't read anything into that fact that there are 3 senior execs (VP or above) working on the 4 WDW parks.
Originally Posted By leemac <<I also know that he was involved in Aulani and that hotel looks fantastic.>> Aulani was planned under Wing Chao's leadership. Joe was given the creative lead once the entire site had been planned including the design. He did change the entire color palette and interior design though - he felt it was too dark. However everything else was already done and set in stone. Joe has been with WDI for a long time. DAK was his signature project but he has worked on a host of other projects in the past.
Originally Posted By leemac <<But overall I consider the overall look and feel of the park to be an absolute masterpiece, and consider it WDW's most well designed park... by a mile!>> Joe had a phenomenal team on DAK - folks that weren't your typical imagineers - they had a lot of outside experience. I've always credited Katie Olsen with a lot of the "look" of the park - her color palette works to perfection. Joe is a great designer - a tremendous artist. As EP for the park his role was to maintain the overall thematic design and supervise the menu planning efforts. No single person has the bandwidth to run an entire park through every creative process. I do think that a number of signature attractions have some story issues - like CTX and Kali. However at least every single attraction "fits" into the park's mantra. Even Dino-Rama fits - and Joe absolutely believes it fits - he has always defended that mini-land to the hilt.
Originally Posted By leemac <<From a design standpoint, there actually is logic to the DAK parking lot. >> I'd have to go back through my files but I think there are some site-specific issues with the lot - there are definitely some nasty sinkholes in that area. There definitely wasn't any "show" considerations for the lot itself - otherwise the toll plaza would not have had a clear view of the entrance. I don't know the genesis of the FOH of the park but there are some issues around the CM lot, shuttle drop-off and bus terminal. It is functional rather than anything theatrical.
Originally Posted By leemac <The only real reason for DCA's lack of berm was that they were being cheap (and had some pretty tough intrustions to hypothetically block out, like the PPH towers and electric lines)> One man's cheapness is another man's reality. That site was doomed from the start when it came to visual intrusion. There was absolutely no way to create a berm - none. Harbor could have been a little easier to manage but Katella was always going to be a major pain. One study put the cost of creating an artificial berm at over $500m - that was the entire budget for all of PP.
Originally Posted By leemac <<tacking on an action storyline to Killimanjaro Safari was dumb, Countdown to Extinction leaves alot to be desired and while Kali and Expedition Everest look nice from the outside the rides themselves are very bland with nothing to look at no excitment. >> The Safari had MDE's pawprints all over it. He was absolutely fixated by it and gave a lot of notes. I'm not sure I'd describe it as "dumb" - KS needed a linear storyline just to aid to the immersion. The poaching storyline may have been a little preachy but it was an obvious one. At one stage there was even going to be a post-show that displayed the effects of poaching - that got nixed! I'm blind to CTX - it has my favorite pre-show and I've always liked it a lot. I thought it could have been a little more expansive within the show building but there are some strong visual element IMHO. Kali is a mess - a very poor rapids ride indeed. It was in development at the same time as GRR (albeit it opened two years earlier) and I'm still surprised that the DAK team didn't work with the site plan more. The logging scene at the summit is rather poorly executed too.
Originally Posted By plpeters70 <<Even Dino-Rama fits - and Joe absolutely believes it fits - he has always defended that mini-land to the hilt.>> Another horribly designed area in terms of keeping guests cool on a hot day. While a carnival setup in what looks to be a parking lot might fit the "theme" of Dinoland, it sure makes for a lousy experience when you're standing out in the middle of all that back top on a hot, summer's day. Seriously, do the Imagineers even consider the guest's experience anymore, or is it all about driving folks into shops and restaurants by making it as uncomfortable as possible outside in the sun?
Originally Posted By plpeters70 <<The poaching storyline may have been a little preachy but it was an obvious one.>> Having just gone on the new version, I actually miss the storyline. Now, all you have is your driver pointing out animals if they happen to see them, and giving a couple of lines about old bridges, etc. I actually found the ride pretty dull, and it just ended so abruptly. I never thought I'd say this, but I miss the Simba 1 commentary and saving Little Red...
