Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>><<Marc Davis is rolling over in his grave.>> <So dramatic.> Dramatic, but quite fitting given the topic. Maybe he's actually floating around his grave swapping heads with people.<<<< I'm so happy SOMEONE got it.
Originally Posted By leobloom All of you debating the merit of the new effects in HM need to get a life. Good, bad, indifferent. This is just a theme park attraction. Don't you know there are more important things in the world? Like, namely, Disney restrooms. Now there's a subject worthy of endless discussion.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt >>Those kind of remark help keep things in perspective<< "I think they're really used as a way to stifle conversation more often than not." Well sure, but like I said *sometimes* some perspective is needed on this sort of topic, and I gave a couple of illustrations where people were arguing about something that was... well... just plain silly. No offense to the OP here, but the title of this thread is the perfect example an argument designed to build unwarranted hysteria among the rank and file fans. Maybe I'm like RoadTrip... just shy of not being geeky enough to get why some folks allow themselves to become worked up over these things.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>How exactly does it "mess up the flow" of the ride? It's at the end! If this scene were in the beginning or middle, I might agree with you. But it's just before you get out of the Doom Buggy. "Messes up the flow"? Please.<<< The flow of the art style and gags you see. It's ALL Marc Davis... and now, this? Very disjunct. Why tag a 3rd style onto the ending?
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt "What I don't particularly care for from the OP is his or her general condescending attitude towards others because they weren't aware of some history of the park. Or his or her attitude towards park guests in general, the ones who aren't part of the elite AP club." Exactly.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt "No offense to Doc Hans, of course. " You know I'm a little slow sometimes.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt "Why tag a 3rd style onto the ending?" Because this is better than what was there before?
Originally Posted By skinnerbox <<It's ALL Marc Davis... and now, this?>> This is really reaching, even for you. Papa Marc left this world over a decade ago. What are we supposed to do with the theme park designs he and other deceased Disney Imagineering Legends created... let them remain, no matter how dated and uninteresting the ancient technology makes them for current and future plugged-in generations? Ghosts on a stick have become as unconvincing as Everest's bird on a stick. Better technology exists for more entertaining effects. These digital effects did not exist in the late sixties, when ghosts on a stick were constructed. Citing Davis is a lame justification for keeping this dated effect in place. And if this technology did exist back then... what makes you so certain that Papa Marc wouldn't have embraced it? I'm guessing that the Imagineers would have LOVED the flexibility that real-time digital effects provide. Much of what Yale Gracey worked with, like Pepper's Ghost, was out of necessity, because more advanced technology simply wasn't available. It's amazing what the original Imagineering team pulled off with Mansion, over four decades ago. But geez... enough is enough. As much as I love to champion the artistic integrity of the old school Imagineers, this ain't one of those times. Ghosts on a stick are passe and I'm glad they've been replaced.
Originally Posted By HokieSkipper I completely agree, Skinner. There are times when calling for a return of the ways of the WED geniuses, and then there are times when you need to realize that there are new things that can add to the old ways and do things they never could have dreamed off.
Originally Posted By leobloom I would caution that sometimes the simple effect is more successful. There's such a thing as relying too much on technology for the novelty factor. But not having seen the changes for myself, I can't say if that's the case here or not.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>This is really reaching, even for you. Papa Marc left this world over a decade ago. What are we supposed to do with the theme park designs he and other deceased Disney Imagineering Legends created... let them remain, no matter how dated and uninteresting the ancient technology makes them for current and future plugged-in generations? Ghosts on a stick have become as unconvincing as Everest's bird on a stick. Better technology exists for more entertaining effects. These digital effects did not exist in the late sixties, when ghosts on a stick were constructed. Citing Davis is a lame justification for keeping this dated effect in place. And if this technology did exist back then... what makes you so certain that Papa Marc wouldn't have embraced it? I'm guessing that the Imagineers would have LOVED the flexibility that real-time digital effects provide. Much of what Yale Gracey worked with, like Pepper's Ghost, was out of necessity, because more advanced technology simply wasn't available. It's amazing what the original Imagineering team pulled off with Mansion, over four decades ago. But geez... enough is enough. As much as I love to champion the artistic integrity of the old school Imagineers, this ain't one of those times. Ghosts on a stick are passe and I'm glad they've been replaced.<<< OK, we agree on the fact that the old effect needed replacing, I'll give you that. But this replacement isn't as cogent, or as fitting as it could be. At least have it EMULATE his style...
Originally Posted By TP2000 Lot's of good comments here gang. I agree with EPCOT Explorer's basic thesis that the look of this sight gag doesn't mesh as well as it could with the rest of the Davis designed graveyard stuff. I loved the idea to have the new ghosts look more animatronic at first, and then come to life and swap their beard around and stuff. And yet it's definitely much better than the manequins that were there from the Nixon era. Watching these Youtube videos of the effect, I'm struck with how animated and clearly delighted the other riders are as they realize the ghosts are interacting with them. This is a big hit for the 99.5% of theme park visitors who have no idea who Marc Davis is. While I'm more impressed with the new hitchhikers than I am with that Whack-A-Mole Splash Zone queue they put in, I still can't feel a big smug over the fact that WDW is jumping head first into all this stuff. Let 'em jump! I look forward to the Disneyland version in 2013 or so, after they've run through all the technical problems and artistic mistakes, and then let Kim Irvine and Tony Baxter shepherd the 2.0 release of all these new toys into the Disneyland versions.
Originally Posted By HMButler79 ""Ghosts on a stick have become as unconvincing as Everest's bird on a stick."" Then why, after 40yrs, guests still think they are holograms. REALLY?
Originally Posted By HMButler79 ""release of all these new toys into the Disneyland versions.""" Over the AP/local fan bases dead bodies
Originally Posted By HMButler79 the ORIGINAL WALT DISNEY "pure" Mansion will NOT be turned into an ADHD cartoon. Not in this lifetime.....
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt *roll eyes* Some people take their Disney theme parks waaaaaaay too seriously. lol
Originally Posted By HokieSkipper <<Some people take their Disney theme parks waaaaaaay too seriously.>> Yea, I love the parks...but dang.
