Originally Posted By CuriouserConstance Maybe they should just get rid of the Southern Californian passes. I can totally see the benefit and need to having Deluxe and Premium passes, but I think the SoCal passes are a mistake , and quite frankly irresponsible for Disney to do. I think it's making everyone's "magic" a lot less magic and a whole lot more nightmarish. And for those of us that have to spend more than the $18 a month to go to Disneyland it's going to make it less and less worthwhile in the meantime.
Originally Posted By Mickeymouseclub I am guessing this new rumor about future(2011)- holiday ticket only magic- will make this final free year even more packed with those locals!!! It would be nice if this discussion and guest comments at City Hall would give Disney the reason to search for a different solution. A free Main Street Holiday Disney has been tradition for so long. It really does seem scroogish to charge now.Heck we are all having financial problems but does that mean we are going to sell tickets to the family Thanksgiving feast. Disney have a heart.
Originally Posted By CuriouserConstance Hmmm, I hadn't thought of selling tickets to Thanksgiving dinner....that's not a bad thought....
Originally Posted By dsnyron <I think it's making everyone's "magic" a lot less magic and a whole lot more nightmarish.> I couldn't agree more except that they have started something that will not be easy to stop for obvious reasons. I went to disneyland this summer and it was just miserably busy.
Originally Posted By mickeymorris1234 I honestly have never had the experiences people describe here. My latest trip the park on a saturday was perfect. There were plenty of people but not enough to make it hecktic, the longest line I waited in was 35 min for Space Mountain. I was able to fully enjoy Main Street for the first time (my dad just goes from one ride to the next and doesn't just take things easy) and even my mom made the comment that she was surprised at how uncrowded it was on a saturday. Yes the AP program has created crowding issues but to me it sounds more like AP holders are the ones complaining about it. I do agree that the SoCal passes need to be axed and it would solve a lot of the problems, but it would also generate a lot of problems again. People are getting these passes because it is cheep to get them AND Disneyland is the escape for these people. If anything I think that all the passes shouldn't have block-out dates but have a cap on how may times you can visit. SoCal is once a month, Deluxe is three a month and premium has no cap, something like that it would fix a lot of the blackout day rush and spread people out.
Originally Posted By DlandDug I would be unhappy to see the Holiday experiences at Disneyland require a separate ticket. I did the Magic Kingdom party many years ago. It was... not a pleasant experience. First there was the "sweep" as day guests were ushered out of the park. I felt a little guilty seeing families with kids being hustled out. The "party" itself consisted of a lot of waiting in lines-- a line to get a cookie, a line to get a cup of tepid cocoa, a line to get a polaroid with a character. The crowds were smaller, yes, but there weren't enough stations to avoid the long lines, unless you were willing to forgo the "premium" experience. ("Free holiday refreshments and a souvenir photo!") They had an extended fireworks show, and some sort of special entertainment in front of the castle. I missed the castle show because the crowds were packed in so tightly I couldn't really see the stage. It was presented once, so many guests camped there most of the night. The special fireworks presentation was... long. Really long. Frankly, it got boring. Don't get me wrong-- this was many years ago when the late night parties were different. Maybe it's better now. But I've never gone back to one because my experience the first time made me feel very sheepish and vaguely ripped off.
Originally Posted By Yookeroo "...incessant overcrowding..." This is getting to be way overstated. October this year was much nicer than last year. I was there last Friday, and it wasn't too bad. The parks aren't jammed every day. Really.
Originally Posted By danyoung It's not a done deal at all - it's just being discussed. Certainly not this year.
