Originally Posted By DVC_dad But it's ok, I will pray for you since you are no longer willing to sup with the sinners in WE. Go on, leave, its ok, I understand. You've had enough.
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder Well DVC, pertaining to your last two posts, that's why I can't take guys like RC seriously and react as I do. The guy's a hypocrite, judgmental, thinks he's better than other and cloaks it all in the bible. You didn't say it, but I don't see saying that as name calling. It's what he is. If I called him stupid, which he isn't and I didn't, that would be name calling. To me, there's a difference. It might be very subtle, but there's a distinction to be made.
Originally Posted By X-san Interestingly, I don't think LP is nearly the "liberal bastion" people make it out to be. I can see why it seems that way, but knowing some posters outside these walls so to speak you'd be surprised at how many are quite moderate, and several are even Republicans though they don't mention it here. The reason it SEEMS that way is because the severe right-wingers on LP spend so much time trying to defend indefensible things and sneer at the "stupid liberals", that they catch a lot of flack from pretty much all sides (and that is much deserved, I might add). Even as for myself, someone many assume to be a staunch liberal, I have some viewpoints that I think most logical people would consider moderate. Particularly on issues like abortion and the death penalty (against it, for it, believe it or not).
Originally Posted By DVC_dad Okay X-san, the abortion and death penalty...uh..that was unexpected. SPP I TOTALLY understand what you mean. In fact allow me to give an example. "I am as offended as anyone at the cowardice tactic from RC." I'm not calling him a coward. I'm not calling him a name. I'm saying that a hit and run post is not a great way to have people take you seriously, and it's certainly not a way to be able to say "score! hooray for our side!" The more I hang around here the more I am thinking how stupid following the party line really is. God, what is happening to me !?!?!?!? I'm a Republican dammit!
Originally Posted By X-san ***Okay X-san, the abortion and death penalty...uh..that was unexpected.*** I know, right? It's not as simple as that, of course (is it supposed to be?), in the sense that I'm in favor of the death penalty but I believe there should be more oversight and it should be used very rarely, and essentially I'm the same on abortion...I think it should be legal but very, very rare and I think it should be a lot harder to get one than it is now (like, you have to petition a court or something and prove something more substantial than "well, a kid would be inconvenient right now").
Originally Posted By DyGDisney What, exactly, is a feminized husband? My husband makes jam, does that make him "feminized". Course the jam he made tonight had habaneros in it..... Yeah, I'm surprised too, X-san. I'm with you on the against abortion thing, but not the pro death penalty. But, as I've said before, I'm glad you and I are (mostly) on the same side!! Weird how we both come off as liberal, but have a more conservative viewpoint on abortion.
Originally Posted By ecdc >>and also anyone who doesn’t celebrate a court - overriding the popular vote - forcing the removal of "bride" and "groom" from state marriage licensing while that state’s domestic partnership law still discriminates against both-sex couples<< Of course, the United States is set up to not always be ruled by popular vote. This part of our country (which many Christians believe was inspired by God, BTW) is what gave us things like Brown v. Board, civil rights legislation, etc. Those things were often done against the popular will of the people. It's precisely the same thing here. >>Have you ever considered that you are wasting your time here in World Events, or at least using it extremely inefficiently? I tend to think I was, which is why I have been so quiet here lately. Heck, I haven’t bothered to read any of most of the recent threads.<< Thus begins the sheer arrogance of this post. People are well aware of their participation in LP, what it costs them, and why they do it. Some people do choose from time to time to leave or take a "time out" for various reasons. They do so because they're aware of the constraints in their lives and they don't need someone to lecture them on what they should and shouldn't do. >>Disney is a company that specializes in make-believe, expensive vacations, and overpriced merchandise. It attracts idealists, hopeless romantics, and people obsessed with sweetened-up fairy tales. It has a major "Hollywood" studio and a major broadcast television network, a live theatre business, and resorts that employ scores of thousands in low-wage service jobs. As such, there is going to be a larger-than-in-the-general-population percentage of wishful thinkers, people governed by fleeting emotions, feminized husbands (married to women with a princess complex and supporting her overspending on Disneyana), childish adults, liberals, people with a bent towards liberal homosexual activism, moral relativists, frustrated dreamers, hedonists, people who have a problem dealing with reality and use Disney too much as escapism, and people who resent their low wages and think they are owed more by other people.