Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<The only real problem with you guys is that you base all your anxt on your individual way of looking at things.>> I'm gonna assume you mean angst here, yes? <<Do you have an eye for detail and how things should be?>> Yes, I do. Part of that is because I was conditioned to expect the highest level of quality and attention to detail by TWDC itself. Part of it is because I am in the entertainment business myself and am trained to see things. And part is just the way my mind works ... I notice things (good, bad and ugly). <<I have no doubt but if having that eye means that I can no longer enjoy WDW to it's fullest, then I don't want that eye. I'm far happier without it.>> See, I don't really know how to respond to that. I still enjoy WDW a good deal or I wouldn't go. But I'm not sure what enjoying it to the fullest means here. if it means shutting your mind off to anything negative or anything that isn't right during a visit, then ... no, I do not enjoy WDW to your definition of fullest. <<X has been there many times and I wouldn't have questioned his observations and absolute statement that everything was working. Spirit, although an expert on the US sites is more of a neophite when it comes to Tokyo.>> That is true, but as someone with my background and knowledge, I wasn't so wowed by TDR (although the parks, especially TDS are wonders) that I didn't notice things I had 'issues' with ... most things I have never seen people mention on Disney fan forums. <<I guess it just goes down to the fact that I am not influenced by either of your opinions on this topic, because I use my own judgment on what I enjoy and what I don't. If my tolorance for things not working is higher than yours well that's just too bad and none of your business anyway.>> That's fine. No one has ordained you can't feel a certain way about what works in a Disney theme park (perhaps, Janet Napolitano has decreed that recently though and I missed it!) ... but I would say if enough people say 'sure things aren't working like they once did, but who cares? I'm on vacation.' we all wind up losing because it allows Disney to lower standards more. I hope you would understand that IS how a 21st century American corporation operates. They want YOU (ALL OF US) to accept lower and lower quality for higher and higher prices. Who wins and who loses in that equation? <<This lady came on line and stated her joy with what she experienced at WDW. A lot of people basically told her what a moron she was for feeling that way especially since Disney had declined so much since it's inception.>> No. That's rewriting history. She started a thread basically bashing people for being negative about WDW and TWDC and wondered why they would post those type thoughts/opinions/experiences. <<She created this basically asking why. Why do you folks find it necessary to burst her bubble? What possible joy do you get from it?>> I don't know anyone who is here to burst anyone's bubble or who would get joy out of doing so. If someone posts a magical trip report thread on the report board or planning board, then I doubt you'll see anyone go into it and rip it apart. On the WDW general board here, you get more lively discussions. <<Is it the display of Disney superiority that makes it so appealing or is it just an uncontrolable need to spread "joy" everyplace. She was looking for a place that had the same feelings she had, but that isn't what she got. She basically said, like Thumper, "if you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all. She had that right also. >> Starting a thread by being confrontational over anyone who posts negative opinions regarding WDW is only going to elicit one thing for certain: more negativity. <<I admit that she was a tad too sensitive about it, but just like yourselves she was looking for common ground, common emotions and common experiences. This board is no longer able to supply that. We must be told over and over again how bad it has gotten as if there is anything, short of not going anymore, that we can do about it. You guys don't even do that. Send letters to the Disney people, they are the only ones that can make things all better again. The rest of us would just like to enjoy what we do have. Share the fun and awe. There are plenty of threads that are set up strickly to beat up the Mouse, that would be a good place for all that negativity.>> I've been down this road in my decade-plus of posting on Disney fan forums off and on ... and writing TWDC is a great waste of time. There are many ways of affecting change, or at least getting attention, but writing Guest Relations to complain about Disney's business model or view of running WDW in the 21st century isn't going to get you anywhere. "America can’t move forward until we once again believe...that everyone can enter Frontierland if they try hard enough, and that no one will be denied a dream because a private party has rented out Tomorrowland." Frank Rich, NY Times
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 << Well, the Imagineers apparantly didn't want them to do this during the Holiday makeover, so they turned off a portion of the effect.>> <<Do you know this for a fact? I doubt the effect would have been turned off deliberately. Sounds as if the lighting on the two dueling mannequins was not functioning for the Pepper's Ghost effect. The pistol flash at the end of their guns had not been turned off and was seen in the appropriate locations at the proper time, which means power was being supplied to their turntables and they were moving. They were simply not being illuminated by their lighting rigs during that movement.>> That sounds more like it. I know the duelers were shooting in TDL a few weeks ago and seem to recall they always were in Anaheim too ... so I think skinner nailed it here. "America can’t move forward until we once again believe...that everyone can enter Frontierland if they try hard enough, and that no one will be denied a dream because a private party has rented out Tomorrowland." Frank Rich, NY Times
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 ***Yeah, but it just means my comparison thread will be quite entertaining if I ever start writing it!*** <<Consider it your end-of-year project. That way you'll have a deadline! ;p>> If you only knew how much catching up I have to do ... and not sure exactly how soon I'll be off for Asia again too. And all I feel like doing right now is sleeping! ***Spirit would like to witness the insanity for himself sometime ... just kinda to say he did!*** <<It's equal parts hilarious and awe-inspiring. Probably the most singularly unique Disney experience I can imagine.>> It has to be ... it does make me wonder if Disney should do that in the States. They did at DL for years (definitely into the 1980s) ... and WDW could certainly do so at one park (either MK or Studios) and leave the other and EPCOT open for regular crowds. Only time I'd favor hard-ticket parties! "America can’t move forward until we once again believe...that everyone can enter Frontierland if they try hard enough, and that no one will be denied a dream because a private party has rented out Tomorrowland." Frank Rich, NY Times
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>I know the duelers were shooting in TDL a few weeks ago and seem to recall they always were in Anaheim too ... so I think skinner nailed it here.<<< And it was in WDW's HM. If anything is constantly up to TDL's standards it's our HM. Hasn't been anything but perfect since 2007 and it's refurb.
