Originally Posted By DlandDug >>and Mummy just opened last year,you mean to tell me that its not a draw anymore only after 1 year?<< Frankly, it wasn't that much of a draw after the initial advertising campaign ended. It drove attendance in 2004, but didn't do a thing for the bottom line in 2005. >>Also, attendance at the Universal parks was down for 2005, but their two parks in Florida, as I keep pointing out, continue to meet, or as seems to be the case this year, match (In the case of IOA) the attendance of DCA. So does this mean DCA is failing?<< Yes.
Originally Posted By Dlmusic Well, considering IOA is not making money right now, and DCA was supposed to be bringing in 7 million visitors a year I would say that 5.8 is still not really good enough. I think it's good the park is experiencing an increase, but it did get the lowest of all the Disney parks so I think it's got a way to go.
Originally Posted By tangaroa What happened to the 6 million everyone was saying DCA was *SURE* to get after TOT opened? The fact that DL's attendance is at near record levels, and DCA is still completely unable to break the 6 million mark speaks volumes. DCA as a park is not improving itself. The additions they've made since park opening have done nothing really except counter the declines expected over time. As the rides that DCA opened with become stale and less interesting, they replace those with new attractions - but the effect on attendance is about the same. Five years in, Disneyland's attendance increased some 500%. You just don't see that growth with DCA.
Originally Posted By disneywatcher >>>>> ORLANDO, Fla. -- Here is a list of the top 25 best-attended North American amusement parks in 2005, their attendance and the percentage change from last year. 1. Magic Kingdom at Walt Disney World in Orlando, 16.1 million, +6.5 percent 2. Disneyland in Anaheim, Calif. 14.5 million, +8.5 percent 3. Epcot at Walt Disney World in Orlando, 9.9 million, +5.5 percent 4. Disney-MGM Studios at Walt Disney World in Orlando, 8.6 million, +5 percent 5. Disney's Animal Kingdom at Walt Disney World in Orlando, 8.2 million, +5 percent 6. Universal Studios in Orlando, 6.1 million, -8.5 percent 7. Disney's California Adventure in Anaheim, Calif., 5.8 million, +3.6 percent 8. Islands of Adventure at Universal Orlando, 5.76 million, -8.5 percent 9. SeaWorld Orlando, 5.6 million, +0.2 percent 10. Universal Studios Hollywood, 4.7 million, -6 percent 11. Adventuredome at Circus Circus in Las Vegas, 4.5 million, +2.3 percent 12. Busch Gardens Tampa Bay, 4.3 million, +5.1 percent 13. SeaWorld San Diego, 4.1 million, +2.5 percent 14. Paramount Canada's Wonderland in Maple, Ontario, 3.6 million, +7 percent 15. Knott's Berry Farm in Buena Park, Calif., 3.47 million, -3 percent 16. Paramount's Kings Island in Kings Island, Ohio, 3.3 million, -5.1 percent 17. Morey's Piers in Wildwood, N.J., 3.1 million, +1 percent 18. Cedar Point in Sandusky, Ohio, 3.1 million, -2 percent 19. Santa Cruz Beach Boardwalk in Santa Cruz, Calif., 3 million, flat 20. Six Flags Great Adventure in Jackson, N.J., 2.9 million, +6 percent 21. Six Flags Great America in Gurnee, Ill., 2.8 million, +24 percent 22. Six Flags Magic Mountain in Valencia, Calif., 2.8 million, +5 percent 23. Hersheypark in Hershey, Pa., 2.7 million, flat 24. Busch Gardens, Williamsburg, Va., 2.6 million, +8.3 percent 25. Dollywood in Pigeon Forge, Tenn., 2.3 million, +7.3 percent
Originally Posted By disneywatcher Two things that stand out in the list above: that it seems all 4 Disney theme parks in Orlando consistently attract large crowds year after year. I think the DisCo could open a park themed to watching paint dry and it would draw at least 7 million people per year. Another thing is that even though the parks owned by Six Flags and Cedar Fair in southern California are open more days of the year than their sister parks in less temperate climates, they nonetheless barely attract as many visitors, or even fewer visitors, than the others do.
