Originally Posted By trekkeruss <<To me a number somewhere around 7 Million (or about 55-60% of Disneyland's gate) should be the absolute minimum Disneyland should expect to attend their second gate each year.>> Supposedly it is seven million; I only used five as a rounded number of all the years it's been open, and also to assume that a million or two hate the place so much that they'll absolutely never go back.
Originally Posted By Darkbeer Who has set it has reached 7 million, and by which "standard" Remember that you have the "first click of the day" standard, which is the traditional count, or you can use the larger count of anyone who enters the park on the day, even if they went to Disneyland first. What I have been told is that DCA had about the same attendance in 2006 as 2005, which was reported at 5.8 million by Amusement Business/ERA using the traditional "First Click of the day" method. And that the main reason why DCA was about flat in attendance was the additional Special Events and Private Party sale, such as events being held in Stage 17 (the old Millionaire building) and a large Halloween Treat attendance. If someone is claiming 7 million, I seriously think they are playing games with the numbers.... If they claim over 7 million, that would have to be over a 20,000 a day average attendance, and only a couple of days last year did DCA get close to or over 30,000 in a day....
Originally Posted By trekkeruss I recall it was bean who said it reached seven million. Frankly, I don't care if it was first click or not. Semantics aside, some people enjoy DCA, even if it's not the best Disney can do.
Originally Posted By Darkbeer Hey some folks enjoy Adventure City, Belmont Park, Pacific Park on the Santa Monica Pier and other small regional amusement parks.... On the other hand, the CEO of the Walt Disney Company has admitted publicly that the park has said "In the spirit of candor, we have been challenged." about DCA, and this week Three Main WDC execs (Iger, Staggs and Rasulo) used the same term "Challenged" in regards to Hong Kong Disney, which Disney has admitted in official SEC documents that they more than likely will not meet certain standards in regards to the loan agreements with the folks that financed the park and that they need to either get some adjustments to those benchmarks or have to refinance the loans... The term "Challenging" is NOT a good term in Big Business, it means the division is way under-performing.
Originally Posted By trekkeruss Darkbeer, I KNOW THAT. You post something virtually every day to tell the board that DCA sux. I GOT IT. It doesn't change the fact that some people enjoy DCA, whether it's five million, seven million, or two people. That it may or may not be making money is not important to me. You on the other hand, seem to be obsessed with pointing out its failings, and frankly, it's weird.
Originally Posted By Zwitek Everything in life is relative. Lots of people enjoy the Blue Bayou, but to me it's Denny's quality. I for one enjoy DCA, but it still has major, major flaws that prevent me from ever thinking of it as anything but a place to spend a couple of hours. I went the first year, right when the Grand Californian was doing their dry run (and the damned fire alarm kept going off all night), hadn't heard any of the negative publicity, went to the park, and was shocked at the lack of things to do. The park, six years later, still doesn't have enough to entertain for a full day. Darkbeer, in my opinion, has given credit where credit is due, but is also keeping the screws tightened until DCA is a park worthy of the Disney nameplate. DCA sucks compared to Disneyland. Just like the Blue Bayou sucks compared to anything above Denny's quality. I still enjoy what DCA has to offer though. Much as I do enjoy the ambience of the Blue Bayou. I won't pay the price of dining at the BB because to me, there isn't value in it. Same for DCA. One day, I hope to do both willingly.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo Yawn!!!!!!!!!!!! I don't give a rat's patootie as to whether people love or hate the park. It has room to improve. There are pockets of world class excellence. And we enjoy our time there. But I am tired of reading the same rubbish year after year. It's like groundhog day, except less entertaining.
Originally Posted By Hans Reinhardt "and only a couple of days last year did DCA get close to or over 30,000 in a day...." And you know this how exactly?
Originally Posted By Darkbeer ^Simple, capacity is in the low 30,000, and how many times has DCA ticket sales been restricted? The last two days of the 2fer in 2006, and one day during Christmas. Plus I do get to see numbers from some manager friends of mine.
