Originally Posted By Inspector 57 <<I thought that the OP was a fair question.>> Yes, it was. Asked with a negative position on Gay Days, but fair nonetheless. Following in the thread, then, were posts making incorrect or inflammatory statements about gays or Gay Days. I believe it was those, and not the Opening Post, that caused the sarcastic responses. <<Because if people would deign to even question, and inquire... they must be "wrong" in their views.>> Again, I think people were reacting to STATEMENTS, not inquiries.
Originally Posted By Inspector 57 <<Ok, fine, I will tell it like 90% of americans feel, since the other side doesn't want to hold anything back. 1. Being Gay is a CHOICE, and an evil one at that. 2. We shouldn't have to tolerate evil choices.>> cwade, you're absolutely entitled to your religious opinions. But get your facts straight. Surveys show that the majority of Americans support equal rights for gay people. The "90% of Americans agree with me, and so you're just a vocal radical evil minority" stance doesn't fly.
Originally Posted By patrickegan What’s next MAMBLA day? What color shirts should they wear and what would be their catch phrase? Again, why not just be gay with your inside voice?
Originally Posted By Inspector 57 <<Again, why not just be gay with your inside voice?>> And why can't black people just act more white? After all, white people are the majority. It's not fair that we should have to put up with those weird clothing styles and that slang and all those hand gestures. If they had any real respect for society, they wouldn't make it so difficult for the rest of us by presenting this stuff that's so... not us.
Originally Posted By LPFan22 Yep, Gay Day at Disneyland... lots of red shirts... lots of people having fun. I don't see the problem. No need for arguments.
Originally Posted By Inspector 57 Well, okay, okay, to be fair I should say it's fine if they want to act all black when they're home. But, again, in public they should be respectful of those who are not black and they should act appropriately. I hate it when people are so "in your face" in public. If I see one more Beyonce t-shirt or hear one more, "Girlfriend!"...
Originally Posted By oc_dean >>Again, why not just be gay with your inside voice? << With that kind of line .. I ought to say .. And all straight people should not touch, kiss, hold their spouses in DL. JUST THINK IT IN YOUR MIND.
Originally Posted By scottie Avoiding Gay Day at Disneyland or any event for the reason of a specific person or group attending is intolerance towards that group. The reasoning, or generalization of that particular group, by which you come to your decision may or may not be rooted from ignorance. That being said, if you say that you don’t want to go because you are uncomfortable with gays doesn’t necessarily make your decision unreasonable. If you don’t want to go because you feel uncomfortable, that is a valid personal decision. But the reason you feel uncomfortable, I would argue, is because of ignorance. Everyone is ignorant to the things that they are not educated or exposed enough to. I was taught to think being gay was evil growing up with traditional Christian values. I wouldn’t change my childhood but I know that I was ignorant about homosexuality. As I met great people as an adult or already close friends who turned out to be gay, I originally felt uncomfortable too because I was ignorant. It didn’t take long to realize they should not be looked down upon because they are attracted to the same sex. Luckily for me I could accept it. I don’t just tolerate it because to me that sounds like I don’t agree with it from a moral standpoint. I am a very moral person and don't think that homosexuality is a choice nor does it have anything to do with morality. More and more people are going to have to deal with homosexuality regardless of religious upbringing. Over time chances are it will hit closer and closer to home. Luckily, most people have hearts and when a loved one is affected that is all that it takes to change ones mind. More and more people will change their view like I did. People should be judged on their soul, not their sexual preference.
Originally Posted By TMICHAEL Oh, but what fun would that be LPFan22? The majority on here have no problem with gay days. Its the nasty few who keep vomiting the negativity and religious bs.
Originally Posted By TMICHAEL scottie, on a serious note, you are a TRUE gentleman and a human being of high character. Very well put in post 107. Thank You.