Originally Posted By Darkbeer First off, the first thing that surprised me was who well Six Flags did this year, guess the Mr. Six advertising paid off.... (and it was a lot less than what Disney spent on Advertising) <a href="http://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/custom/tourism/orl-bk-themepark122505" target="_blank">http://www.orlandosentinel.com /business/custom/tourism/orl-bk-themepark122505</a>,0,7872650.story?coll=orl-home-headlines >>Six Flags Inc., which invested $135 million in new rides around the nation for the 2005 season, was rewarded with a 5.7 percent increase across the chain, according to Amusement Business. The opening of a water park at its Six Flags Great America park in Gurnee, Ill. helped boost attendance by 24 percent. "They did very well in their most populace markets," Zoltak said.<< So seeing Magic Mountain above the Industry average caught my eye, especially since USH and Knott's (along with the rest of the Universal and Cedar Fair) didn't have a good year. Some of it was expected, with all the money Disney was spending on Disneyland's 50th Anniversary, you figured that the nearby parks would take a hit. But SFMM's new addition this year was just a new story line for the Batman Stunt Show. Also, it looked like Disney's plan to make the celebration a worldwide celebration worked, as Florida got a nice hike. (Hopefully the worldwide numbers will be released tomorrow.) The one North American park under the Industry Average, DCA.... Amazing, even with all the pushing of discounted Multi-Day ParkHoppers to tourest, and local promotions (The "Pay for Disneyland, get DCA for FREE!" ticket was offered January thru April 2005), DCA could only get an additional 170,000 folks in 2005, even though Disneyland got an extra 1,140,000 additional guests. So almost a million "new" guests were right next door to the DLR, but decided to skip DCA...... I should also congratulate the Busch/SeaWorld parks for a good year. Hopefully I will be able to have a full list of Disney Parks attendance tommorrow afternoon, as soon as Amusement Business releases the world wide numbers.
Originally Posted By Dabob2 DCA did quite well, I think, considering that a). most locals who do day trips are obviously going to go to DL to check out all the 50th stuff, and b). DCA had no major additions in 2005. All the other parks with no new additions did poorly, no? But DCA's still up. What all this really shows, of course, is that one can spin statistics pretty much any way one likes.
Originally Posted By Darkbeer Let's see, SFMM got a new version of their Batman Stunt Show, same amphitheater, minor retheming to the set, and a new script. DCA got a Brand New parade, Block Party Bash and Turtle Talk with Crush in the summer, a brand new replacement show. Also, they got Animation Academy in the early fall, another new show (though a replacement for a previous version). DCA also got a boost by holding a special event, Mickey's Halloween Treat, which added about 30,000 of the additional attendance (about 18% of the total increase).
Originally Posted By Dabob2 I wouldn't call Turtle Talk a major addition (though by all accounts it's fun if you get a good "Crush"). And I'm not a parade guy, so I guess I didn't put a lot of weight behind that. But certainly, DCA didn't have what I'd call a major (i.e. permanent brick and mortar attraction) in 2005. Neither did SFMM, but I'm actually shocked that their attendance is as low as that. Less than half DCA? Man. Which would mean in raw numbers it increased less than DCA. I'd really like to try X, but the last time we went to SFMM the atmosphere was so bad, I'm sure we'll skip it when we come this March.
Originally Posted By Darkbeer FYI, SFMM is only open about 250 days a year, since they do close Monday thru Thursdays for about half the year. SFMM had an average daily attendance of about 11,200. DCA had an average daily attendance of about 15,890. Also, many of the other park on the list get a much higher daily attendance than DCA, Cedar Point daily attendance is about 30,000 a day.
Originally Posted By Hans Reinhardt "I sure hope Disney executives pay attention to the fact that new RIDES bring in more people, not shops and new shows." The question, of course, is do the increases offset the cost of designing, building and the expense of promoting the new attractions. Over the years it's pretty much been proven through these discussions that attendance is only one measure of a park's success. Six Flags had increases this year, yet the company is failing financially.
Originally Posted By trekkeruss <<Five years in, Disneyland's attendance increased some 500%. You just don't see that growth with DCA.>> I am sure you don't mean 500%.
Originally Posted By Hans Reinhardt "..but it did get the lowest of all the Disney parks so I think it's got a way to go." But it was always planned to be the lowest, so the fact that it is is nothing to be surprised about. I'd also guess that after 5 years of operations that old 7 million original estimate was tossed out long ago.
