Originally Posted By gadzuux >> Anyone want to guess how many US Military bases we are building in Iraq? << Four. And the military themselves are referring to them as "superbases". Plus the big bloated embassy in baghdad. I agree that bush's intention is to remain ... indefinitely. But I don't think we will. Our presence in iraq is becoming counter-productive for iraq itself. My guess is that iraq will "ask" us to leave. My other guess is that bush won't agree, and all of the pretense about 'sovereign nation' and 'self determination' and 'freedom' will be exposed as just more lies.
Originally Posted By wahooskipper We are still in Turkey how many years after the war? We have soldiers all around the world trying to keep the peace. Why wouldn't we do the same in Iraq?
Originally Posted By Dabob2 <Why wouldn't we do the same in Iraq?> Because they don't want us there? We've left when asked to in the past. The Philippines and Saudi Arabia come to mind. I believe, knowing we would be losing the Saudi bases, that establishing military bases in Iraq was a major reason we went in to begin with. The Project for the New American Century (a who's who of the future Bush admin.) recommended this very thing. Of course, the thinking was that we'd get a compliant Iraqi government when we got rid of Saddam, but not may not end up being the case.
Originally Posted By wahooskipper Yep, they want us out until they need us back in. Fair-weather friends.
Originally Posted By bboisvert <<I believe, knowing we would be losing the Saudi bases,...> This was one of Osama's primary reasons for attacking us on 9/11. We built the bin Sultan Air Base in Saudi Arabia after Gulf War I. That really ticked him off. Having a US base on his Holy Land sent him over the edge, not that he had far to go to begin with. Then after we were warned about it repeatedly, we were attacked on 9/11. We rightly struck back in Afghanastan, then took our eye off the target and moved all of our efforts to Iraq. We all know the story from there... Quietly, a few years ago, Bush closed the bin Sultan Air Base. Just what bin Laden wanted. I believe the other thing that bin laden wanted was a war in a Muslim nation. Hmmm. He got that, too. So much for not negotiating with terrorists, eh? Who has been doing business with the bin Laden family for the better part of 30 years? Who was having dinner with Safig bin Laden on 9/11/01? Who strolls hand in hand with Saudi royalty in the Rose Garden while the Saudi people are made to suffer under one of the most extreme, fundamentalist Islamic dictatorships on the planet?
Originally Posted By YourPalEd The only people, who do that are the known traitors, and terrorists, in the white house. Impeach bush now. It is imperative to impeach him now.
Originally Posted By bboisvert <<Four. And the military themselves are referring to them as "superbases". Plus the big bloated embassy in baghdad. I agree that bush's intention is to remain ... indefinitely. >> According to globalsecurity.org, there are actually 14 "long-term" bases, to be consolidated into 4 mega-bases. ====== <a href="http://www.fcnl.org/iraq/bases_text.htm" target="_blank">http://www.fcnl.org/iraq/bases _text.htm</a> As of mid-2005, the U.S. military had 106 forward operating bases in Iraq, including what the Pentagon calls 14 "enduring" bases - all of which are to be consolidated into four mega-bases. 1) Green Zone (Baghdad) The Green Zone in central Baghdad includes the main palaces of former President Saddam Hussein. The area at one time housed the Coalition Provisional Authority; it still houses the offices of major U.S. consulting companies and the temporary U.S. embassy facilities. 2) Camp Anaconda (Balad Airbase) Camp Anaconda is a large U.S. logistical base near Balad. The camp is spread over 15 square miles and is being constructed to accommodate 20,000 soldiers. 3) Camp Taji (Taji) Camp Taji, former Iraqi Republican Guard "military city," is now a huge U.S. base equipped with a Subway, Burger King and Pizza Hut on the premises. 4) Camp Falcon-Al-Sarq (Baghdad) In late September 2003, the 439th Engineering Battalion delivered over 100,000 tons of gravel and is assisting with building roads, walls, guard towers, and buildings for Camp Falcon. Camp Falcon is planned to house 5,000 soldiers. 5) Post Freedom (Mosul) Saddam Hussein's former palace in Mosul is currently home to the 101st Airborne Division. 6) Camp Victory- Al Nasr (Baghdad Airfield) Camp Victory is a U.S. Army base situated on airport grounds about 5 kilometers from Baghdad International Airport. The base can house up to 14,000 troops. Al Faw Palace on Camp Victory is surrounded by a man-made lake and serves as an unofficial conference center for the Army. 7) Camp Marez (Mosul Airfield) Located at an airfield southwest of Mosul, Camp Marez has a tent dining capacity for 500. In December 2004, a suicide bomber killed himself and 13 U.S. soldiers at the base's dining tent. 8) Camp Renegade (Kirkuk) Strategically located near the Kirkuk oil fields and the Kirkuk refinery and petrochemical plant, Camp Renegade has a dormitory that houses up to 1,664 airmen in 13 buildings with six to eight people to a room. 9) Camp Speicher (Tikrit) Named after F/A-18 pilot Michael "Scott" Speicher who was shot down during the first Gulf War in 1991, Camp Speicher is located near Tikrit in northern Iraq, approximately 170 kilometers north of Baghdad. 10) Camp Fallujuh (Rail Station?) The exact whereabouts and name of this base is unknown. Analysts believe that the U.S. is building an "enduring base" in Fallujah, a large town forty miles west of Baghdad. Fallujah has proved to be the most violence prone area in Iraq. Between early April 2004, when Marines halted their first offensive against the city, and November 2004, when the city was "re-taken" from insurgents, Fallujuh was a no-go area with numerous murders and bombings. 11) Unknown name (Nasiriyah) The exact whereabouts and name of this base is unknown. Analysts believe that the U.S. is building an "enduring base" near Nasiriyah, a provincial capital of South-East Iraq on the Euphrates River. 12) Unknown name (between Irbil and Kirkuk) 13) Unknown 14) Unknown
Originally Posted By YourPalEd You'd think they could build at least one disney amusement park to entertain all those gi's. It would probably cost only a tenth of what one of those bases cost.
