Originally Posted By vbdad55 yeah - my nieces ( age 6 and 9 ) keep going thru their Birmbaum WDW for kids book uncle VB got them, and asking, " how come I have never seen this cranium command " ? " what is body wars " - amazing they have left them in that book -- ( this is my nieces 4th trip and have seen neither - so their questions seem valid ) -
Originally Posted By twirlnhurl Listen To The Land's newer version is fantastic. I think the automated speils is one of the best changes to any Epcot attraction. I think I had never been on the spieled version of the ride and had a host that was any good, or even easy to understand. The recorded spiel is the same each time, but it is also clear, concise, and informative. Furthermore, it allows more boats to be run and a higher overall ride capacity.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<Epcot is still my favorite park, but I liked it better the way it used to be.>> That's because you're one of at least two (likely a few more) Texans with very good taste, Danny. Epcot is still my fave park as well. I still feel good just being there. But it's been dumbed down a lot (obviously to please the cultured Minnesota timeshare crowd!), and while many of the recent changes have been positive, the overall direction hasn't been. EPCOT Center of the 1980s was so BIG in scope and execution ... so awe-inspiring that you almost thought the future was going be a Great Big Beautiful Tomorrow (too bad the 1990s and 00s have shown that to be very false). Disney's small-minded management with even smaller budgets have made the place feel smaller in many aspects. There's also a clear lack of vision in place for its future. Having Eric 'Yeah, I designed the wand' Jacobson as the WDI exec in charge of the park gives me a great deal of concern for its future. <<It's a matter of opinion, and to take either side is in no way lying.>> Frankly, I view it mostly as a matter of taste. And, amongst adults, who know and understand concepts of scale, theme and place ... well, I just don't understand why anyone would think it belonged there.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<Listen To The Land's newer version is fantastic. I think the automated speils is one of the best changes to any Epcot attraction. I think I had never been on the spieled version of the ride and had a host that was any good, or even easy to understand. The recorded spiel is the same each time, but it is also clear, concise, and informative. Furthermore, it allows more boats to be run and a higher overall ride capacity.>> I absolutely disagree ... lots. Since they have dropped the CMs, I have yet to ride once where the idiot guests haven't talked through the ride and over the recorded spiel. As I mentioned to a friend when riding recently, the atmosphere was akin to 'being in sixth grade with a substitute teacher' ...
Originally Posted By danyoung >That's because you're one of at least two (likely a few more) Texans with very good taste, Danny.< Oh sure, complement me in one thread, dis me in another! (What did you call me - big dumb Texan???) >Since they have dropped the CMs, I have yet to ride once where the idiot guests haven't talked through the ride and over the recorded spiel.< I haven't experienced this, but I do think that the lack of a live cast member takes away from the experience. And with that said, I also have to say that unfortunately I rode the Living With The Land (or Listen To The Land) ride many times with a cast member who was barely going through the motions, blandly reciting facts in a bored monotone. But when you did get a great host it really made the ride. I rode one morning right at opening (really? Didn't have any better attraction to do right at opening, Danno?) with an older CM who started into the spiel, and then kinda turned to the boat and said "Hey, it's early - anyone mind if I drop off of the script and just talk?" And then he covered the script points, but in a natural, casual way that should have been the standard for all Land CM's. Totally memorable!
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<Oh sure, complement me in one thread, dis me in another! (What did you call me - big dumb Texan???)>> True. But I'm sure I said it with a lot of love and admiration. <<But when you did get a great host it really made the ride. I rode one morning right at opening (really? Didn't have any better attraction to do right at opening, Danno?) with an older CM who started into the spiel, and then kinda turned to the boat and said "Hey, it's early - anyone mind if I drop off of the script and just talk?" And then he covered the script points, but in a natural, casual way that should have been the standard for all Land CM's. Totally memorable!>> Yeah. No doubt the quality of CM could greatly effect the experience. But now you don't get that choice. You get the exact same automated spiel all the time. And I seriously doubt they update it to reflect what may be growing at a given time. It was simply another way to save $$$ on labor and cut CMs when they are having trouble with staffing.
Originally Posted By Jim in Merced CA <EPCOT Center of the 1980s was so BIG in scope and execution ... so awe-inspiring that you almost thought the future was going be a Great Big Beautiful Tomorrow> And how, Spirit. I grew up on Disneyland starting in 1969, and dreamed about being able to get to Florida to visit Walt Disney World. I was in my senior year in college at Wagner College in New York, and realized I was close enough to Central Florida to drive it. It was 1986, and visiting EPCOT Center for the first time was just incredible -- it is my favorite Disney theme park experience ever. Here was Disney, doing all these amazing attractions, and it was about science, and symbiosis, and tons of animatronics, and the future, and geodesic spheres, and it was just incredible. And that was just Future World. Then, you had the entire World Showcase to experience. And all those great theme songs... As a Cast Member, I spent a lot of time in EPCOT Center from 1986-1990 until I got transferred back to California. I didn't get back to Epcot until 1999, and the tone of the place had certainly changed. Some of the original sophistication had been done away with. And now, with the addition of all the Disney cartoon characters -- pavilions like 'The Living Seas' -- which was a womderful science-fiction / science-fact sensation of exploring the world's oceans, becomes 'Finding Nemo' in the ocean. Yeah, okay... I'll never forget that first time walking through EPCOT Center in 1986. Gosh, it had only been open for 4 years back then. I love listening to that suite of EPCOT Center music. *sign*
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 Great post, Jim. Sophistication is a great word to describe the EPCOT Center of the 1980s. That's what's missing now ... in between all of the closed areas, all of the characters, all of the thrill rides, all of the merchandise carts of pins, plush and pirates merchandise ... the sophistication that this park was aiming higher has been lost. I'm hopeful that Jim MacPhee can help change that. He certainly is a quality parks guy through and through unlike the last three leaders that have diminished Epcot since Greg Emmer left in 1995. The best tribute I can give to Epcot is that it has survived some amazingly awful management and still manages to shine in so many areas.