Originally Posted By Hans Reinhardt <Knott's Berry Farm in Buena Park, Calif., 3.47 million, -3 percent> Woah! Considering that theme park are business is on an upswing worldwide it's interesting that Knott's had a decrease. Its poor performance pushed it right out of the top ten! It even got beat by Sea World. I'm also thoroughly amused by the DCA critics and how they are spinning the numbers. Kudos.
Originally Posted By Hans Reinhardt "First off, the first thing that surprised me was who well Six Flags did this year, guess the Mr. Six advertising paid off.... (and it was a lot less than what Disney spent on Advertising)" LOL! Darkbeer, have you forgotten that Six Flags is losing money and is drowning in debt?
Originally Posted By Darkbeer Someone thinks Six Flags is worth it, with the new CEO, and Mark Shapiro (ex-Disney) is taking over control..... Six Flags stock has gone up quite a bit this year (over 50%), while Disney's stock has taken a nose dive in 2005 (over 10%)... <a href="http://www.advfn.com/quote_Six-Flags_NYSE_PKS.html" target="_blank">http://www.advfn.com/quote_Six -Flags_NYSE_PKS.html</a> <a href="http://www.advfn.com/quote_Walt-Disney-Dis_NYSE_DIS.html" target="_blank">http://www.advfn.com/quote_Wal t-Disney-Dis_NYSE_DIS.html</a>
Originally Posted By Hans Reinhardt Darkbeer, are you kidding? Have you been following the Six Flags drama this year? Shapiro basically took over the company following a shareholder vote after the board desperately tried to auction off the company this past summer and fall. Not surprisingly, there were no formal offers to buy beleagured company. According to Bloomberg, Six Flags had $2.4 billion of debt at the end of 2004, about eight times its $301 million in earnings before interest, taxes, depreciation and amortization. It really can't get any worse than that. Sorry, Darkbeer, but all the spinning in the world can't change the fact that Six Flags is doing extremely poorly right now.
Originally Posted By Darkbeer Shapiro did NOT take over the company, he was hired by Dan Snyder, the owner of the Washington Redskins, along with two other major partners, who think Six Flags is worth investing in, and think they can make a lot of money off it. It was Dan Snyder who forced the board vote. The previous CEO but the company up for sale in response to Mr. Snyder's actions, as one of his requirements was to force the CEO and other members of the board to resign. <a href="http://www.dfw.com/mld/dfw/business/13485500.htm" target="_blank">http://www.dfw.com/mld/dfw/bus iness/13485500.htm</a> >>It was the original source of Arlington's entertainment district, bringing millions of people to the city and spawning a booming tourism trade. Six Flags Over Texas is still an important player, but its heyday was decades ago. More recently, the park has suffered from falling attendance, limited investment and a lack of creative vision. Now there's hope of reclaiming some past glory. The new leadership group seems to get it: The Arlington park can be much more than a collection of thrill rides. "This thing is already a big winner for us," Chief Executive Mark Shapiro said about Arlington. "Now it can jump tenfold [as a tourist attraction] -- if we can get our arms around it, and if we plan in advance. "And I promise you that we will," he said in a phone interview Tuesday. Shapiro is just beginning his job. The former ESPN wunderkind was installed as CEO on Dec. 14, after investor Dan Snyder won a proxy fight to gain control of the theme park's parent company, Six Flags Inc., based in Oklahoma City. Snyder and Shapiro have repeatedly said that Six Flags needs to rebuild its brand, adding new attractions to pull in families and creating partnerships with consumer companies. Shapiro has also told reporters that the parks should establish strong ties with entertainment icons, from the iPod to Shrek to haunted houses designed by film director Wes Craven. Rebranding is an imperative across the Six Flags chain. But Shapiro realizes that Arlington is especially well-suited to an extreme makeover, and he plans to visit the park Monday. Six Flags sits in a unique spot. It's next to Ameriquest Field in Arlington, adjacent to the mixed-use development planned by Texas Rangers owner Tom Hicks. And it's near the grounds where Jerry Jones will build a $650 million stadium for the Dallas Cowboys. Those two big-league draws will bring millions of prospective customers to Six Flags' door. Shapiro will have to figure out how to remake the venue to make the most of its upscale neighborhood. "This is going to be a huge benefit to the park, and that's why our repositioning of the brand is paramount," Shapiro said. "We'd be fools to pass up a huge growth opportunity like this." Six Flags has 30 parks nationwide, so Arlington isn't its only focus. The more pressing issue is a huge debt load