Originally Posted By DVC_dad I wouldn't call it a feud, I would more or less call it just clearing the air. Honestly, there are a few things here that really needed to be said. And earlier is better than later. But anyway, I'd like to speak to the topic at hand. Having changed FAR more diapers than MOST dad's I know, and perhaps even more than a lot of mom's on this board, I am going to go out on a limb and say that I honestly do think that there is no way that diaper HAD to have been changed on POTC and everyone else who disagrees with this is just plain wrong. Take it personal or not, I'm right. ;P
Originally Posted By vbdad55 <Anyway, I wish to stop this foolishness and move on< done, I waited 3 months to have my say that I never had the chance to last time...it is now over as far as I am concerned. now returning all the unfortunate posters to their regularly scheduled thread. <<From the description, the poster seems not to have seen poop or private parts, or to have smelled anything. So, no harm, no foul.<< although others have alluded to why this was an issue, I have to admit this descriptive paragraph made me smile...
Originally Posted By bobbelee9 Now that we've gotten this out of our systems, I'd like to wish everyone who celebrates Easter, a very happy and safe Easter. For those who don't celebrate it, I wish you a very happy and safe day. I just got the best Easter news, my son is back on US soil and will be home in the morning.
Originally Posted By crazyformickey For the past 2 weeks I saw how much people are pigs. People at counter service leaving all their garbage on the tables, just throwing trash where ever they feel like and at the worse was at the end of the night the amount to strollers and wheel chairs that were left around the park most of the time loaded with trash. My 10 year old DS was mad and cleaned out a few strollers and brought them up to the front of the park. My DD and I helped inspired by him. You have to walk pass the front anyway. What's so hard?? It seems to get worse and worse every year. I heard a mom mad because her son climbed up on a tray cart which tipped over and hurt him. I couldn't believe she was mad at Disney, she should be mad at her self for not watching her kid. Hearing someone changing a diaper isn't a surprise.
Originally Posted By NikkiLOVESMickey <<I just got the best Easter news, my son is back on US soil and will be home in the morning.>> That is wonderful news, bobbelee! Congratulations and best wishes! That is one of the best Easter presents I can think of!
Originally Posted By TALL Disney Guy markedward, don't you start me in on a feud now. ;-) I understand what you're saying, and I fully admit teens and adults can be some of the most obnoxious, annoying, awful guests. But since this thread was focusing on primarily infants/kids, that's why I mentioned them. And for the record, I've had no previous problem with vbdad, DVC_dad feels like a relative, and I *heart* Goofyernmost. (((Easter hugs all around)))
Originally Posted By Goofyernmost On topic again...I did remember an incident that happened on my last trip. I am one of possibly six people that like "Sounds Dangerous" so I go just about every trip. The last time a family with a small child went into the show. The CM sensing that there could be a problem, repeated over and over that most of the show is in complete darkness so if anyone felt that this might be a problem it might be advisable to take their leave. No one moved, the show started and the second the theater went dark, the child in question started to scream. I don't mean just a minor little whine, but glass shattering screams. The CM went to them with a flashlight and offered to help them exit but the thoughtful parents decided that they needed to teach their offspring to not be afraid of the dark. They stayed throughout the entire show and, this isn't conjecture, it ruined it for everyone. The whole purpose of this story is to point out that it is not the children that are the problem, it is the parents. Unconcerned, self involved and burdened with the parenting skills of Joan Crawford they made all of us diminish our experience because WDW is for kids. WDW is for kids that are controllable and parents who know how to be parents and responsible to the public. To avoid any future wanderings into the dark side, I will add...JMHO!
Originally Posted By vbdad55 <WDW is for kids that are controllable and parents who know how to be parents and responsible to the public.< for the record this is exactly what I have been saying - (I just don't think age is the over riding factor -- IMHO ) - I had almost the exact same experience in Philharmgic last trip -- and I blame the parents, not the child. The child was about 6 -7 years old and afraid of the dark - as best as I could gather from his screamings at his parents who kept shouting at him not to be a baby..... for the entire show and unfortunately they were the row in front of me and only abut 6 -7 people over. I was going to say something to them, but unfortunately they were still dragging their child out of the show by one arm as he flailed on the ground - still screaming....
Originally Posted By sherrytodd Well, we started taking our DS to WDW and DL when he turned 1 1/2 and have gone pretty much every year since. He has always been an early morning person so we would always hit the parks when they would open and were always out of the parks when he was little by 1pm at the latest to avoid the afternoon dragging around the tired screaming child. We'd spend a pleasant afternoon and evening at the hotel by the pool or at Grandmas house. We pretty much avoided most of the theater attractions till he was older because he wouldn't sit through them, particularly Epcot / World Showcase. As I've said; there are so many rewards to a Disney trip with your young one, but you have to be prepared to cater the trip around the fact that you are traveling with a young child or else you will be the screaming parent dragging around the poor, exhausted, over-stimulated toddler. Don't really see the Disney magic in that.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip << but you have to be prepared to cater the trip around the fact that you are traveling with a young child or else you will be the screaming parent dragging around the poor, exhausted, over-stimulated toddler.>> BINGO!!! That says it all right there, and I don't have any idea why it seems to be such a difficult concept to grasp. If you are going to WDW with young children, they get to run the show as far as what you see and when you see it. If you're not willing to put your own interests aside for those of your child, don't go to WDW. Or have kids for that matter, but that is another post...
Originally Posted By Goofyernmost ^^^^Could not agree more! All boils down to proper parenting again. I think a pattern is starting to develop.