Originally Posted By The Duck The biggest problem that I find on these boards is the arrogant, condescending manner that some individuals feel that they have to use. If you disagree with someone, that's OK. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. But some seem hellbent on displaying a certain "Disney-er than Thou" type of attitude that is just plain rude. If the only way that you can feel better about yourself is by putting other people down, what does that say about you? On some sites, this behavior would be called trolling.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>> "Disney-er than Thou"<<< Hah! I've never thought of it that way... ...Gonna use it in the future..
Originally Posted By danyoung >Sounds as if the lighting on the two dueling mannequins was not functioning for the Pepper's Ghost effect.< That's entirely possible, and much easier to stomach than the scenario that came to my mind. Still, it's bad attention to detail to leave one part of the effect working without the full effect.
Originally Posted By Mr X ***Still, it's bad attention to detail to leave one part of the effect working without the full effect*** Funny, I would call it bad attention to detail to have ANY part of ANY effect not working.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo >>>but I would say if enough people say 'sure things aren't working like they once did, but who cares? I'm on vacation.' we all wind up losing because it allows Disney to lower standards more. I hope you would understand that IS how a 21st century American corporation operates. They want YOU (ALL OF US) to accept lower and lower quality for higher and higher prices. Who wins and who loses in that equation?<<< And hence why I have wasted so much of my time trying to open people's eyes so they vocalise too. But you know what, it is not working, people are content to accept mediocrity. So I am now on a quest to find new interests. After our trip to DLP we are heading to Europa PArk and Phantasialand in Germany, and later in the year, Eftling in the Netherlands. I cannot wait, and am more excited about those trips than our DLP trip. Off to the Alton Towers resort tomorrow (which offers better value than many Disney resorts) and looking forward to using the water park which is an indoor caribbean park with a theming on par with Typhoon Lagoon. and yet many people in the UK have been brainwashed that they have to go to Florida for a quality experience. Well sadly it is not true.
Originally Posted By KatieKate123 That's the point. I win when I go to Disney World, because I have a blast with my two children. I wouldn't go if I didn't like it. No one forces you all to pay for the park to go to something that is falling apart. As you all sound why do you even go back? If it's so awful and everything has fallen apart why spend your money there? Maybe I do have rose colored glasses, and you know what thats fine for me because I wouldn't want any other glasses. I like being happy, and being in the moment. When I started this thread, I was over emotional only because I was having a emotional week, I am not ususally like that, but I do sometimes have bad weeks. I am not a negative person though, and I am not going to let you'll negativity bring me down.
Originally Posted By bobbelee9 Katie, I'm married to Mr Negativity. I guess I try to be Cinderella Sunshine to offset him. It ain't easy. Before I go to work, I listen to the news while I read the paper. He sits here ripping everyone on the tv from the reporters to the people being reported about to the commercials. Day after day, it gets to me. No wonder I get to work so early. Any way, even though some posters here are the same as he is, at least I don't have to live with them. So Katie keep being happy, listen to some of what they say but don't give them the ability to ruin your life.