Originally Posted By TMICHAEL Being a libra, I usually do too LPFann22. But having fought my consiousness on the issue all through catholic high school and now having lived with the humiliation, intolerance and death of great friends from aids over for the past 24 years, I find I have no tolerance for the small minded. It is a fault I must work on.
Originally Posted By kennect Being gay is a choice one makes...I always love that line...Actually I would like to make the choice of being rich but for some reason when I say that nothing happens....Obviously everyone knows that deciding to be straight is the easiest choice to be made by the public at large....What a crock....Yeah I was just sitting around one day I decided I would be gay... Patrick, you are so off base with your comment about the possibility of a "MAMBLA" day at DL...First off, you don't even have the correct name of the group...Secondly, you insult most all gay folks by saying such...That group is involved in pedophile practices....Your basic gay person is not interested in something that is so offensive as that...But if a gathering like that should ever happen I will jump on your side and fight against it.... But I also loved the comments about the vulgar tshirts....I agree there is no need for them but guess what...I have this older straight brother that is the biggest jerk going... You can't imagine some of the shirts he owns and he wears them in public just to get people going....I am horribly embrassed to even be seen with him...He thinks it is funny...His idea of fun is to wear overalls to a formal event...The guy is a jerk and keep in mind he is straight...So you have to admit every group have some that think they need to go over the top...And I would think that if any of the guys or gals that were wearing these offensive shirts at DL would have been asked to change or leave....I say that based on the ones my brother owns...They really are offensive big time....Being offensive isn't something the gay crowd invented....
Originally Posted By idleHands "What’s next MAMBLA day? What color shirts should they wear and what would be their catch phrase?" If you're going to incite further negative sentiments in this thread with your inflammatory rhetoric, you should at least show some respect if not minimal intelligence by spelling the organization correctly. It's "NAMBLA" with an "N." As in nut. Nincompoop. Neanderthal.
Originally Posted By Dr G I've been biting my tongue but have decided not to resist anymore. So, since this is a Discussion Board, here's my 2 cents on this discussion. First, I believe it is very important, even a God-given right, for people to be free to choose whatever they want. This is best written as "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness." People have the right to pursue happiness as they see it. Only they can determine if they have ultimately found happiness. In the context of the current discussion, people are free to choose to be gay, to choose to be straight, to choose to be tolerant, to choose to be intolerant, etc. etc. I'm a Star Wars fan, so I'll put it this way: people are free to choose the Dark Side, or the Light Side. I also believe that, while we are free to choose our acts, we are not free to choose the consequences of those acts. I can choose to smoke, but I cannot avoid the consequences of smoking. I can choose to drink and drive, but I can't choose what happens when I do so, and often the consequences are not good. Unfortunately, often our choices don't just impact us, but they impact others as well (second-hand smoke, DUI car crashes, etc.) Let me next say that I believe in a Creator. I believe He is our Father, that He created us, that He loves us, and that He wants us to be happy. I believe He loves all of us, no matter what we do. I love all my children, even when they make mistakes and I am disappointed in them. I belive that right and wrong exist. I believe that the concept of "sin" is real, and I believe that I have committed sins and will, unfortunately, continue to do so for awhile. If someone does not believe in right and wrong, then the rest of what I have to say will not mean a thing to them. I believe that homosexuality is wrong. To me it is obvious that homosexuality is unnatural, since Nature itself decrees that both a Woman and a Man are necessary to make a Child. As a parent, I believe I have the responsibility to teach my children right from wrong--to teach them what is correct to do and what is not correct to do. If I don't teach them right from wrong, who will? Hollywood? Politicians? The School System? Kids at School? In all of this, I think this is the key: We are supposed to judge "actions", but never judge "people". One of the key things I have to teach my children, it that it is wrong to judge people. It is wrong to call someone ugly (inside or out). It is wrong to bash gays. It is wrong to be mean. It is right to be