Originally Posted By JohnS1 Impeach Ed now. It is imperative! Oh wait, he's not an elected official. Funny, he talks like he's king.
Originally Posted By planodisney bush has done NOTHING to be impeached for, and any and all talk of it is a sure sign of a bonafide left wing cook!!!
Originally Posted By Jim in Merced CA Perhaps I don't know my American history very well, but can anyone tell me when the American public approved of a war? War is never something that is 'popular' -- or was there across-the-board enthusiasm for and approval of 'The War Between The States.'
Originally Posted By Jim in Merced CA During World War II, American rallied around the cause, but it was a different message back then. Buy bonds! Conserve energy! Cut back on usage of key products! Build warplanes! Enlist in the Armed Forces! Here in 2006, we're in a war, and yet the message is, 'go out for dinner, take a vacation to Walt Disney World, and spend money.'
Originally Posted By vbdad55 <Isn’t being a republican enough? AL FRANKEN in 2008!!!< I'd vote for Frank N furter before Al Franken -- let's do the time warp again !
Originally Posted By gadzuux >> War is never something that is 'popular' << The iraqi war is different from other wars. For one thing - it's an elective "war of choice". For another, it's unnecessary. Bush will try as hard as he can to tie it to 9/11, but he can't - he just said as much this week. We stand to gain nothing from this war - not greater security, not lower gas prices, not a US friendly democracy in the middle east - nothing. On the other hand, we lose a lot, hundreds of billions of dollars, thousands dead, tens of thousands gravely wounded, loss of respect from other nations, and the middle east in flames. It's a stupid pointless war against a nation that never attacked us, never even threatened to attack us, and couldn't even if they wanted to. So it's not a question of "popular", but more an issue about "return on investment". There's absolutely nothing to gain for US interests, it's a drain on our economy, it does nothing to respond to the people who actually did attack us (remember him?), and it's a bloodbath of violence and death. Why would anyone support this?
Originally Posted By YourPalEd One reason to support it, would be if you owned a large percentage of the carlyle group, which basically owns, haliburton, and those british oil firms, and construction companies, plus arab oil in egypt, saudi arabia? Whatever happened to egypt? I remember before my mom died years ago, she had a heck of a time going to israel and egypt on the same trip. The egyptians, would not allow an israeli passport stamp, back in 72 or 74. So, my mom, and dad visited the pyramids, first, and then went to israel.
Originally Posted By ecdc "Perhaps I don't know my American history very well, but can anyone tell me when the American public approved of a war?" That'd be usually never. World War II is the exception, and usually cited as the one "just" war. But until Japan bombed Pearl Harbor, Americans were very much opposed to involvement. You know station WGN in Chicago? It was founded in the 1930s as an anti-war radio station. Poll after poll showed Americans did not want to get involved and, while sympathetic to the plight of the Jews, only a tiny percentage favored loosening immigration laws to allow Jews safe haven in America. The Revolutionary War and the Civil War are typically too different to compare to more modern wars, for obvious reasons. World War I was very divisive, and most Americans did not support it. Korea was and still is "The Forgotten War". It certainly wasn't popular but also didn't generate the divisiveness that Vietnam would later generate. There's no question that there's many, many differences between Iraq and Vietnam. But as much as the right hates to admit it, there's also comparisons. It's an unpopular war with no exit strategy and it appears increasingly that we're fighting an enemy that cannot and will not be defeated. We're headed for stalemate in Iraq and the only option is to train Iraqis as best we can and get out.