<< This is pure fantasy and nonsense. It's an assumption and an accusation without a single *shred* of evidence to back it up. It's a gross generalization without any data. We're not told how many people that like Disney are idealists or hopeless romantics, we're not provided with any figures on how much is spent on Disneyana, or how many liberals or "childish adults," etc., etc. Instead, the OP tosses label after label at a huge group of people without a leg to stand on. Ironically, this is done in some bizarre defense of "God" and "morals," yet, the very same labels could easily be thrown at Christians. I could create a thread that insists that Christians attract "people obsessed with sweetened-up fairy tales, childish adults, hedonists, those with a bent towards judging others, frustrated dreamers, and people who have a problem dealing with reality and use religion too much as escapism." Of course, I wouldn't do that because it would be an extremely foolish oversimplification. Such a post would say far, FAR more about me and my deeply warped worldview than it ever would about the group I'm commenting on. Such is the case here. >>I’m NOT arguing that everyone who falls into all of these categories is close-minded, unreasonable, or incapable of presenting sound, valid arguments in defense or promotion of their opinions.<< This is like the couple that goes to marriage counseling, and one spouse begins by saying "Now, I know I'm not perfect, BUT" and then goes on a rant for 20 minutes about how terrible their partner is. "I just spent a lengthy paragraph demonizing Disney fans and insulting a great many people on these boards because I'm clearly frustrated at my inability to debate effectively on these boards, BUT I'm not saying it about everybody." Sorry, it just doesn't fly - not even a little bit. >>But these ARE people who are more likely to believe it is the responsibility of a President of the United States to make their life better, and that a candidate can and will do so if elected by reducing financial freedom and independence. These are people who are more apt to believe that when a politician touts the extremely vague promise of "change", those changes will all be changes *they* like and will work out well. They expect the government to care about and cater to their feelings. They expect to be taken care of by people with more money than them. They don’t like anything that might imply that there are some ways or times genitals should not be used. These are people who think they have a right to force other people to do things for them.<< This nonsense is simply more of the same. Dabob2 put it quite well: >Post one is essentially someone telling other people what they believe (or are "apt" to believe), what they "expect," and what their arguments are supposedly based on. As with most posts from either right or left extreme telling OTHER people what they supposedly believe, etc., it is chock full of inaccuracies, simply reflects the poster's warped view of the other side, and is essentially a long attempt at self-validation by the poster.< Bingo. Yet again this says far more about the OP than the groups he claims to be talking about. This is a fantasy world of boogeymen and self-entitled lay abouts that only exist in his head. (And again, hopefully the irony isn't lost on anyone that the same kind of treatment could be extended to the kind of people RC claims to be standing up for. >>Who is most likely going to have the time to consistently get into deep political conversations on a Disney fan board? People with too much idle time on their hands, or people who are neglecting things they shouldn’t. What does that tell you about the people with whom you are arguing in 200-plus post threads? What does that tell you about yourself if you keep participating?<< Doesn't the Bible say something about judge not? No one has any idea how much time someone has on their hands, or if they're neglecting things they shouldn't. This manages to be arrogant, insulting, and offensive all at once. It's the perfect example of what's wrong with a handful of religious people: they think they can say whatever they want, no matter how mean-spirited, because it's "true" (in their warped definition of the word) and it's being "bold." In reality (and certainly in this case) it's just incredibly inaccurate, impolite, and childish. >>Another thing I’m *not* doing is bashing Disney fandom or working for the mouse. I have worked for Disney, and I remain a Disney fan. I enjoy the finer things about Disney very much. But I don’t let fantasy intrude too much on reality, and I have decided I would rather read up on what’s going on in Disney than argue with other Disney fans about politics, religion, morality, etc., especially since someone who is a Bible-believer and a somewhat libertarian conservative is going to be among the clear minority in posting here.