nice. My kids have a grandparent that smokes. We teach our kids that smoking is wrong, but grandpa loves you and we love grandpa. My kids have a grandparent who is an alcoholic. We teach our kids that being an alcoholic is wrong, but that grandma loves you and we love grandma. My kids have a grandfather that committed adultery. We teach the kids that adultery is wrong, but we love grandpa and he loves us. My mom's cousin is gay--we teach our kids that being gay is wrong, but we love her and she loves us. I think both sides of the gay debate have done right and wrong in their treatment of each other. Anti-gays get mad, are intolerant of people who have chosen a different lifestyle, have judged the gays and condemned them, and that's not fair. Gays get mad, are intolerant of people who profess a belief in right and wrong, have judged them as bigots and condemned them, and that's not fair. In our PC world it seems that people can't accept the fact that someone can dislike/hate an action, but like/love the doer of the action: hate the "sin" but love the doer of the "sin". So, on Gay Days, would I take my family? If that's when the vacation worked for us, sure, I'd take them. It may or may not provide an opportunity to explain what I believe to be right and wrong to my childre, while also teaching them to not judge the people but to love them. If it didn't provide that opportunity, in any case I know we'd have an awesome time at the Happiest Place on Earth. Plus, Red is the color of my collegiate alma mater--I love seeing red So, I believe homosexuality is wrong and contrary to God's will and am not afraid to say it. I believe that the consequences of that choice will, ultimately, result in unhappiness and emptiness. Am I right? I guess we really won't know for sure until we've reached the end of our life and see if we're happy. I also believe that judging the homosexual is wrong and contrary to God's will and am not afraid to say it. Only God can judge his children. Only He knows each individual's situation, background, etc. Am I right? I believe I am. So, if you're gay, I believe you've chosen wrong and that you've not chosen what will ultimately lead to happiness. And I'll fight right alongside you for your right to be that way. I guess if I had my wish the "straights" would love the "gays" and not be so mean and judgmental and call them names etc, and the "gays" would love the "straights", and let them have their beliefs of right and wrong actions without calling them bigots. To quote The Beatles, "All You Need Is Love". I hope this "little" post won't keep any of you Disney fans from helping me with input when we plan our every-other-year trip to Disneyland in 2006 Well, I've rambled way too long. Fire away
Originally Posted By Dr G Wow--15 posts since I started drafting that thing above. I wish the name-calling would stop, though. Anytime we label someone with a label that doesn't include everyone, we're dividing people up, not bringing them together. Unity, I think, is what we're after. We're all on this earth together and, in the wise words of Woody in Toy Story, "so PLAY NICE" [gets of soap box, at least until my next post ]
Originally Posted By patrickegan Inspector- Being black has nothing to do with express unity based on sexuality! Scottie- Same thing could be said for the NAMBLA folks and I’m sure that most of us are ignorant of the inner workings of their lifestyle. So if I decided to avoid man boy love day at Disneyland I would be showing intolerance toward that group too? They same the same thing they were just born that way- People are entitled to their own opinions about anything they have an opinion about and your statement is rooted in bigotry. I don’t want to see butt-less chaps and public sex acts so I don’t go to the gay pride day parade’s in Frisco. Is it because I’m ignorant or intolerant of love? Nope just repulsed by the notion of a sexual freak show. I love how all of you know about NAMBLA why don’t you spell it out for the rest of the strait crowd girl’s?
Originally Posted By kennect Dr G, I applaud you efforts to raise your children in a very rewarding moral way....But choosing isn't always an option...We hope for the best, we make the effort to be our best but still sometimes that isn't enough...I have no bad thoughts about your post...But there was something that struck me that I had never thought of before....People seem to think that being gay is a choice...OK, forget that but think of this....Is illness a choice? Is the suffering of a young person a choice? I am just trying to say that we don't always have a choice when it comes to basic living....I live everyday to be the best person I can be and that is all I can do...The day that I die will not be hampered by any questions as to whether or not my creator will accept me since I am gay....I was born to be me...Footnote though is the idea that I was also born to be Disney park nut....
