Originally Posted By mousefun First off: DALMATIONS! TEEHEETEEHEETEEHEE! [It's readily apparent you aren't willing to give up your postion. eevn when the overwhelming evidence is against you] Love the way you speak of this evidence, though, do not back this up! Pretty amazing, actually, teehee. [OK, how bout your fact about the Jungle Cruise using AA's, when every Disney fan who knows its history knows that the JC animals are not AA? (I know, we're kinda into circular logic here. . .) ] Danny Boy: Please, do not dodge the question with another question! Bad tactic you know! Secondly, every Disney fan knows? Really? Show me that EVERY Disney fans knows that? Fraid not, huh? Then, please, do not use it in an arguement. Thirdly, ho hum, Ill use another source just to appease you (though I am sure you will deny this sourse is accuarte (Ill throw several links that ALL reference Jungle Cruise having AA's in them. Im sure you'll try to fight everyone off, as, there is NO WAY you can ever be wrong, Dannyboy): <a href="http://www.allearsnet.com/tp/mk/mk_jcr.htm" target="_blank">http://www.allearsnet.com/tp/m k/mk_jcr.htm</a> <a href="http://www.themeparkinsider.com/reviews/disneyland/jungle_cruise/" target="_blank">http://www.themeparkinsider.co m/reviews/disneyland/jungle_cruise/</a> <a href="http://www.wdwinfo.com/wdwinfo/guides/magickingdom/adv-jungle.htm" target="_blank">http://www.wdwinfo.com/wdwinfo /guides/magickingdom/adv-jungle.htm</a> (most of the above by those DISNEY FANS you so love!) Oh, and, just for those who trust and love Wikipedia, it clearly states, rightfully so, that JC does use AA's: <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animatronics" target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A nimatronics</a> [Even with the tee-hee, we're getting into a kind of snotty area now] Tis not I! You keep trying to force your belife to I, and, after I continually prove you wrong again and again, you still keep tryin'. Tis ok, okay? TEEHEE!
Originally Posted By trekkeruss <<Love the way you speak of this evidence, though, do not back this up! Pretty amazing, actually, teehee.>> I presented you the evidence; you merely choose to ignore it. The evidence clearly shows that the majority of people feel there are other Disney attractions better than TT. You don't think themeparkinsider and LP was enough? How about another site you just quoted as another source, wdwinfo? <a href="http://www.disboards.com/ratings/censura.php?cmd=browse&category_id=65" target="_blank">http://www.disboards.com/ratin gs/censura.php?cmd=browse&category_id=65</a>
Originally Posted By trekkeruss Look at one rating in particular: "How would you rate the queue line?" Out of five stars, readers give EE, a queue you say is " Just a generic que with no texture, no detail, just an old props werehouse for ancient artificats. Zzzzzzzz" a 4.56. TT on the other hand, readers give that queue 2.93. Heck, even YOU VERY OWN list in #98 you don't mention TT's queue.
Originally Posted By trekkeruss <<Instead of simply it's simply UNTRUSTWORTH, why not justify this. Show us proof how it's not trustworthy. ALSO, Wikipedia is not simply enter and run. Admin on their end verifies the information before posted. So, please check your information before opening up a conversation, puh-lease, tee-hee.>> Wikipedia founder admits to serious quality problems: <a href="http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/10/18/wikipedia_quality_problem/" target="_blank">http://www.theregister.co.uk/2 005/10/18/wikipedia_quality_problem/</a> Not proof enough for you? Googel "Wikipedia errors" and you get plenty.
Originally Posted By danyoung mousefun, even as I'm typing this I'm undecided as to how to deal with you. You seem to want a discussion, but then you attack those who are bringing up opposite thoughts. I asked you nicely to chill the attitude, and you crank it up a notch. On the one hand, I'm tempted to call it a day, drop out of this thread and ignore you. But I'm enough of a cranky ol' dude to not like to walk away from a fight (just ask TDLFAN!), so I'm gonna give this a shot. >Danny Boy: Please, do not dodge the question with another question!< I dodged nothing. True, my response was in the form of a question, but that didn't negate the point I was trying to make. And that point was that Wikipedia and any other source that calls the Jungle Cruise figures Audio Animatronics are just in error. It's a common mistake. For a figure to be an AA it needs to have some sort of control. Early on it was through audio tones and cams. Nowadays it's via computers. Most of the figures in the JC are simple repeating mechanisms, under no central computer control. Pirates? AA. Tikis? AA. JC? Nope. It could be that one or two of the figures, such as maybe the elephant in the shower, are indeed AA's, but I don't think so. If anyone with any authority that I recognise (and that doesn't include Wikipedia or mousefun) says different, I'm very willing to revise my opinion. And only a very few of my friends call me Danny boy. I'll call you mousefun and you call me danyoung, ok? >Im sure you'll try to fight everyone off, as, there is NO WAY you can ever be wrong, Dannyboy):< Hey, I'm wrong all the time. As I said above, I'm very willing to change my stand on something if convinced that I'm wrong. So far, you haven't. And I just can't understand the attitude, as we're taking opposite sides of an issue. Of course I don't agree with you, and then you don't agree with me, and that's how these online things work. I don't think I ever presented myself with any attitude or tried to set myself up as an absolute authority. It's just an online thread, mousefun! >You keep trying to force your belife to I, and, after I continually prove you wrong again and again, you still keep tryin'.< And again, I'm not trying to force a thing, and you have proved nothing. State your case, I'll state mine, and life will go on. This is my last attempt at keeping up a civil discussion with you, mousefun. I hope you read this and take it as the genuine olive branch that it's meant to be. If not, life's too short to worry about this kind of friction.