Originally Posted By Mr X ***I wouldn't go if I didn't like it*** I think that's pretty much true for everyone. ***No one forces you all to pay for the park to go to something that is falling apart. As you all sound why do you even go back? If it's so awful and everything has fallen apart why spend your money there?*** The point is though, people come to a DISCUSSION board to discuss things. Some people care about details, and negative stuff that used to be positive, and all the rest. Why does THEIR opinion upset YOU so much? If you don't want to participate in the discussions, DON'T...just like you suggest that if they don't like it, don't go to DisneyWorld, Right? ***Maybe I do have rose colored glasses, and you know what thats fine for me because I wouldn't want any other glasses*** Maybe just don't wear ANY glasses (except vision correcting ones, of course!), and see what you see the next time around. ***I like being happy, and being in the moment*** Me too. Totally! But that doesn't mean if I see low quality or disappointing stuff I don't notice it! Do you really just put blinders on and IGNORE any bad stuff you might see? Or pretend it doesn't exist at all? That seems like a pretty myopic way of seeing the world, if you ask me (but if it makes you happy, more power to ya!). ***When I started this thread, I was over emotional only because I was having a emotional week, I am not ususally like that, but I do sometimes have bad weeks. I am not a negative person though, and I am not going to let you'll negativity bring me down*** Is it really the negativity that is bringing you down, or the realistic outlooks? I mean, if it was really just a bunch of mean people saying bad stuff about Disney that you didn't believe anyway, the obvious solution would be not to talk to those people. Right? I'm not suggesting that you should go away, but there are PLENTY of happy, peppy, magical Disney sites all over the internets where you can go and find candy canes and hidden mickey hints and all the pixie dust you can swallow...which is GREAT, but then there are a few message boards around where people actually discuss the parks and Disney stuff, offering pros and cons, and yes sometimes there are negative conversations, but what I wonder is why you would come to such a place and get angry about it and try to shut down the conversation? Long story short, why would you visit a conversation place in order to demand the conversation stop? OR, conform to YOUR particular opinion on the topic or else.
Originally Posted By Goofyernmost No. That's rewriting history. >>>She started a thread basically bashing people for being negative about WDW and TWDC and wondered why they would post those type thoughts/opinions/experiences.<<< The thread I was referring to was not this thread. This thread was prompted by the previous thread where she expressed how good it was only to be told that she was apparently living in a vacuum. This thread was different. You apparently didn't realize this therefore your answers and inability to make sense of it. Oh, well...I guess we are all fallible. I wasn't rewriting history I was recalling part of it that you missed, apparently. And yes I meant to type angst...thanks so much for pointing out yet another error of my ways.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>No one forces you all to pay for the park to go to something that is falling apart. As you all sound why do you even go back?<<< ...And have any of them talked about heading back? I know that Dave hasn't. Why do we have to say the same things over and over in this thread..? Let it die. There's no discussion in here, it's just the same two parties berating each other.
Originally Posted By danyoung If you don't like the thread, don't participate. I really HATE it when someone tries to shut down a thread because they've become tired of it. As long as people have strong opinions, let them discuss.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>No. That's rewriting history.<<< Rewriting history is saying that EPCOT opened in 1983 and it opened as a direct translation of Walt's ideas. Basically bending the facts. Opinion has nothing to do with that, and everything with this thread... I don't follow...
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>If you don't like the thread, don't participate. I really HATE it when someone tries to shut down a thread because they've become tired of it. As long as people have strong opinions, let them discuss.<<< Well, I'm not shutting it down by any means, but I don't understand how or why anyone is getting anything out of it when there isn't any progress or headway. Everyone is talking in circles... If anything, shut that down. We've all said the same things for the past 300 posts.
Originally Posted By Mickeymouseclub For some reason this is more interesting. Whenever I have a break I like to check this particular topic. Perhaps I feel relief that we have someplace to throw a tantrum and get some type of response. I have a daily negative interaction with some particular purchase or utility or business. Not going to get any satisfaction and nobody to listen but LP satisfies that need...Even opening a letter from AT&T thanking me and inviting me into any store to discuss any "issue". Why would that be so insulting to my intelligence ? Because it reeks of the phony excellent customer service every Corporation believes it excels in. After reading about the Technological advances Disney is using to track customer service I almost felt the urge to open the window and scream! So that techno-manager is staring at a screen to smell the stinky bathrooms I suppose. I feel the techno-magic already. I will try to enjoy all my techno memories this year. I also think this topic will continue to be active as it brings responses from posters that have been to busy during the holidays. It is a lot to catch up with but it reads like a good book almost!
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo add to that how it is a microcosm of the real world. My real issue is that in the real world, Disney's competition is upping their game. Reading about the transport nightmares the other night at the MK left me shaking my head when I think about a similarly busy time at a British park earlier this year (Halloween special event) and they put on all the monorails to the parking lot, but laid on buses (which they only use in emergencies) to cope with the extra numbers. My wife without prompting turned to me and say, they do it the way Disney USED to. That is a sad indicment.
Originally Posted By KatieKate123 Ok to Mr.X I am not sure what you are talking about b/c particulary I said why do people have to post only negative things, can't they post positive things also? So I wasn't even trying to get negativity to end I know that will never happen. I was hoping that people would realize how negative they have been. Second off I wouldn't leave this site even if you did ask me 2, b/c I enjoy coming on it most of the time. I have every right to speak my mind also even if I am wearing rose colored glasses. And third off, I am not being brought down by the negativity people, but what was going on in my life.
