Originally Posted By DouglasDubh <What you did was post a few articles held by people with the minority view, and that's fine.> How do you know they are the minority? Did you take a poll? <But plenty of other people have posted articles held by scientists holding the majority view, that were not alarmist at all.> And plenty of other people have posted comments that were alarmist, and then failed to back them up with anything scientific. <But to pretend that they hold equal weight with the non-alarmist majority view is to be intentionally misleading.> Science isn't decided on votes, unfortunately.
Originally Posted By mrichmondj Yes, unfortunately it will be decided by the the sad facts when hundreds of millions are faced with hardship due to famine and flooding.
Originally Posted By DouglasDubh <Yes, unfortunately it will be decided by the the sad facts when hundreds of millions are faced with hardship due to famine and flooding.> Please present a peer-reviewed article from a scientific journal that states that will happen.
Originally Posted By ADMIN <font color="#FF0000">Message removed by an administrator. <a href="MsgBoard-Rules.asp" target="_blank">Click here</a> for the LaughingPlace.com Community Standards.</font>
Originally Posted By DouglasDubh I have. It doesn't say that hundreds of millions face hardship due to famine and flooding.
Originally Posted By jonvn Really. What does it say? Does it say there's not any global warming at all? That'd be interesting. But here, look at this. Some guy from NASA... <a href="http://yaleglobal.yale.edu/display.article?id=8305" target="_blank">http://yaleglobal.yale.edu/dis play.article?id=8305</a> You can find these same stats all over the net.
Originally Posted By jonvn And, well, in this article, they mention the UN report you said you read, and it seems to claim that melting ice caps and sea level rises may displace 100 million people: <a href="http://news.independent.co.uk/environment/article2211566.ece" target="_blank">http://news.independent.co.uk/ environment/article2211566.ece</a> So, I can believe them or you....hmm....
Originally Posted By jonvn Oh, and wait...wasn't the Australian one of the papers you once linked to about trying to deny this stuff? <a href="http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0" target="_blank">http://www.theaustralian.news. com.au/story/0</a>,20867,21726135-1702,00.html
Originally Posted By DouglasDubh <What does it say?> Lots of stuff, but not what was just claimed. <Does it say there's not any global warming at all?> Of course not, but it predicts much less ocean rise than Mr Hanson claimed. <So, apparently its in the February 2007 UN report.> Maybe you should read the report and show me where. Because I'm not seeing it. And you, apparently, can't find a peer-reviewed that supports your global warming claims.
Originally Posted By mrichmondj << Because I'm not seeing it. >> Sight works best with your eyes open.
Originally Posted By DouglasDubh Quote it for me. If it's there, it won't be a problem to show me something specific.
Originally Posted By mrichmondj <a href="http://www.ipcc-wg2.org/index.html" target="_blank">http://www.ipcc-wg2.org/index. html</a> The estimates in the numbers of people impacted just due to famines in Africa alone range from 75 - 250 million people. Add in the coastal flooding in Southeast Asia, and you add tens of millions more to those impacted.
Originally Posted By jonvn "Maybe you should read the report and show me where." I have read through it. In Nigeria alone, it is expected to cause 10 million people to be displaced, and in Asia, where run off from the Himalayas is used for fresh water, upwards of a billion people are going to suffer adverse effects due to lack of water. 10 to 15 percent of current lowland around the world are going to be flooded out. And so on. It's a long report. With lots of fun consequences that we have to address, and would except that people such as yourself wish to stick their fingers in their ears and go LA LA LA LA so they don't hear it. These reports are very plain in their content and what they say. They are echoed around the world by other agencies as well. Nonsense objection after nonsense objection has been raised on this board and shot down. And then they are brought up again. You may think that this isn't going to affect you, but it already has started. And in a few short years, we're going to start seeing some very bad effects from this. And if we continue to do nothing, the situation will continue to get even worse as time goes on. Eventually, even luddites and deniers, if they are still alive, will have to simply say "oops," and maybe they'll figure we need to do something then. Hopefully it won't be too late.
Originally Posted By DAR Look the more I've read up on global warming I realize it's foolish to not acknowledge something is happening. However it's always good to have a little bit of healthy skepticism when it comes to such matters.
Originally Posted By JohnS1 I find it interesting how, when faced with predictions of future famines and drought related deaths and flood-related deaths, we are the most compassionate people ever. But there are already famines and drought-related and flood-related deaths happening right now, and happening all the time all around the world. People die by the millions every year and receive very little relief- either because very little help is offered, or because the help which is offered is ineffective and always will be ineffective to stop the natural processes of nature thinning out the world's population, as have taken place throughout history. Worrying about the victims of natural disasters and natural, but devastating weather patterns -- or even unnatural weather patterns, as is suggested by global warming -- may make us feel very giving and caring and thoughtful, but I doubt the future victims of famine and death will fare any better than today's, whether global warming is stopped in its tracks or not. World hunger and disease and death will never be solved because the number of people and the nature of the world's geography and climate and location of its populations of people make such devastating human events inevitable. Sorry.
Originally Posted By jonvn Yes, skepticism is excellent. And I've always said, hey if they are wrong, we'll find out. In the meantime, we have to go with the best information we have. And yes, we should try to figure out how to help people TODAY, too. The thing is what we are seeing now? It is going to be nothing compared to what is coming. One BILLION people are going to have to figure out how to get water to drink. That's just the tip of it. Increase in disease, famine, starvation, all from shifting weather patterns. So my suggestion is that if you think we are not doing enough today to help people in these situations, then maybe you could help do something about it. We can't even help people in our own country, with Katrina. Our government is so utterly inept that when it does need to do something, like help in disasters or defend us against terrorism, it fails. All it seems able to do is prosecute cancer patients for growing marijuana and taxing us. It is very discouraging.
Originally Posted By Dabob2 <<What you did was post a few articles held by people with the minority view, and that's fine.>> <How do you know they are the minority? Did you take a poll?> The scientists of the world have essentially done their own poll. The majority report can be seen in the IPCC. <<But plenty of other people have posted articles held by scientists holding the majority view, that were not alarmist at all.>> <And plenty of other people have posted comments that were alarmist, and then failed to back them up with anything scientific.> So take it up with them. I haven't done that. Did I take you to task when Beau posted some fringe remark? No. <<But to pretend that they hold equal weight with the non-alarmist majority view is to be intentionally misleading.>> <Science isn't decided on votes, unfortunately.> Actually, that's fortunate. Anyway, science is decided via the scientific method. And that method itself has led to the consensus view that global warming is happening, is at least partially due to human activity, and needs to be addressed before we reach tipping points that lead to some very bad situations.
