Originally Posted By Christi22222 Because of this the value of a >>Disneyland vacation for us has gone way, way down. We hate crowds with a passion, and the new policy is to keep the place crowded year round with all kinds of pricing strategies. We'll pass. Maybe we'll do less frequent trips to the World instead, but with the free dining plans it appears that they are doing the same thing over there (keep it crowdwd all the time).<< Could not agree with this more!! I think they really underestimate that some of us will only find value and enjoy it if we can suffer a few minor inconveniences - shorter hours, colder, rides down for maintenance - to avoid the flippin' crowds!! Why is that so hard to understand? That's why attendance cycles work! And they allow for cast members to re-fresh, and everyone jsut sort of gets to hit the re-set button. You flat out can not run at full capacity every day for eternity and offer the same quality product. Geez! Seasonality is a GOOD thing. But once again, it is a long term gain. And currently Disney only seems to care about instant cash flow. Future be damned. (stepping down off soap box now)
Originally Posted By SafariRob I wonder if Disney takes into account the affect overcrowding has on future generations. It will be interesting to see what the next generation thinks of Disney parks when they grow up and start families of their own. Most of us here grew up with Disneyland (or other Disney parks) and have happy memories of going there growing up. Will our children remember it as a happy place or an overcrowded nightmare that stressed mom and dad out?
Originally Posted By fkurucz >> Will our children remember it as a happy place or an overcrowded nightmare that stressed mom and dad out?<< A very good point, but one current management doesn't care one whit about. For them its about meeting the quarterly numbers and getting their bonuses. The future? That's the next generation management's problem. Which is why I wish there was someone from the Disney family still involved with the day to day running of the company. Roy Jr. tried, but he's gone now and I suspect the remaining descendants of Walt and Roy Sr. are little more than trust fund babies who are either uninterested or unqualified to take on such a role.
Originally Posted By fkurucz " You flat out can not run at full capacity every day for eternity and offer the same quality product." Absolutely. The fact that the parks look as good as they do is a testament to the folks in operations and maintenance. As I've mentioned before, early to mid autumn used to be our favorite time to visit. Sure, some rides where in refurb and hours were shorter. But the wonderful weather and the lack of crowds made for a wonderful experience. This of course is long gone. I think the last time I saw an uncrowded Disneyland was a few years ago when a cold pacific storm hit in March. It was cold, wet and miserable as it poured for hours, and eventually we threw in the towel around 6 pm and headed back to the hotel.
Originally Posted By Anacon We gave up our APs. Too crowded! Halloween and Christmas were so crowded the we weren't able to enjoy those times of year. And we went during week days! These hard ticketed events solve the crowd issues.Not my first choice for a solution but you get a lot for your money as opposed to a single day ticket. Capacity can make a difference. Add more people eating rides!
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan Why on earth would they want people to eat the rides? That's crazy talk. In my day, no one ate the rides except maybe a couple sips of the water on Pirates, but that wouldn't be considered eating the rides. It's outrag-- What's that? Oh. People-eating rides. That's different. Nevermind!
Originally Posted By doombuggy Just cause a person has an AP they shouldn't use it? HUH? Thats like saying a person shouldn't use their bus pass to help with over crowding. If I had an AP and lived close I'd love to try and go every day, weekend or once a month. It's Disneys fault plane and simple, they way over sold the AP and now they are realizing it. They should have just 1 AP, no payment plan and blacked out all holidays and holiday weekends.
Originally Posted By dsnyron I think that's what most are trying to say, Doombuggy. As someone else said, you can't blame someone for piling on the food at an all-you-can-eat buffet but at the same time when you watch a fat guy gorging himself then it's just kind of disgusting. This whole mess is 100% a problem and it is caused by disney and their AP program.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt "But the worst part about selling DL on the cheap (SoCal APs) is that if they ever decide to change course the customers won't come." Which is exactly why I said that the business model isn't sustainable. What you're seeing is Disney catering to its local fan base while the big spending tourists ponder why they just dropped so much money to be herded around like cattle and wait 45 minutes for a 2 minute ride in the middle of October. Disney is obviously walking a fine line here and at the moment, possibly because of the economic downturn, seems to be tipping too far towards turning what once was a premium experience into something akin to Walmart.