Originally Posted By TDLFAN ..and here I was think ing the reason why lines are short is because Space sucks, as opposed to making you sick.
Originally Posted By Socrates This is from "Disney A to Z" by Dave Smith (1996 edition): "Enchanted Tiki Room: Adventureland attraction at Disneyland; opened on June 23, 1963. The first attraction to feature sophisticated Audio-Animatronics figures. The term Audio-Animatronics earlier described the movable figures populating Nature's Wonderland, but the process was greatly changed enabling press releases to call the Enchanted Tiki Room the first use of Audio-Animatronics...." (p. 164) From "Disneyland: Inside Story" by Randy Bright (1987): "... One day, Disney arrived with famed Hollywood gossip columnist Hedda Hopper, hoping to demonstrate his new world of Audio-Animatronics. Stopping at one of the areas where an employee was adjusting a bird, he asked if he could make it work for his guest. The bird was powered by compressed air, but before the employee could hook it up, Walt pushed the value on the open air line. A trememdous burst of air shot out and hit Hedda Hopper squarely in the face...." (p. 167) Socrates "The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."
Originally Posted By danyoung Thank you for that reference, Socrates. I have that book, and it never occurred to me to check it. So, mousefun, do you have a source that trumps Dave Smith, the official archivist of the Walt Disney Company?
Originally Posted By mousefun [I dodged nothing. True, my response was in the form of a question, but that didn't negate the point I was trying to make. And that point was that Wikipedia and any other source that calls the Jungle Cruise figures Audio Animatronics are just in error. It's a common mistake. For a figure to be an AA it needs to have some sort of control. Early on it was through audio tones and cams. Nowadays it's via computers. Most of the figures in the JC are simple repeating mechanisms, under no central computer control. Pirates? AA. Tikis? AA. JC? Nope. It could be that one or two of the figures, such as maybe the elephant in the shower, are indeed AA's, but I don't think so. If anyone with any authority that I recognise (and that doesn't include Wikipedia or mousefun) says different, I'm very willing to revise my opinion. ] Tch, tch, tch, Danny, oh Danny. You love to live by YOUR rules, what YOU define as AA, when, in fact, OFFICIAL DISNEY websites and literature point out consistantly that Jungle Cruise is full of AA's. So, please, your defintion of AA's is merely part of your imagination! Jungle Cruise has MANY AA's! Put it to reast already! It sounds so funny when you eagerly try to prove something that you are so wrong about! ["Enchanted Tiki Room: Adventureland attraction at Disneyland; opened on June 23, 1963. The first attraction to feature sophisticated Audio-Animatronics figures. The term Audio-Animatronics earlier described the movable figures populating Nature's Wonderland, but the process was greatly changed enabling press releases to call the Enchanted Tiki Room the first use of Audio-Animatronics...." (p. 164)] Um, Dannyboy. He was proving you wrong, actually. They were called Audio Animatronics back then, AND, to this day, Jungle Cruise Audio Animatronics are officially called Audio Animatronics in many forms of official Disney literature! You still cant see the light huh? Thanks, Socrates!
Originally Posted By mousefun From Legendary Imagineer Eddie Soto. He talks of Jungle Cruise and audio-animatronics within this ride. Danny, this is way too easy. Please, do stop...me from laughing!: <a href="http://www.themedattraction.com/sotto2.htm" target="_blank">http://www.themedattraction.co m/sotto2.htm</a>
Originally Posted By Socrates So mousefun, where does the "fun" in your name come from? Socrates "The unexamined life is not worth living."
Originally Posted By danyoung mousefun, I could quote just as many sites, imagineers and authors on my side as you apparently can on yours. But what was once a mildly interesting discussion has descended into snotty retorts from an immature newbie. So I'm out. Enjoy the rest of the discussion.
Originally Posted By TDLFAN You gotta give mousefun some credit...as he has just accomplished what even I have not been able to do.
Originally Posted By mousefun [mousefun, I could quote just as many sites, imagineers and authors on my side as you apparently can on yours.] Go ahead, Danny! Show me ONE imagineer who says that there are NO audio-animatronics in Jungle Cruise. You cant. Cause you are wrong! [ But what was once a mildly interesting discussion has descended into snotty retorts from an immature newbie.] Um, no. This is escalted as YOU attempted to mis-educated the world, and, contiuned to do so again and again. [So I'm out. Enjoy the rest of the discussion.] Typlical to those who are painted in a corner, tee-hee-hee
Originally Posted By TDLFAN <---pulls up a chair and shakes the jiffy popcorn over the stove, awaiting the outcome...
