Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan >>Um...not in the same polling place. Granted, they don't get the sharpest knives in the drawer to work polling places (which I think is a mistake), but I don't think you could pull something like that off.<< I am a master of disguise. But even if I could only get away with it once, that means there's a huge problem with the system. Why no ID checks?
Originally Posted By cmpaley A hand stamp like at Disneyland would work best, I think. Just have a blacklight lamp as part of the acoutrement and that cool ink they use and you can see who voted and who didn't.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan That'd be okay, but I'm not sure voters would appreciate having the word DOPEY or GOOFY stamped on their hand, though. (Of course, DOPEY and GOOFY are often on the ballots, so that would be campaigning in a polling place.)
Originally Posted By cmpaley LOL! Actually, part of the reason that ID isn't required is that an argument CAN BE MADE (I'm not saying that I agree with it) that it affects poor and minorities disproportionately and amounts to a poll tax.
Originally Posted By TomSawyer We could just have the state issue free ID cards instead of charging for them.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan it affects poor and minorities disproportionately and amounts to a poll tax.<< Hmmmm. I dunno. But okay, then hand stamp/finger dyeing would work at keeping folks voting only once.
Originally Posted By jnemo They checked ID for the person in front of us but not use. I had our sample ballots in my hand and of course with the blind guy they let us go, I guess.
Originally Posted By DlandDug >>And now we know how Bush got into office. Twice.<< Actually, I assumed this was how Gore and Kerry carried California...
Originally Posted By DlandDug On topic: No, I did not have to show any ID. I did have to help the sweet Viet Namese poll worker find my name, and sign next to it. I also wear my "I voted" sticker all day, then press it in a book with all my other "I voted" stickers dating back to 1975.
Originally Posted By Inspector 57 Ann Arbor, Michigan: Before we get to the doddering election workers, we have to fill out a little form on which we print our names and complete addresses, and we sign. We hand this form to them. They check that our name is registered to our address. There is no comparison signature on file and no request for ID. I'm certain I could vote more than once a day if I wanted to.
Originally Posted By DlandDug I know I could, too-- but I will certainly not explain how it would be done.
Originally Posted By StillThePassHolder "Before we get to the doddering election workers" Nothing from noting here, but I'd like to say something abou this. I don't know about other states, but here in California there is no regular position called "election worker" or some similar thing. They are volunteers, mostly older people who take great pride in doing a civic duty. Where I work, in this massive county, we put out a request among county workers to volunteer to work a pollling place on election day. They would get paid for their time. A wide cross section of people came forth. The day before the election, another notice went out that said sorry, but we were mistaken, you're not getting paid. You'll have to take personal time, vacation time, etc. A wide cross section of people changed their minds and did not work the poliing places. All that being said, I'm rather grateful for the older people who volunteer their time, enabling me to vote on election day.
Originally Posted By Darkbeer <a href="http://www.ac4vr.com/" target="_blank">http://www.ac4vr.com/</a> >>The American Center for Voting Rights Legislative Fund (ACVR Legislative Fund) congratulates the bipartisan Carter-Baker Commission on Federal Election Reform for its important report released this week recommending critical reforms to combat vote fraud and restore confidence in the American election system. ACVR Legislative Fund is particularly gratified that the Carter-Baker Commission recommended that voters provide photo ID before casting a ballot – a key reform identified by our comprehensive national report on vote fraud released in August, “Vote Fraud, Intimidation & Suppression In The 2004 Presidential Election.†Voter ID laws that provide government-issued photo IDs free of charge and accessibly to all are a key safeguard against vote fraud and will go a long way in restoring Americans’ confidence that lawful voters decide the outcome of our elections. The bipartisan Carter-Baker Commission’s endorsement of voter ID further refutes the bogus claim that such laws discriminate against minority voters. Former President Jimmy Carter called the Commission’s voter ID proposal “a move forward in getting more people to vote,†saying such a law would “not restrict people from voting†and be “nondiscriminatory.†As Carter stated about the Commission’s voter ID recommendation: “[W]e’ve put in some very careful constraints to prevent abuse. For instance, these photo I.D. cards will be free. Second, there will be a wide distribution of them. The states will be required to go around the state to issue these photo I.D. cards to as many people as possible, which will be a good system just for recruiting new voters. This will be very important. And so, this will be, I think, a move forward in getting more people to vote. It would not restrict people from voting. It will be uniformly applied throughout the country. And it will be nondiscriminatory.†(Former President Jimmy Carter, Press Briefing, 9/19/05) << Amazing, in Mexico, they have lots of these safeguards already (mainly due to things the U.N. strongly recommends for a fair election). To vote in Mexico, first you must go to the Register of Voters office in your town (multiple locations in large towns), and bring proof of identity, proof of citizenship and proof of current residence. They gather the info, take your photo and fingerprint, and then start the process. After a few days, in which the system verifies the info, and makes sure you are not registered elsewhere, you return to pick up your Voter ID card, which has all your basic info, plus a photo and a fingerprint (I think it is your right thumb). Then, you MUST go to the polls to vote, no absentee ballots. They start the day with clear plastic ballot boxes, which are placed in plain site, and shown empty. Folks show up at the polling place (and they MUST go to the correct polling place), and then a worker matches the info on the Voter ID card (lose your card, no voting allowed) to the computerized printout, if it is not on the printout, no ballot. If all is in order, you vote in private, then walk to the ballot box, where you place your ballot in the box, then your hand is marked with special ink to prevent folks from voting again. Go to the link, and read the full report, a lot of stuff in it sounds like just good old common sense.