<< My god (or I guess I should say, "your god"), the audacity. Yes, you've got it all figured out, you've got just the right balance. If only the rest of us could be like you and figure it out. It's just all that idle time I must have on my hands while I go to school and work full-time and raise a family. The more I re-read this ridiculous post, the more absurd and laughable it becomes. >>Most mockers of the Bible or any particular church on boards like this aren’t *really* interested in the truth or at least hearing a different opinion. They cynically cite verses or teachings out of context not because they really want to read a good explanation, but because they hope doing so will shut you up. When you offer a reasonable response, they can always deflect by refusing to accept your sources, no matter who or what they are. Many of these people don’t like to think that anything they do is wrong or that they should in any way be held accountable, and they claim you are arrogant for thinking that you know the truth, which is a truth claim on their part, and therefore a self-defeating (but common) position.<< You wouldn't mean mocking like calling an entire religion a cult or its practitioners cultists, right? No, you wouldn't do that! But this paragraph is the revealing one. It's all about sour grapes. Because not everyone here swallows the Bible and it's tales hook, line, and sinker, and you just can't fathom why, they must the problem. They just don't get it; they're reading things out of context, they're not really responding properly. Yes, it's not that your arguments are weak, circular, and rest on a myriad of assumptions (like the fact that the Bible is the word of God at all). The fact that you can't defend your religion satisfactorily is no reason to paint Disney fans and WE's posters with this bitter broad brush you've constructed out of whole cloth. (BTW, it's not very Christian, either.) >>You can’t reason with people who base everything on their own internal feelings. Someone's feelings are their own, after all. When someone essentially argues with "Sez you!" or "Is to!" or "You’re a bigot", the discussion has degenerated and is no longer good for anyone. << Irony at its best. When someone invents a fictitious, unsupportable vision of what Disney fans and WE's participants are, that's not much good for discussion either. The "my imaginary friend is better than your imaginary friend" or "my god can kick your god's butt" posts aren't much help, either. >>So I suggest you are probably better off doing other things, like enjoying more of the rest of LaughingPlace.com. You probably came to LP originally because of your interest in something Disney-related. Enjoy that. Or go spend more time with your family. Or get more politically active, or study your Bible more, or give more time to charity. Stop wasting time arguing about first things and things that should be self-evident with people who don't want to to hear it and just came here to vent about how they don't like a politician or a church teaching. It IS an election year in the USA, so you can be more effective getting involved with a campaign.<< Yes, because again, none of us would've come up with this without you to help us out. Where can I send my check for the advice - certainly such genius isn't free!?! Of course, maybe some of us already do a lot of these things, and yet we manage to enjoy our time in WE's anyway. Maybe we're not like you - a disappointing shock, I know. >>After all, does it really matter all that much if the ventings and rantings and accusations in WE go uncountered?<< And ironically it took you how long to show back up? Wow. >>Since there are likely some curious people reading this who don’t identify with any of the people I was addressing...If you are *really* interested in what the conservative arguments are, or the Bible or Christianity, or even some good discussion of the marriage issue – not what those hostile or those supportive but hapless in arguing say - you might want to check out these sites:<< Yes, because propaganda is so valuable. How incredible that a place where anyone can come and post and debate and present a perspective is derided and insulted, while one-sided propaganda websites full of selective history and reasoning are promoted as credible and valuable. The irony continues. A final thought: If this kind of post is what RC's God wants, then I'm all the more glad I don't believe in it (and I'm glad it's not what most Christians believe in), because a God who would encourage someone to treat others like that is one heck of a jerk and a pretty terrible God.
Originally Posted By wahooskipper You know, I'm guilty of this too...but...if we would have let the post stand without a single comment then it would have probably been more meaningful than all of us trying to call him out on it.
Originally Posted By X-san That'd be great, in theory (I often hope that noone will chime in on topics that I feel deserve no reply, or replies that deserve no comment), but in practice it just doesn't work that way. It's a discussion board. You really can't expect anyone to refrain from discussing what is being said. The only stuff that sinks to the bottom of the LP ocean is the stuff that noone cares about, CERTAINLY not something that is shocking and provocative as this topic obviously is. I find it interesting that some of our right-wing types (the more reasonable ones, I mean..and even a couple of the extremist variety), have ALSO chimed in to condemn the sentiment pretty much unanimously. RC Collins, that doesn't throw up any red flags for ya? I'm going to assume "nope", as an educated guess. Just like when another moonbat was screaming "torture them all! and sort it out later!", even his own supporters were telling him to stifle it, there was just no way to converse with the guy. Same situation, different poster (unless RC Collins has sock puppets, which wouldn't surprise me in the least).
