Originally Posted By DVC_dad ^^^--- the short version: You cannot possibly have a pure opinion until it's you who is directly effected.
Originally Posted By barboy "your mother or sister or wife or daughter in the worst way." I can only assume that you place a higher value on female victims than male by the way you loaded up your question. To me young/old, tall/short, Chinese/Mexican, educated/uneducated---everyone is equal. I would be just as devestated if my father were shot down istead of Mom.
Originally Posted By berol I'd still be against it cuz I wouldn't want innocent people to be killed via the death penalty so my daughter's murderer could be offed as much as I might want the guy dead. I also think being affected by a murder would cloud my ability to make proper judgments. (Maybe it'd sharpen it, but I imagine I'd be too emotional to reason like a champ.) The abortion argument doesn't work perfectly cuz of ideas like, "no brain waves, not a person."
Originally Posted By Eric Paddon If there is a justification for executing Nazi war criminals, then there is a justification for executing mass murdering butcherers on an individual basis in this country. The fact that Charles Manson has been getting free room and board at the taxpayers expense thanks to a piece of judicial activism that improperly tossed out the death penalty across the board is for me the ultimate comment of how the blanket anti-death penalty perspective has little validity for me.
Originally Posted By berol "I can only assume that you place a higher value on female victims than male by the way you loaded up your question." It's too much of a leap for me to make that assumption. By that logic, one could also assume that he values them more than grandmas, aunts and nieces.
Originally Posted By Eric Paddon Abortion stops a beating heart of the innocent. The Death penalty merely renders justice unto the guilty. We have far less right to play God on the matter of who gets to live and die when they are in the womb, then if a lawful society has properly judged someone to accept the consequences for their heinous actions. And if anyone allows for just one execution at Nuremberg, then they also by default allow for the presence of the death penalty in *any* appropriate circumstance.
Originally Posted By barboy "If there is a justification for executing Nazi war criminals, then there is a justification for executing mass murdering butcherers on an individual basis in this country." AGREED!! That is why I said "99%" of US executions are immoral.
Originally Posted By berol It's not really blanket anti-death penalty. The anti-death crowd would shrink a lot if laws guaranteed no oopsie executions. I don't know if my opinion would change or not.
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder I'm against the death penalty and I'm for a woman's right to choose.
Originally Posted By barboy "if laws guaranteed no oopsie executions." This is straight-up impossible even if the laws were changed dramatically.
Originally Posted By berol yeah, in the first version of the post, i had 'just about impossible.' If it were changed from 'reasonable doubt' to 'beyond all doubt', like Jack Ruby who did it on live tv, that's about as close to it as you could get.
Originally Posted By Eric Paddon So I take it Passholder, that Charles Manson is more worthy of being alive then an unborn child tossed into the garbage because some wealthy woman decided that it didn't deserve to live because it was the wrong sex?
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder Not falling for your crap analogies Eric. After 48 years of living, I'm quite comfortable with my positions.
Originally Posted By barboy Impossible to prevent "oopsies" because of: honest mistakes prosecutorial misconduct inadequate defense police/investigative misconduct deals between the state and codefendants lying witnesses
Originally Posted By ecdc Hey Eric, I'm not an ADMIN or anything but how's about toning down the rhetoric a notch? You're making this personal and it doesn't need to be.
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder No, Eric's just dispensing some honest truths on us peons. At least that's what he keeps telling himself.
Originally Posted By berol I think certainty is possible, but it would happen so rarely that you might as well just lock 'em up. I had to scramble just to come up with Jack Ruby.
Originally Posted By berol yeesh, personal in both directions. I think I'll tap my ruby slippers together and flee.