Originally Posted By Darkbeer The current system also needs to be fixed, I have shown a few problems in this thread... <a href="http://mb.laughingplace.com/default.asp?WCI=MsgBoard&WCE=T-68492-P-1&Refresh=1110110930&c=1" target="_blank">http://mb.laughingplace.com/de fault.asp?WCI=MsgBoard&WCE=T-68492-P-1&Refresh=1110110930&c=1</a> A big one is cleaning up the Voter Rolls... Heck, it was one of the many problems in Detroit, and a major problem in New Jersey, where they haven't removed folks who passed on since 1985. Having "excess" names on the list just leaves the door open to abuse. The rolls need to be cleaned out a few times a year, to remove those who moved or passed on. Hopefully the NAVA requirement of state wide rolls will help eliminate a lot of the duplicate, or improper names, including felons and others who cannot vote. The REAL ID act should also help, as you will need to prove citizenship to get the ID. Heck, one of my favorite ways they have been finding non-citizens who have voted is by using the Jury Duty letters. Folks claim they are not citizens to avoid Jury Duty, and then vote. They have found many non-citizens that way, plus they also find citizens who are trying to avoid Jury Duty lying on the letter. A win-win situation. They need to do this state wide, and in all 50 states.
Originally Posted By Darkbeer By the way, I am not against Absentee Ballots, but I think that more inspection and investigation should be done. Start with requiring anyone who wants to become a Permanent Absentee actually go to the Register of Voters office (and they should have weekend and evening hours on selected days, such as one weekend a month, and one night a week). Folks would have to fill out a form, and get there picture taken. And have an expiration date, say 10 years. Make home visits for those who are home-bound. After every election, verify 1% of the actual ballots casted. Require folks to show up for a quick interview at the Register of Voters to prove their Identity and the fact they actually did vote in the election. Should take more than a couple of minutes. For those who fail to show up, go physically to the address on file, and verify the person actually lives there, etc... By letting folks know you are actively investigating and prosecuting those who commit voter fraud should cut down those who are currently abusing the system.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan >>Heck, it was one of the many problems in Detroit, and a major problem in New Jersey, where they haven't removed folks who passed on since 1985. Having "excess" names on the list just leaves the door open to abuse.<< My wife's grandfather volunteered at a polling place for many years. It drove him crazy seeing names on the list for years of people who had long since moved away. Not sure if this is still the problem that it used to be, but it was pretty bad at that time.
Originally Posted By Darkbeer ^ But in this day and age, it should be a lot easier to track these things. Heck, now the Postal Service has a nationwide address change system, where all the major mailers get notified of address changes. The Register of Voters should become part of this system, in where a Change of Address form is summitted to the USPS, the Regiuster of Voters sends out a notice to the both addresses. One has no name on it, but the old address. It states something liek, we have been notified that a change of address has been filed with this address, if you just moved in, make sure and register if you are eligible, and if you haven't moved, contact the Register of Voters to clarify the matter. The second notice is sent to the new address, and the person who is registered. State they will be removed from the list of eligible voters, unless they can prove there was a mistake. Also, send a form so they can register at the new address. Using things like death certificates, and changes in property tax rolls (someoen selling a home) to keep the list up to date, and make sure folks are not claiming empty lots or other type of faux addresses (such as a business address instead of a residence). Also, address changes for folks who file income taxes, for example, making sure folks who claim they are not a California Resident when filing taxes (using the non-resident rules) are not also on the voter rolls. Marketing firms do these things all the time, the government should be doing the same.
