Originally Posted By Mickeymouseclub Looks like the Disney Parks blog has just announced DCA 2012 Park of the Year award from Amusement Today Publications. It is the must visit theme park for the year. I am guessing the crowds will be challenging thru the holidays. Makes me glad I saw it when it opened and was just a little crowded!!!
Originally Posted By leemac <<We're also told that Disney uses first clicks in its own numbers, but TEA does not. >> I'm not going to get into the accuracy of the Miceage numbers but this is an absolute fallacy. We use a whole series of attendance metrics that depends on the intended recipients. Park management's bonuses are calculated on "first clicks" - i.e. how big a draw is your park. This is why EMH are spread around at WDW so as to not penalise the smaller parks. However we use total clicks for all forms of planning such as menu, event etc. - the absolute number of guests inside each park each day is far more important than first clicks. You can't staff a park based on first clicks - it is on total clicks. The third metric that is equally important is the number of unique passes that enter the turnstile - this helps to understand park hopping and where specific events trigger attendance uplifts. We don't provide numbers to AECOM - the research firm behind the TEA report - they have to ensure they are comparing apples-with-apples - therefore their numbers aren't as accurate as you would possibly imagine.
Originally Posted By FerretAfros >>but let's see he fails to address some very important issues about that like, where to park the parade floats, emergency vehicle access...<< It sounds like this new alley will be pretty narrow (25-30'), and take up space that was mostly occupied by the merchandise folks. There's room back there to take a slice of land away, and still have emergency vehicles and parade parking, but it's the sales group that will hurt the most from this. Perhaps they'll be able to add more storage on the other side of the street, but other than that (or going below grade, which seems expensive and unlikely) they appear to be SOL. That said, I wouldn't be too surprised if they also used this as excuse for making future parades shorter/smaller, so they can park back there. The alley is a great idea in theory, but if it was actually such a good idea it would have been built years ago (like when they were doing extensive construction along the parade corridor for Light Magic, with its crowd-halting show stops in the middle of Main Street)
Originally Posted By plpeters70 Leemac - I have to ask. If you work for Disney, are you really allowed to be making these posts about how Disney runs their business on the web? Do they allow that? Just curious.
Originally Posted By Manfried And the Al said, "DCA still does Christmas-Lite compared to Disneyland when it comes to decorations, attractions and entertainment, although the full Christmas treatment will be applied this November in Cars Land and on Buena Vista Street. The official DCA Christmas tree will take up residence in the small plaza in front of the Elias & Co. department store, making the Storytellers statue photo op just in front of the tree a must-have all over again for Disney fans." Let's just focus on the one statement at the beginning "DCA still does Christmas-Lite" Hmmm, sounds like more than lite. Let's see what someone over at a (GASP) more accurate site says shall we? " the Christmas decorations over in Buena Vista Street and Cars Land as well as other areas are going to shine. You will truly walk back into a 20's/30's Los Angeles during the winter holidays. The way Walt would have celebrated it, had you been around to see it. The music, decorations and characters are going to make DCA a place to be. California Adventure was never in competition with Disneyland over the past decade during X-Mas. This year, that will not be the case." Check it out yourselves. <a href="http://www.blueskydisney.com/2012/09/know-flakes.html" target="_blank">http://www.blueskydisney.com/2...kes.html</a>
Originally Posted By TP2000 There are still no Christmas themed attractions at DCA, no Christmas parade, no Christmas World of Color, and no evening entertainment themed to Christmas like the Snow Shows on Main Street/Castle or the Clock Shows at Small World. They do decorate a bit for Christmas at DCA, and Al Lutz has said they'll be decorating Cars Land and BVS nicely this year. (Disney has yet to admit this though, after Al first mentioned it a few months ago). But compared to Disneyland of the past 10 years, the description of DCA as Christmas-Lite is pretty accurate so far. As for the alley, Mr. Lutz said it would be "twenty feet wide", which would push the existing buildings east by twenty feet. Surely there will still be room for parade float parking back there. On Google Earth there's a fairly open lot a couple hundred feet wide between the existing backside of Main Street out-buildings and the western flank of Space Mountain.
Originally Posted By leemac <<Leemac - I have to ask. If you work for Disney, are you really allowed to be making these posts about how Disney runs their business on the web? Do they allow that? Just curious.>> Sure - it isn't proprietary or confidential. I'm not confirming or denying the numbers - I'm just trying to explain how things work - and to be honest it isn't too difficult to work out that first click isn't an appropriate measure on which to base your in-park decisions. The internet fixation with this particular method is rather perplexing to me.
Originally Posted By FerretAfros >>You will truly walk back into a 20's/30's Los Angeles during the winter holidays.<< So they will have minimal decorations then, and focus mainly on the store windows? For some reason I imagine their approach will be more like they do in the other parks, where they do tons of decorations in the modern style, but give them mostly-era-appropriate details. The garlands on Main Street might have happened way-back-when, but I doubt they had Mickey-shaped wreaths in them, and that every single storefront was also decked out in matching greenery. Sure, it's pretty, but I don't think it's any more in theme than the turkey leg cart in Frontierland that is painted to resemble weathered wood. >>There are still no Christmas themed attractions at DCA...<< Which seems strange, since TSMM was created with Christmas and Halloween overlays that could be installed at the flick of a switch. I guess they're waiting for the 'right' time to announce the new games, but it seems like they should have done it by now, especially since they revamped the games for TS3 a few years ago. (Speaking of which, anybody know when they're going to update the TOT drop sequence? It's been almost a decade since the attraction opened, and it hasn't changed a bit)
Originally Posted By leemac <<Which seems strange, since TSMM was created with Christmas and Halloween overlays that could be installed at the flick of a switch. >> The games still need to be designed and programmed - the installation is the easiest bit by far. There haven't been any game redesigns ordered for seasonal overlays. TDS would like to try them beginning next fall but if the attraction continues to be as popular as it has been in its first 10 weeks of operation then I'm sure they will hold off too.