of more than $2 billion, roughly four times Six Flags' stock market value. Cutting that debt is a priority, and the company is likely to sell land and perhaps even parks to lower interest payments. That would free up money for key investments like an Arlington renovation. Shapiro is confident that the money will be there: "This is a priority for the company, and we'll make the investments that are needed," he said. That kind of talk must encourage leaders in Arlington, because they've bet the future on the Cowboys and the emerging entertainment district. It's looking like a great bet now, with Arlington positioned to become one of the premier tourist destinations in the Metroplex, even the state. Jones will start construction on the stadium next year, and Hicks' project is expected to be unveiled in the next several months. A prototype from Hicks' developer has been shared with local leaders but not with the public. Representatives from the Jones and Hicks camps have been meeting regularly, urged on by city officials who want the developments to complement each other. Six Flags, offered a seat at the table, has missed most of the meetings, which tells you all you need to know about its commitment to Arlington's revival. But that was the old regime, which had to be distracted by Snyder's proxy fight and discouraged by the corporation's constant losses. Shapiro said it was too early to say how involved Six Flags would become in the master planning that's under way, but he doesn't intend to be a no-show. "We'll be on it," Shapiro said. For city officials, the job is to keep the three big players working together, thinking about the big picture. The city wants to create a seamless district that links the attractions in a pedestrian-friendly way. In the past, Six Flags talked about creating a new entrance that would be a short walk from the ballpark and would encourage tourists to move between the venues. Six Flags owns enough land to expand in that direction; it just needs money to invest and great entertainment ideas to pull in casual fans who happen to be in the area. Shapiro has been studying the capital investments planned for next year and says he's already making changes. The company won't use the old-school tack of goosing attendance by simply adding another thrill ride. "We'll continue to make investments in '06, but the concentration will be on family rides, because that's where this company is headed," Shapiro said. "The teen-age demo is our most loyal fan base, and we intend to keep that. "But this company needs to stretch itself and become a destination for moms, dads and families," he said.<<
Originally Posted By Darkbeer <a href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/12/14/AR2005121402367.html" target="_blank">http://www.washingtonpost.com/ wp-dyn/content/article/2005/12/14/AR2005121402367.html</a> >>Mark Shapiro has been chief executive of Six Flags for a little over 24 hours, and already the ideas are flying. He's talking about collaborating with Microsoft on creating an Xbox "village." Maybe he'll ask "Nightmare on Elm Street" creator Wes Craven to design a haunted house for the chain's 29 theme parks. Only a day earlier, Hollywood mogul Harvey Weinstein -- along with former vice presidential candidate Jack Kemp and big-time media consultant Michael Kassan -- joined the Six Flags board.... Harvey Weinstein and his brother Bob recently launched their own movie studio, the Weinstein Co., after breaking away from Walt Disney Co. last year. Kassan, who described himself as "a big fan of Dan Snyder and an old friend," is a veteran media buyer and has previously bought advertising for Walt Disney Co. and for Six Flags. Kemp now heads his own consulting firm in Washington and sits on several corporate boards. The new board members bring relevant experience and, just as importantly, fat Rolodexes, which provided some inspiration for Shapiro. Craven, for example, directed all three "Scream" films, which were produced by Dimension Films, the offshoot of Bob and Harvey Weinstein's Miramax production company. The Xbox is made by Microsoft, whose chairman, Bill Gates, is a major investor in Six Flags. The Weinstein brothers, in particular, may restore a much-needed connection for Six Flags, which was once owned by Warner Bros. Ties to a major Hollywood movie studio would provide more opportunities for themed rides, which several industry experts said is critical for success. "If Harvey Weinstein is going to be producing a family film, we will be knocking on the door to get Six Flags represented," Shapiro said.<<
Originally Posted By 9oldmen >>Woah! Considering that theme park are business is on an upswing worldwide it's interesting that Knott's had a decrease. Its poor performance pushed it right out of the top ten! << When was Knott's IN the top ten? It wasn't for 2004 or 2003.