Originally Posted By BlueOhanaTerror >>>A little twisted for a 9 year old I know but that wand has been there for her entire memory span.<<< People forgot Boy George. She'll forget this.
Originally Posted By TMICHAEL >>>>I'll never forget that first time walking through EPCOT Center in 1986. Gosh, it had only been open for 4 years back then. I love listening to that suite of EPCOT Center music. *sign*<<<< I'm right there with you Jim! My first two trips were in '83 and '84 when I was a D-land employee. And that EPCOT Suite was simply awesome.
Originally Posted By pheneix >>>Having Eric 'Yeah, I designed the wand' Jacobson as the WDI exec in charge of the park gives me a great deal of concern for its future.<<< You think that with Jim MacPhee playing a key role in getting Eric's little monster torn down might create a little "tension" between WDI and Epcot management? In my very limited experience in dealing with Jim I can already tell he has ideas for Epcot that are way different than what WDI probably would like. For that matter, they are probably different than what his peers in TDO would like too. I still see good things coming from his reign at Epcot. He has a much stronger will than his peers, and dare I say he is smarter than they are too. Disney's politics usually stifle motivated, hard working, intelligent people, but when they do break through its always a sight to behold (see: John Lasseter).
Originally Posted By danyoung Or Matt Ouimett. Or Greg Emmer. This is kinda exciting. When did Mr. MacPhee take over?
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<People forgot Boy George. She'll forget this.>> Now, now ... let's be nice. Despite his numerous 'issues' in his personal life with substance abuse and the like, the 'Boy' had quite a voice and put out some wonderful music in the 1980s. Certainly better than any of the crap you hear today ...
Originally Posted By danyoung Yer on yer own there, Show Tunes Boy. George can just fade away, thank you . . .
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<You think that with Jim MacPhee playing a key role in getting Eric's little monster torn down might create a little "tension" between WDI and Epcot management? >> I would say so. I can imagine the word 'frigid' might describe the feelings between the two paties. <<In my very limited experience in dealing with Jim I can already tell he has ideas for Epcot that are way different than what WDI probably would like. For that matter, they are probably different than what his peers in TDO would like too.>> I can imagine that. The fact he went to bat immediately for some acknowledgement of the 25th anniversary speaks volumes to me about someone getting 'it' (and btw, isn't it sad that it's come down to hoping that Disney execs will actually get 'it' when it comes to what their product is supposed to be!) <<I still see good things coming from his reign at Epcot. He has a much stronger will than his peers, and dare I say he is smarter than they are too.>> Well, having at least casual personal dealings with the past four Epcot VPs, he can't be any worse then the last three. The very scary thing is two of them are now running (into the ground?) DLP based on promtions 'earned' by cutting corners left and right during their years in Florida. <<Disney's politics usually stifle motivated, hard working, intelligent people, but when they do break through its always a sight to behold (see: John Lasseter).>> Yep. I'd like to believe this is a sign of things to come. I've noticed over the past 4-8 months many Jay Rasulo supporters have slowly backed away from their positions ... maybe that helped earn Jim the job, I don't know. I do know the era of the Dick Nunis-type exec is ancient history, but the pool has to be deeper than the Karl Holz, Erin Wallace, Phil Holmes type as well. I just can't believe it's that difficult to run the world's most-loved, most-visited theme parks. Actually, I know it isn't.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<Or Matt Ouimett. Or Greg Emmer. This is kinda exciting. When did Mr. MacPhee take over?>> I believe it's been about three months now Danny. Interesting to point out that Epcot has been all downhill since Emmer left his VP position in 1995 (although there were already issue in his tenure, to be fair!)
Originally Posted By Labuda "You should be used to crossing on the (faaaaaaar) right ... being from Texas and all ;-)" Shut up. I AM A LIBERAL TEXAN AND DANGED PROUD OF IT! So, anyhow... looking forward to taking pics 9 days from now, and also looking forward to the pics that I'm CERTAIN will be posted here on LP Monday. (HINT HINT LOOK HERE DOOBIE! READ THIS!)
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<Yer on yer own there, Show Tunes Boy. George can just fade away, thank you . . .>> Oh Danny, do you really want to hurt me?
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<I AM A LIBERAL TEXAN AND DANGED PROUD OF IT!>> Can't you be hung for that?
Originally Posted By pheneix >>>The fact he went to bat immediately for some acknowledgement of the 25th anniversary speaks volumes to me about someone getting 'it' (and btw, isn't it sad that it's come down to hoping that Disney execs will actually get 'it' when it comes to what their product is supposed to be!)<<< Indeed. He isn't even just going to bat for the 25th, he is pretty much organizing the best acknowledgement with what resources he has with the park and its staff. In some small way I'm kind of glad it is turning out this way. If Epcot turns out to be the battlefield where we win "real Disney" back, I'd much rather have a heartfelt celebration of Epcot with the people who work there and create it than a bloated marketing campaign begrudgingly created by some washed up (and soon to be washed out) marketing executives. >>>I do know the era of the Dick Nunis-type exec is ancient history<<< Don't close the door on that book yet!