Originally Posted By danyoung I can't believe I'm up this late dealing with this, especially after I said I was done. TDLFAN, it doesn't surprise me in the least that you're now involved, but even you at your worst has never been as annoyingly condescending as mousefun. I'm still looking for "Imagineer" comments, but in the meantime I came up with a few references. First from Bob Thomas's book Walt Disney: An American Original (about as "official" a resource as you'd find), he says: "Since the new system combined sound, animation and electronics, it acquired the name of Audio-Animatronics. Its first application to Disneyland entertainment was the Enchanted Tiki Room." On a site called disneyworldtrivia.com, a site by Louis A. Mongello, a widely recognized Disney expert, I found: "Believe it or not, there are no Audio-Animatronics figures in the entire Jungle Cruise! The animals in the attraction are not actual Audio-Animatronics figures, as their "insides" would not be able to withstand the water and elements. Instead, they use a simple system of air pressure and pneumatics." This is the closest I've found to what I've always believed over the years. On Paul Anderson's Persistence of Vision site, I found: "Although not labeled as "Audio-Animatronics," when Disneyland opened, the Jungle Cruise featured moving animals (albeit with very simplistic movements). The first use of the term, "Audio-Animatronics," came with the opening of Nature's Wonderland in May, 1960." And from my version of Disney A to Z: "The Lincoln exhibit opened in April 1964 to great acclaim. But Audio-Animatronics had actually been used in a show that had opened at Disneyland the previous year...the Enchanted Tiki Room. To be fair, I also found many examples that stated that AA was used as early as the Jungle Cruise. And mousefun, your own Eddie Soto reference was pretty compelling. It's a good thing I have a quiet week at work, as I'll be spending some research time tomorrow. And mousefun, I am in no way attempting to mis-educate the world. I really am trying to have a calm discussion, which you're making more and more difficult. I am also in no way painted into a corner. If enough evidence mounts up on your side, I'll find it very easy to ammend my stand. The only thing that is prompting me to leave the discussion behind is that I don't want to come down to your level of nose-thumbing taunting. I think I've got enough will power for a couple more rounds, but it ain't easy. How's the jiffy pop, TDL?
Originally Posted By TDLFAN Pretty decent tasting... and no fat in it... (right...) But hey, don't drag me into your little squabbles with mousefun.. I am here merely as an spectator. Carry on you two..
Originally Posted By trekkeruss <<I'm still looking for "Imagineer" comments>> Here's an old LP Designer Times column by Disney Legend Bob Gurr; he clearly says that the first Disneyland animations were not AA's: <a href="http://www.laughingplace.com/News-ID108065.asp" target="_blank">http://www.laughingplace.com/N ews-ID108065.asp</a>
Originally Posted By mousefun [I can't believe I'm up this late dealing with this, especially after I said I was done.] Wow! You just dont know when to quit, do ya? [First from Bob Thomas's book Walt Disney: An American Original (about as "official" a resource as you'd find), he says: "Since the new system combined sound, animation and electronics, it acquired the name of Audio-Animatronics. Its first application to Disneyland entertainment was the Enchanted Tiki Room."] Um, what proof is this? I asked you for an IMAGINEER! This is a guy who wrote a book. We are still waiting for an imagineer. Heck, I gave you an offical WALT DISNEY COMPANY imagneer, who works on designing Disney rides, and, you still do not buy this. You give me a guy who writes a book...yippeee! Big deal! Many book writers re Disney have stated Jungle Cruise contains AA's. But, this is not good for you. Either is an imagineer. SHEEESH, DUDE! COME ON! [On a site called disneyworldtrivia.com, a site by Louis A. Mongello, a widely recognized Disney expert, I found] Really? Widely recongnized? By whom? Whats his credentials? Tell me who widely recognizes him? What makes him an expert? Sure nowhere close to an ACTUAL IMAGINEER!!! [On Paul Anderson's Persistence of Vision site, I found: "Although not labeled as "Audio-Animatronics," when Disneyland opened, the Jungle Cruise featured moving animals (albeit with very simplistic movements). The first use of the term, "Audio-Animatronics," came with the opening of Nature's Wonderland in May, 1960."] HAHAHAHA! You contradicted yourself here, good buddy! You have claimed in previous posts that Tikis had the first AA's, yet, you prove yourself wrong by showing the Nature's Wonderland has AA's (which, by the way, is correct, in addition to Jungle Cruise!) Thanks for the back up, good buddy! [And from my version of Disney A to Z: "The Lincoln exhibit opened in April 1964 to great acclaim. But Audio-Animatronics had actually been used in a show that had opened at Disneyland the previous year...the Enchanted Tiki Room.] Um, and this proves what? I can add to that statement by saying...and Jungle Cruise in 1955. Zzzzzzz....you are lulling me to sleep with this inept rationale! [To be fair, I also found many examples that stated that AA was used as early as the Jungle Cruise.] HE CONTRADICTS HIMSELF AGAIN! The point is, Dannyboy, why even go here? YOu are soooo wrong. But, you persist on trying to prove others wrong...bad show!! [It's a good thing I have a quiet week at work, as I'll be spending some research time tomorrow.] Oh. My. God. Can u beleive this guy?