Originally Posted By leemac This is sidestepping Eric to a degree. Eric has never played the politics game at WDI and has always been highly regarded - some of his pet projects have been phenomenally successful and he is regarded as one of the strong collaborators within the segment. Kathy has been angling to replace Eric as WDW portfolio lead for a long time. She has had limited international exposure so this was the natural progression after her work on the left coast. She is best buds with Bruce Vaughn so got this gig eventually. Let's hope it results in some significant capex - capex that isn't currently approved.
Originally Posted By leemac <<Another horribly designed area in terms of keeping guests cool on a hot day.>> Very true - those industrial fans in the queue lines just seem to make it worse. The problem with Dino-Rama is that Joe wanted clean visuals - you can see the entire land when you approach it - plus of course it is a parking lot so you can't have trees in the middle. I guess the overall conceit negates the ability to provide adequate shade.
Originally Posted By leemac <<I actually found the ride pretty dull, and it just ended so abruptly. I never thought I'd say this, but I miss the Simba 1 commentary and saving Little Red...>> The main reason for the storyline and dialog was to provide some interstitial moments between scenes so guests weren't just staring off. It worked to engage them in the experience and make them active participants. Now it is just a passive visual experience.
Originally Posted By plpeters70 <<I guess the overall conceit negates the ability to provide adequate shade.>> Very true. It just makes me wonder why they choose these themes to begin with, when they know that at the end of the day, they are running a theme park in Central Florida - where it's hot and muggy most of the year. You would think they would try and make some concessions to that fact, instead of choosing themes that require environments without shade or air conditioning.
Originally Posted By leobloom >> Another horribly designed area in terms of keeping guests cool on a hot day. While a carnival setup in what looks to be a parking lot might fit the "theme" of Dinoland, it sure makes for a lousy experience when you're standing out in the middle of all that back top on a hot, summer's day. << I can't even remember the last time I went to DAK during the summer. It's probably been close to 10 years, and even then we were gone by midday. As bad as WDW is during summer, DAK is just the worst. But as long as the "theme" is preserved...
Originally Posted By sjhym333 I was on the ops team for the AK opening and sat in on several meetings with Eisner who was very excited about the whole conservation theme of the park and Kilimanjaro especially. I also had the opportunity to ride CTX with him and the Imagineering team where he gave notes about the vehicle movement through the attraction. The one I remember most was he said that the vehicle needed to "land" more when it time traveled. Every time I ride CTX I think about that.
Originally Posted By FerretAfros >>There just isn't the capex budget in the current AOP or 5YP to justify a portfolio lead for each park in WDW. Just not enough going on.<< I know you're limited on what information you can give, but if there really aren't any large capex projects on the horizon (other than Avatar (yah right) and Disney Springs), then what is Disney planning to do in order to get guests into the parks? Do they really think that the NextGen stuff will be *that* great, enough to convince people to come? Or are we supposed to believe that the next half decade of meaningless marketing promotions are going to make the difference? With how stale WDW is in its current state, I'm very concerned that they don't appear to have much planned for the future. When a shark stops moving around in the water, it dies because the water doesn't pass over its gills any more; when a tourist attraction stops doing things that actually attract tourists, it also dies because there's no money flowing into their coffers.
Originally Posted By leemac <<I know you're limited on what information you can give, but if there really aren't any large capex projects on the horizon (other than Avatar (yah right) and Disney Springs), then what is Disney planning to do in order to get guests into the parks? >> I'm not that privy to what is going on in the swamp to be honest - not until it gets to review phase. The general view is that WDW is at the top of the demand curve and in a maturity phase. WDP&R believes that to prevent falling into decline it needs to innovate the product rather than improve or increase the product - hence NGE.
Originally Posted By leemac <<Do they really think that the NextGen stuff will be *that* great, enough to convince people to come? >> I've been skeptical about it from the start. My motto has always been if it ain't broke don't fix it. The model has been perfect for nearly 60 years and doesn't show any sign of ageing.
Originally Posted By sjhym333 Amen. But i think Disney knows that i am no longer its audience. My kids and my kids kids are and will be and NexGen will appeal to them
Originally Posted By wahooskipper #39 is one of the most intelligent things I've ever seen written in LP. Disney likewise is not making decisions for fanatics in general which we often forget as we are criticizing left and right.