Originally Posted By plpeters70 "But I am tired of reading the same rubbish year after year. It's like groundhog day, except less entertaining." Then might I suggest not reading them?? If you truly find it so tiresome, then why rush in to defend the park day after day?
Originally Posted By Hans Reinhardt "Simple, capacity is in the low 30,000, and how many times has DCA ticket sales been restricted? The last two days of the 2fer in 2006, and one day during Christmas." "Plus I do get to see numbers from some manager friends of mine." Fair enough, but those two points don't prove whether DCA got 7 million last year or not. Frankly speaking I'd be surprised if it hit the mark, but there is a poster here who claims to have inside information that it did indeed reach its 2001 estimated target last year.
Originally Posted By Darkbeer Based on the info I have been provided, I said that DCA got about the same attendance, around 5.8 million based on the "First Click" method. THe "regular attendance", that is, AP holders, ParkHoppers and Comps/Sign-ins that enter during regular hours went down about 100,000. On the other hand, tickets like Mickey's Halloween Treat and Private Parties being held after hours had about 100,000 more sold than in 2005. The only way that they could get to the 7 million number, which I am pretty much sure didn't happen, is to add those folks who "hopped" to DCA from Disneyland on the same day. I will have to ask about that, but it is possible, if you need 2.2 million to get to 7 million that is only less than a third extra of your regular daily attendance. But with all the 5,000 or less days they get (and they had lots of those on weekdays the last few weeks), I just don't see enough Park is almost full days to get the daily average to 20,000. Also, don't forget, that the 2001 estimated attendance was based on no more AP's being sold, very limited ParkHoppers and restricted Comps and Cast Member sign ins. So if they got 7 million (counting ParkHoppers) they still got a LOT less revenue than what was predicted back in 2001.
Originally Posted By oc_dean And lets not forget the 2f1. That is sooo often overlooked by the DCA apologists. Love touting numbers... Never bother to mention where they come from! Most irritating. And they call us critics irritating!
Originally Posted By oc_dean >>Then might I suggest not reading them?? If you truly find it so tiresome, then why rush in to defend the park day after day?<< plpeters ... they're called hypocrites. They love feading into these discussions as much as the critics do ... they just can't admit it!
Originally Posted By trekkeruss <<That is sooo often overlooked by the DCA apologists.>> The only thing that is being defended is that even though DCA is not all it could be, people do enjoy some of what is on offer there. Yet some people here throw that all out, and continue to cite statistics to show that that cannot be possible. It's just one huge strawman argument.
Originally Posted By gadzuux Another irony is that darkbeer probably spends more time and money inside DCA than most of us put together.
Originally Posted By Darkbeer ^And I am a Theme Park Enthusiast, and spend MORE money at Knott's (about to pay a few hundred dollars for the Winter Solace package, and the charity raffle, and that is $500 on one weekend) and Universal than DCA. If I would measure time, Knott's and DCA are about equal, just because I can run into DCA for an hour and get the photos I need and head back to Disneyland. I buy an AP for Disneyland and get to visit DCA at no extra charge, and yes, since I do cover the parks for websites, I would more than likely pay an extra charge (so far as it is reasonable) to enter the park and get photos. I spent just over 30 minutes there today, entered the park after lunch, went straight to Screamin', rode it Single Rider (for construction photos, since it was closed Thursday) and then left. And Lisa was with me, and neither of us wanted to do anything, instead went back to Disneyland to enjoy the rest of the afternoon.
Originally Posted By oc_dean ... and the last time I spent a dime on DCA..... The July 2005 LP Meeting with darkbeer and several others. Must have purchased two margaritas. That was it! And for the sake of our group only!
Originally Posted By DlandDug Those who find the reiteration of DCA bashing irritating should bear in mind that the ardent supporters can be just as irritating when they repeat their same arguments over and over again. It's just point and counterpoint, in repetition. Each party could simply acknowledge that they have made their point and leave it at that, but that would cause frost to form in the interior of the earth.