Originally Posted By doombuggy hmmm the fat guy at the buffet I would say is APers who camp out HOURS before a show they have seen tons of times. And I know you all have seem them, AP around the neck like it's a badge of honor.
Originally Posted By Mickeymouseclub Next time you see me camped out stop and say hello. It feels like Disneyworld took away most of the benches and DL is learning how to control that problem also. You can sit all day and they will move most of the benches around the hub at the last moment. Apparently Disney does not recognize squatter's rights!
Originally Posted By Mickeymouseclub I will say they are always polite but firm when they move the bench with me still squatting on it!
Originally Posted By Yookeroo "No one is bashing the fat guy at the buffet" Because there is no fat guy and there is no buffet. It was a metaphor. One that was intended to bash APers. "Still, you can't really be surprised if other diners take notice and point it out." Who said anything about being surprised?
Originally Posted By fkurucz >>What you're seeing is Disney catering to its local fan base while the big spending tourists ponder why they just dropped so much money to be herded around like cattle and wait 45 minutes for a 2 minute ride in the middle of October<< Yup. Which is why we haven't hurried back. It's been 2.5 years now and I don't plan on going back until after the DCA changes are done and the novelty has worn off.
Originally Posted By DlandDug You know... From 2001 to around last year there WAS a Disneyland Resort theme park that was blissfully uncrowded nearly every day, year 'round. Guests could stroll through without being jostled or hit in the ankles by strollers. There were virtually no lines for attractions and no need to get reservations at the restaurants. So TDA is fixing that deplorable situation, even as we speak.
Originally Posted By Christi22222 ^^^ So very true. I am one of the rare folks who really enjoyed DCA, partly for all of those reasons. To my mind, of all the things Disney needs to fix, I could have waited for this one awhile.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt "No one is bashing the fat guy at the buffet" >>Because there is no fat guy and there is no buffet. It was a metaphor.<< And so was my response. Yookeroo,you've completely misunderstood me. Please go back and reread.
Originally Posted By SanFran Yookeroo, I'm the one who started the "fat guy" metaphor. Is it a bash against APers? I guess it is if you are the fat guy. I said that the fat guy has as much right to eat what he wants at a buffet just like everyone else. But when you see him eat and eat and eat until he's almost sick and then walks away from the table with plates of food half-eaten...people really have to question why--and they do question it. I know it's usually just basic human nature to act that way. Therefore, I can be irritated at the fat guy while, at the same time, understand that he's just trying to take advantage of what he paid for. Most of the fault is the cook's...er Disney's. So, I'm not bashing local APers except to say I wish they could ease up a bit. That's hard to do, I understand. I'm just making a little wish that one day all this madness will end and we can all see Disneyland the way it used to be--the way it was intended to be.
Originally Posted By SanFran I'm not exactly clear on my Disneyland history, but it used to be single entry tickets (A Day at DL Pass) and you had to buy ticket books for the rides. My family (we're from out of town) would go for one day--all day. That was our DL vacation. Then, they started selling the multi-day discounted tickets, right? And, no more ticket books. So, then people were more inclined to visit for 2 or 3 days. Now, it's AP's and you can go everyday of your life if you want--for just a little more than the price of single entry tickets. Did Disney really have that much trouble getting visitors in the first place? Or, did they just get a little too robust in their attempts to fill the park? What can they do next to squeeze even more people in there??!!
Originally Posted By SafariRob >>I'm just making a little wish that one day all this madness will end and we can all see Disneyland the way it used to be--the way it was intended to be.<< Unfortunately, that ship has sailed. We can dream, though...and what better place to do it?