Originally Posted By mrkthompsn That kid who I mentioned earlier who had several heart attacks and needs a heart transplant, here's his website... <a href="http://helpjojo.com/default.aspx" target="_blank">http://helpjojo.com/default.as px</a>
Originally Posted By sherrytodd What an adorable little boy. It makes me apreciate the time I spend with my son even more. Though I know it's always the result of someone else's tragedy, I do hope that they are able to find that little boy a doner heart soon. I told my husband just the other day that if anything were to happen to me to make sure they take anything that could help someone else live a long healthy life.
Originally Posted By DVC_dad vbdad I'm glad that you are back. It's far better for me personally around here being able to read your posts and insights. Welcome back! As for the comment about "it's not the kids, it's the parents," I agree. But the problem isn't necessarily just that simple either. I think alot of parents go into WDW with unreasonable expectations of their kids. I just can't get over how many many many times we have all seen the same old thing ---> mom and or dad yelling and or hitting a otherwise "good" child, because the whole family is tired and completely worn out, but still pressing on in the parks for hours on end. People should tell themselves, "Once it ain't fun no more, it's time to call it a day." Or at least take a break, maybe a nap, then come back for more later in the day. Also, I think the worst thing to have happen, especially at WDW (because of it's size) is to go in without ANY plan of action. If you go in with an attitude of "Let's go in and just see what we want to do and do it" your gonna' crash and burn. I think this is the area that first time visitors get burned out and get discouraged by crowds , heat , food prices and all that stuff. It can appear to be chaos with no direction. However if you go in with some kind of plan, ANY plan, such as "Okay let's go straight up to Test Track, get a fastpass for it, run over and ride Soarin' and then Imagination, by then we can use our fastpasses for Test Track, then let's rest in Universe of Energy, after that have an early lunch at the Electric Umbrella, so we can hit Crush during "everyone else's" lunch, then we start the long journey around World Showcase, at least hit Norway, get a cheap toy in China to buy more time with the kids, maybe a little candy in Japan, head back to the hotel for a nap and rest, then back for Illuminations...blah blah blah..... Something , anything , some plan of some sort can really make ALLLLL the difference for everyone in the party.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 ^^^^^^^^^^^ thanks DVCdad -- & I agree with the parental expectations issue, and the end result often is just as you describe. I however can understand how it gets to that point. When we first started going in the mid 80's as 'my family' I thought the first visit would be the one for quite some time. Young family, lots of expenses, etc...so I too was guilty of total commando - let's get there at rope drop and stay until the guards throw us out - because I want to ensure we get all the Disney experience we can on my trip. After the 2nd trip or so like this I found myself coming back from vacation more worn out than when I left. So it took me a while too to figure it out, and I had no one to help plan with me, and had little idea how to do it at the time. One of the main reasons I really think I bought into DVC ( besides the fact I love OKW )- was it seemed a way of guaranteeing to myself and my family members that we would be back - again and again - so let's chill and really enjoy our vacation, get as much Disney experience as we can, but that doesn't mean 12 hours at the park in July or August. I 'plan' Disney trips now for more people than I can count - as word of mouth gets around the office , my wifes office and friends we know in the neighborhood etc. I try and always include 'break' time - along with FP tips / dining tips etc. to try and make the stay as pleasant as possible. Usually the people I hear say how much tyey hated WDW, are those who went 'without a plan' as you say and just got totally overwhelmed. But show me the guidebook that really helps the novice ($$ making thought here). I love my Passporter, but then I know 90% of the stuff in it...if I was going for the first time, knew nothing, and had to wade through 500 pages of helpful tips, I'd go nuts.
Originally Posted By DVC_dad I just sent my bro-in-law, his wife, their 2 kids to Beach Club for a 4 day using my points. They had been previously for 5 days WITH US about 2 years ago. TWO things: 1.) He was there on Spring Break (last week, huge crowds.) 2.) He had NO "plan" whatsoever; said he didn't "need that sort of thing, we are just going to hang loose and do whatever as the mood strikes us..." Upon his return, I called him to make sure everything went well. He RAVED and RAVED about the Beach Club pool area. I thought that a little odd, so I said, "Yeah it's nice but what about the parks?" He paused, a long pregnant pause, and finally said, "Well, to be honest we spent all day each day in the parks but we didn't seem to get a lot done. We got a lot MORE done when we went with you guys." The shocking part of this is when WE took them with US, it wasn't just "us" and "them"... it was my wife's entire extended family...19 people, 10 kids and 9 adults. When we went, we used my "adaptive spreadsheet" plan. LOL it really is something to behold IF you understand the various short hand and abbreviations there on the page. It also has several "IF, THEN" conditions, mostly dealing with potentially closed rides and fastpass issues. When we took this crowd, I had planned every single meal, dinner, ride, show, breaks, swimming at OLD KEY WEST where we stayed (the best for large parties) you name it, it was there in the plan that they all made so much fun of. We didn't stick to it 100% of the time, but pretty darn close. I even had a Downtown Disney evening for select members (the women) and built in "Split Up Into Families For Free Time." The plan isn't perfect, as I am having a problem getting Expedition Everest, Kilimanjaro Safaris, and Kahli River to fit together just right WITHOUT having to actually WAIT a long time for one of these 3. But I think as time goes by and EE isn't as NEW as it is now, that will resolve itself. There are so many people who have fantastic plans for WDW. But I swear, this one works...well enough for us anyway.
Originally Posted By DVC_dad One word of advice... If you take a VERY LARGE group with DVC points, stay at Old Key West. The 3 BR's have 2 floors, and though the square feet may not seem like a LOT more, it really really is. Also, the ability to be able to simply walk out of your room to your car is paramount with a large group.