Originally Posted By dsny1mom It's kind of like watching a fat guy at a buffet. Yes, he's entitled to eat as much as he wants, but when you see him pile on the food plate after plate and hours later, finally getting his fill, he waddles out leaving several plates with food on his table, you have to shake your head and question why. The best analogy EVER. dsny1mom
Originally Posted By DBitz2 I am working on a post explaining why I think that holding the hard ticket Christmas parties will not relieve the holiday time overcrowding in the parks. But, first I want to address the hostility that some folks direct towards annual passholders. Yes, the parks do get overcrowded and unpleasant at times. But, it is not fair to criticize people who choose to buy annual passes and direct hostility towards them. I, for one, get a bit weary of the passholder bashing that goes on. I've had an annual pass for nearly 20 years, long, long before Disney started overmarketing and overselling them. It gets wearisome when I'm talked about like I'm the scourge of the earth by people making assumptions and judgements and generalizations about all annual passholders. For, when you are talking about passholders, you are talking about me, too, so, yes, it is personal. Please place the blame where it belongs, on Disney management. They are the ones who have created the conditions that cause the overcrowding in the parks. They are the ones who have pushed and oversold annual passes for years, and, continue to do so. Don't blame the people who buy them. If a store has a Black Friday sale that attracts hords of people and causes a pandemoneous shopping frenzy, you don't blame the people who wanted that good deal for coming there to shop. The frenzy was created by the store. Furthermore, the overabundance of annual passholders is only a part of what has caused the parks to often be overcrowded. There are several other contributing factors. It's easy for those of you who don't have AP's or who don't live here to sit out there and pass judgement and blame on annual passholders. But, please have a little more consideration for the feelings of those of us who do have passes.
Originally Posted By avatarmickey115 Amen! I've never gotten in an argument with anyone about annual passholders, but I've seen plenty of people talk about how much they hate APers... sorry, i paid the money for it, i get to go! if i didnt have an annual pass, i wouldnt have gone all these years with my family. then i wouldnt have had an obsession over Disneyland, and then i wouldnt be here on these message boards... And I dont think Disney will be taking away the AP program away any time soon. They love the fact that their parks are crowded and that millions of people buy APs. They are making billions of dollars, and unhappy guests saying its too crowded wont stop them from making their money. On the other hand, it could get so crowded to the point where everyday the park gets filled, then Disney would take action.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt I don't think anyone is bashing APs here. What people are saying is that the AP system is problematic. And lets be honest, thousands of people with the ability to just "popping in" after work and school to look at decorations and hit a few rides does in fact impact parking, traffic, and overall congestion at the parks. It's impossible to discuss crowds at DLR without talking about APs.
Originally Posted By TMICHAEL You can definitely bash some AP holders for entitled and boorish the way that they act. BUT, you can not bash anyone for actually using their AP. Disney has created a massive problem with over crowding at their parks, period. As a CM from the early 80's when the AP was in it's infancy to today.....oh heck, just from 10 years ago to today, the crowds have become ridiculous. The fact that SoCal blackout days are less crowded, much less crowded, proves that the low end AP's are the main culprit. Add to that, the monthly payment plan, that just about anyone can afford, and the NEW DISNEYLAND experience isn't such a great thing.
Originally Posted By pecos bill As has been said before, its tough not to feel some resentment toward a group that has taken the joy out of one of your favorite destinations in the world. Were not fools, we know that management is at the root of the problem, but at the same time, there are hundreds of thousands of Passholders who take the privilege of unlimited entry to an almost obsessive extreme. The crowding is ridiculous, it is unsafe, undignified, and for many of us, ruins the experience. I really have nothing personal against these people, heck, some of my best friends are passholders!
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt "I don't think anyone is bashing APs here." >>Are you kidding?<< No, not in the context of overcrowding I'm not. The overcrowding is real, and there is a direct correlation between the number of APs sold and the issues connected with easy accessibility to the park for locals. "You can definitely bash some AP holders for entitled and boorish the way that they act. BUT, you can not bash anyone for actually using their AP." And that is pretty much my point. There's no arguing the legitimacy of using an AP. The entitlement thing is completely different issue.
Originally Posted By mickeymorris1234 "I don't think anyone is bashing APs here." >>Are you kidding?<< "No, not in the context of overcrowding I'm not." I will have to disagree with that Hans, you have not been AP bashing, as a matter of fact you always talk about the overcrowding it creates and not the AP's, however many others here bash AP's. For example - "As far as I am concerned, the indulged and entitled APers have had free reign for too long now."
Originally Posted By Manfried I think management realizes the problem and will probably raise the prices of the lower end AP prices. I hope so because they are causing problems. What I think management did not realize is that so many people would just "pop" into Disneyland for just a couple hours. I think management expects people to come to the park all day long.