Originally Posted By wahooskipper I would hope that liberals are AS embarassed by their fringe groups of conservatives are of ours. I don't think the fringe groups do any good to either party...but the parties sure like to pander to them.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan The more I hang around here the more I am thinking how stupid following the party line really is. God, what is happening to me !?!?!?!? I'm a Republican dammit!<< LOL! There were a couple of posters on these boards that so parrotted teh GOP talking points (via Limbaugh) on every issue, that it became self-parody. Seeing their hardline stance on things, in spite of reasonable counter arguments on the other side, pushed me more towards the center, and perhaps left of it, than anything the Democrats themselves ever did. Who wants to align with that stuff? >>I don't think the fringe groups do any good to either party...but the parties sure like to pander to them.<< Boy howdy.
Originally Posted By X-san Shameful, sure. But I would submit that the neo-con fringe groups have done MUCH more damage on America as a whole than the left-wing has done (maybe the left-wing fruitcakes need to try harder? lol). As was mentioned in another thread, Rush and his ilk (along with Fox News and the rest of the media machine) has influenced elections, fought for radical changes WITHIN THE PARTY ITSELF (disturbing to say the least, and this from a Reagan Democrat), and brought disinformation and harm to the American people on a MASSIVE scale. I would challenge anyone to point to a left-wing organization that has accomplished the same.
Originally Posted By VCR_Pongo Bah. It all started to go downhill in what, 1965'ish 67'ish? When the national board of education took over giving our kids a "better" edumacation. I don't think that's working out to well and it runs deeply through who we all are today. But then I don't know that much about that much, so I'll just lurk and observe.
Originally Posted By VCR_Pongo Some say that Mr. Rogers and his "You are Special" message to kids left an imprint on us as youngsters that we were entitled to this or that... or what not. I have the DVD's of many of his shows and I show them to my kids. I also have all of the Fat Albert DVD's from way back in the 70's. Do you know that every single episode of Fat Albert taught a very valuable lesson of life. Hey Hey Hey !!!
Originally Posted By X-san ***Some say that Mr. Rogers and his "You are Special" message to kids left an imprint on us as youngsters that we were entitled to this or that... or what not.*** Yeah...I don't buy that crap. Whatever is wrong with kids today (and adults), I think it's pretty out there to blame Mr. Rogers. He was a very "in the moment" kinda guy, I learned later in life. That's not a bad thing, imho. And quite the badass politician too! <a href="http://jp.youtube.com/watch?v=yXEuEUQIP3Q" target="_blank">http://jp.youtube.com/watch?v=...uEUQIP3Q</a> p.s. Fat Albert rocked.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan Do you know that every single episode of Fat Albert taught a very valuable lesson of life.<< Yep, I remember the opening of the show, and Cos would say "If you're not careful, you just might learn something."
Originally Posted By VCR_Pongo <<<And quite the badass politician too!>>> Yep he earned his programming $20 million dollars in 5 minutes! If you haven't seen that video, watch it, it's amazing.
Originally Posted By VCR_Pongo The episodes revolved around the daily life lessons learned by Albert and his friends. Topics ranged from social issues to personal introspection and were blended with humor and music. Among the many great characters that inhabited Fat Albert's world were Rudy, Mushmouth, Donald, Bill, Weird Harold and Russell. In 1979 the show was re-titled The New Fat Albert Show and featured a new segment called The Brown Hornet, a send-up of superhero cartoons starring a larger-than-life African-American crime fighter in outer space. In 1984, the show was syndicated and renamed The Adventures of Fat Albert and the Cosby kids. It ended the same year. Fat Albert and the Cosby Kids enjoyed one of the longest careers in Saturday morning cartoon history.
Originally Posted By VCR_Pongo <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Btb_pAoTkfM" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v..._pAoTkfM</a> Check out this music. awesome.