Originally Posted By Manfried <<On Google Earth there's a fairly open lot a couple hundred feet wide between the existing backside of Main Street out-buildings and the western flank of Space Mountain.>> And that entire space is filled to the brim with parade floats when the parades make their way down Main Street. So where would you park the floats?
Originally Posted By CuriousConstance "<<Leemac - I have to ask. If you work for Disney, are you really allowed to be making these posts about how Disney runs their business on the web? Do they allow that? Just curious.>> Sure - it isn't proprietary or confidential. I'm not confirming or denying the numbers - I'm just trying to explain how things work - and to be honest it isn't too difficult to work out that first click isn't an appropriate measure on which to base your in-park decisions. The internet fixation with this particular method is rather perplexing to me." Lee, when you're ready to divulge the truly juicy, ground for being fired tidbits, let me know, I'll e-mail you my cell phone number.
Originally Posted By fkurucz >>No other year has even come close...not even the 50th. << Yikes! We went in Oct, 2005 and we thought it was unbearably crowded then.
Originally Posted By TP2000 "And that entire space is filled to the brim with parade floats when the parades make their way down Main Street. So where would you park the floats?" When I look at Google Earth of that area, there appears to already be the direct path that this 20 foot wide alley Al Lutz has described, with existing buildings on its flanks. Turn the pseudo-path into an "Onstage" alley, and turn the existing industrial buildings and sheds into fully themed new buildings housing new facilities, and you're done. <a href="http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&tab=wl" target="_blank">http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&tab=wl</a> You don't even get close to the parade float parking areas. If anything, reconfiguring the patchwork of existing small buildings and structures along that new alley would open up even more room back there. I just love Google Earth!
Originally Posted By Mickeymouseclub The bluesky link in post 26 "Know flakes" is interesting because of all the extra topics included to read...but my first thought with the description of an authentic Xmas Holiday as experienced by Walt means NO xmas until after Thanksgiving including the arrival of Santa Claus in the Elias Dept. Store!!! Now that would be tradition and I guess no snowflakes for Walt in sunny California...
Originally Posted By Manfried Ah, the Al defenders. Sure, if Disney decides to actually get rid of those support buildings. It could happen, but it is a very expensive proposition for more reasons than what Google Earth shows. Parade parking. Infrastructure. Emergency vehicle access and staging. I'd love to see something like this, but it's not as simple as "Google Earth" seems to show. And Disney should spend millions just to make this come true when it adds how much to the bottom line? NADA. But when Al said there would be a new attraction with an entrance through Main Street Cinema we saw how that one came true too, didn't we?
Originally Posted By TP2000 I suppose it might not happen. But it doesn't seem to be that big of a deal. And why mention it at all if it's not something currently working through the halls of TDA and WDI? Taking down the existing metal sheds behind Main Street and turning it into a finished alley would appear to be slightly less involved than removing Maliburitos and building Midway Mania beneath an operating roller coaster, and slightly more involved than turning Burger Invasion into Paradise Gardens. And it sure would help crowd control about 250 or 275 nights out of the year.
Originally Posted By Manfried So, you would rather they build a fake street to alleviate a crowd problem than spend that same money on a new attraction? That's what it is about at Disneyland from a financial standpoint. A fixed amount of money being spent. I would rather see new attractions. But if that is your priority...
Originally Posted By Dabob2 I'm wondering how much it would really alleviate crowd conditions, which I agree can be terrible on certain nights when everyone is leaving at once. But the MK's with alleys behind their Main Streets were designed that way. If you add this alley behind Main Street, it doesn't really alleviate the problem much, I don't think, unless you open up another egress point to the east of the east tunnel. Otherwise you have the same bottlenecks, just another "street" feeding into them. But the way Al was talking in his article, it sounds like it's not really about the egress problem after fireworks or then DL closes. It's really about getting people up and down Main Street more quickly during a parade or Fireworks time who aren't interested in watching a parade or fireworks. For that, it might work pretty well.
Originally Posted By TP2000 They currently open up the opposite side of Main Street on many nights per year, over on the western edge between the backside of the Main Street buildings and the Jungle Cruise. That walk takes you through some narrow alleyways and doors (about 8 feet wide), and then past the Jungle Cruise storage canal, past trash dumpsters and CM break areas, alongside cargo docks and delivery doors, and parking for the streetcars. It's a dirty, smelly way to exit the Magic Kingdom. It sounds like they want to create an alternate pathway on the opposite side of the street, but theme it nicely and make it about twice as wide at 20 feet across, bordered by new structures housing the same facilities that already exist in the general vicinity; lockers, first aid, baby care center, wish lounge, plus some storage areas and a ice cream window. Sounds good to me. TDA is likely realizing the currently dirty and borderline unsafe route they use to send guests "backstage" to alleviate overcrowding and gridlock just isn't working a decade into that "temporary" plan.
