Originally Posted By ssWEDguy >> I don't think you want to use WDW tourists to test a totally new transit concept. << Why not? If it's not blue sky experimental, but tested well enough for full demo purposes. I wouldn't call it "experimenting with tourists" though. I think it would be more along the lines of "cutting edge prototypes."
Originally Posted By RoadTrip <<West Virginia University uses a PRT system to connect its downtown and Evansdale campuses in Morgantown, WV. I used to ride it everyday when I was a grad student there.>> Thanks. I wasn't aware of that.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip <<Why not? If it's not blue sky experimental, but tested well enough for full demo purposes. I wouldn't call it "experimenting with tourists" though. I think it would be more along the lines of "cutting edge prototypes.">> Apparently the system is still rather experimental (though “cutting edge prototypes†isn’t a bad description. <<The concept has been independently reinvented many times since the 1960s. It is considered controversial, and the city-wide deployment with many closely-spaced stations envisaged by proponents has yet to be constructed. Past projects have failed due to lack of financing, cost overruns, regulatory conflicts, political issues and flaws in engineering or design.>> Even the UWV system is not a “true†PRT system: <<In 1975, the Morgantown Personal Rapid Transit project was completed. Despite its name and fact that it has five off-line stations that enable non-stop, individually programmed trips that are characteristic of PRT, this is not considered a PRT system by authorities because its vehicles are too heavy and carry too many people, and because most of the time it does not operate in a point-to-point fashion, running instead like an automated people mover from one end of the line to the other. Morgantown is still in continuous operation at West Virginia University in Morgantown, West Virginia with about 15,000 riders per day (as of 2003). It successfully demonstrates automated control, but was not sold to other sites because the heated track has proven too expensive.>> The safety record seems somewhat mixed, but is better than busses: <<According to the U.S. Department of Transportation, AGT systems as a group have higher injury rates than any other form of rail-based transit (subway, metro, light rail, or commuter rail) though still much better than ordinary buses or automobiles.>> Source: <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_rapid_transit" target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P ersonal_rapid_transit</a>
Originally Posted By ssWEDguy I know there are problems. But knowing all the reasons why something can't work to me is the usual objections coming from the accounting group about how "It can't work, so don't even try." "We all vote No." History has many examples of things that simply and obviously couldn't be done. Until somebody had the guts to do it anyway. (Yes, not all succeed) What I'm saying is that a place like WDW, with it's size, traffic flow, and total ownership would be an ideal place to really test such things. And yes, it's not going to happen. But I can dream.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip <<And yes, it's not going to happen. But I can dream.>> Unfortunately the only sector in the United States that is still generally willing to spend money on transit systems, especially new technology transit systems, is government. Transit systems do not make money, and government is the only agency willing any more to do something for the public good. And of course everyone botches about their taxes, so that will probably end soon too (see Amtrak).
Originally Posted By ssWEDguy >> the only sector in the United States that is willing to spend money on transit systems, especially new technology, is government. << Wouldn't it be cool if the government and Disney could get together on a demo project? Disney would provide the engineering knowhow and the demo property. The government would fund the project, and get the rights to distribute elsewhere. <<And yes, it's not going to happen. But I can dream.>>
Originally Posted By ssWEDguy I just re-read my own Post#108. That's so far not going to happen that it makes me chuckle.
Originally Posted By MPierce The goverment gives out all kinds of grants for all kinds of crazy projects. I would guess that Disney is smart enough to explore free money from the goverment for experimental transportation alternatives. Evidently there's not enough money on the table or it's just not worth crawling into bed with our goverment over it. I don't hate riding a bus at WDW ssWEDguy, I just hate having to stand on one. I can't take it anymore Labuda. What is it with the >> Dalmatians! <<. I've tried to figure it out from past threads, but I guess I'm to slow. That's a polite way to say dumb.
Originally Posted By MPierce Thanks trekkeruss I can sleep tonight now. I guess I should have used the phrase "just flat out stupid" for not being able to figure that one out.
Originally Posted By Autopia Deb Some will even use it on the 201, 301, etc. posts. Dalmatians are just a little light-hearted fun.
Originally Posted By ssWEDguy >> I don't hate riding a bus at WDW << I don't hate them either. They are a necessary compromise that I just wish were something better. This place transports me to another world. Buses and traffic just like out in the real world tend to bring me back. My quote "I hat busses" is a riff on a line from another thread.
Originally Posted By SuperDry <<< They only run buses on their own property with the exception of the Airport buses. They do not need to conform to anyone's standards. >>> That's not true. The major roads at WDW are public roads, just like any other public road in Florida. Only when you get to the individual resort or park parking lots do you enter private property. All state and federal laws that apply to operating vehicles on public roads apply to WDW roads until you get to the obviously private property areas such as the resort and park parking lots. So, the WDW buses traveling between resorts and parks are most definitely operating on public roads. Instead of the city, county, or state, the roads at WDW are maintained by the Reedy Creek Improvement District. Although this agency is effectively controlled by Disney, it's still a public agency.
Originally Posted By Goofyernmost >>>Instead of the city, county, or state, the roads at WDW are maintained by the Reedy Creek Improvement District. Although this agency is effectively controlled by Disney, it's still a public agency.<<< Like I said...it's their own property, it's own independent state, as it were, no one can tell them what to do vehicle wise.
Originally Posted By SuperDry <<< Like I said...it's their own property, it's own independent state, as it were, no one can tell them what to do vehicle wise. >>> No, it's not like you said. WDW roads are public roads, and are subject any state or federal law that applies to public roads. The fact that Disney owns the majority of the assessed value of property within the district has no bearing on whether or not the roads are public. Now, once you get onto the private property of each individual resort or park's parking lot, then that's private property that Disney can do with as it pleases.
Originally Posted By MPierce >> My quote "I hat busses" is a riff on a line from another thread. << ... and I thought you just missed a key stoke. Sometimes I think I'm just to old, and feable to catch what people really say on this board. Anyway the picture I saw of the bus in TDL was kind of neat. I think TDLFAN posted it. It looked like something Mickey would take on a cross country tour with Dolly Parton. I don't know how much it cost compared to the Novas that they are buying, but I think it would be worth the extra expense.
Originally Posted By MPierce <<< Like I said...it's their own property, it's own independent state, as it were, no one can tell them what to do vehicle wise. >>> Also all the buses have Florida liscense plates on them. So they would have to meet all standards of the State of Florida. This would be a huge expense that WDW could avoid if the roads were private, and not subject to Florida state law.
Originally Posted By Goofyernmost I wasn't implying that they could circumvent the laws regarding motor vehicles. The topic was something to the effect that the public could put pressure on them to use buses with cleaner sources of energy. I said, they were bullet proof because #1 they do meet state and federal requirements and #2 if you complain, who are you going to be complaining too. Disney, of course! That makes it pretty much without any impact or requirement. For the state to enact laws strictly because someone complained about the buses in WDW would be highly, highly unlikely since whatever they did would involve all the buses in Florida as well as Disney's. Not going to happen.
